OldGreyEagle

If I had access to an extension code, I would be using it for my CPAP machine and give myself and neighbors the gift of a silent night

In the Tower, can't you still see the blood of Ann Boylen on the bricks?

From the Ad on the BSA Scout Stuff web page on the new uniform it says: http://www.scoutstuff.org/BSASupply/info.aspx?page=bsauniformmain "Transitional pieces to mix and match with your current uniform." Sounds to me like the new and present uniforms may be worn together. If there is one thing I have learned in Scouting, its not to beleive a whole bunch of what I get told, but to see what is in writing, and them to verify if possible. And beyond that, what will happen if a scouter mixes parts and its determined that they should not? Heck, we have people running around in jeans and people think its ok. I love the slogan "Get it On, Get Out" I just wish I didnt have T.Rex's lyrics running around inside my head every time I see it

I wanted to ask this question but didnt want to get the other thread off topic too much more lets say BSA enacts a "Local Option", Chartering Organizations are responsible for adult leader selection. Because the Chartering Organization is doing the selection, they become soley responsible for the deeds/missdeeds of their leaders. If they want a gay or atheist leader its up to them. Can such a thing be done? The BSA gets sued when an heterosexual appearing father of 4 gets caught molesting boys when the BSA never knew anything about the man other than he passed the background check (because he hadnt been caught as yet)What does happen to the Chartering Organization? Do they get sued? How much in comparison to the BSA? Maybe the current system stays in place except for Chartering Organizations that want the ability to allow Gay and Atheist members. Could a contract be written that takes the legal liability off the BSA and on the Chartering Organization? I realize this goes against the Best Citizen statement but I am trying to understand possibilities

Then there is Hawk Mountain http://www.hmsr.org/ it's off Interstate 78 just before you get to Cabels's comming out of Allentown. I have been to Goose Pond,(the Dinning Hall is a treat) Ockanickon, Tuckahoe and driven by Ressica Falls many times on the way up to Pecks Pond. The eastern part of PA is crawling with scout camps.(This message has been edited by OldGreyEagle)

There are the two Council Camps of Minsi Trails Council. Part of the Council is in New jersey and its headquartered in Allentown, PA http://www.minsitrails.com/camping/BoyScout/CampMinsi/camp_minsi.asp http://www.minsitrails.com/camping/boyscout/camptrexler/settlers_camp.asp They may be worth looking into

Never did like Brussel Sprouts, does that make me Belgiumianophobic?

Are you talking Delaware Water Gap or Cape May?

"Och, everyone knows that haggis is eaten with Scotch!" With Scotch you say? That would explain how haggis gets eaten at all

Emb021, close but not quite http://www.robertsrules.com/faq.html#11 Must debate on a motion stop immediately as soon as any member calls the question? Answer: It is a fairly common misconception that, after debate has continued for some time, if any member shouts out "Question!" or "I call the question!", debate must immediately cease and the chair must put the pending question to a vote. This is simply not the case. Any member who wishes to force an end to debate must first obtain the floor by being duly recognized to speak by the chair, and must then move the Previous Question. Such a motion must be seconded, and then adopted by a two-thirds vote, or by unanimous consent. It is not in order to interrupt a speaker with cries of "Question" or "Call the Question," and even if no one is speaking, it is still necessary to seek recognition. [RONR (10th ed.), p. 193-94; see also p 35-37 of RONR In Brief.] Sorry guys, the high school I attended taught Roberts Rules of Order as part of the Speech Curriculum. I had no idea my education was that different than yours. I had a foundation in Roberts Rules and honed it during my time with the Professional Society. I graduated High School in 1971, maybe that has something to do with it. But if its not taught amymore, or ever, why would we want to follow it?

hey Bobby Burns, you want some haggis with your whine?

Ah, but emb021, that assumes that all attendees to the meeting know and understand Roberts Rules and will follow them. In a past thread I asked about the educational level of BSA training materials, with Roberts Rules I dont think its an educational issue as much as an experience issue. I was quite active in my professional society for awhile and got well versed in Roberts Rules by attending multiple state meetings. But I am not so sure that in the current District Committee's 15-20 regular attendees could identify when to use or what "Call the Question" means. They know its a procedural thing, but not exactly what. When the Crew first formed, the youth wanted to use Roberts Rules to run the meetings, we had a few sessions on how to d that, Roberts Rules are not taught in High School much anymore I gather. Roberts Rules are great, but they have to be understood by all in the meeting as well.

EASL English As a Second Language, although in this case, I guess it would be AASL, American As a Second Language Thats ok Eamonn, I fancy Gold Winger feaures himself as a fly by wit, much as I sometimes do and not all fly bys hit the mark.

Let me point at at this time, that having a scouting unit sponsored by the "Friends of Troop 65" meet in Public School No 19 is a whole heck of a lot different than having Public School No 19 being the Chartering organization. Friends of Troop 65 can discriminate as a private organization, and can meet in public buildings as long as other private groups also are allowed to meet in the public building. If Public School 19 is the Chartering organization, then the Institutional Head of the Organization, whether principal, vice-principal or whomever has to apply the BSA memebrship standards to adults and members. A Public School, as a public institution may not discriminate against protected groups, yet the BSA membership requirements require just that, discrimination and I have to add, not that discrimination is a bad thing, its just a thing the Public School cant do.

In many countries, so I have been told, the necker is the one thing that is retained as scoutlike, than again, just because other countries do it doesnt mean we have to Then again, the necker is optional, right?

A few things You say the group was large and you can see the counselor missing this scout not doing the exercise. I would alert the Camp Director that this happened and that the class size is too large. I beleive there is something in the Advancement Policies and Procedure book about summer camp merit badges. Instruction may be done in a group, but testing is not a group activity, thats number one. You say you questioned the boy after being told separately that the boy did not do the exercise by three other boys. One tactic is to tell the three that you talked to the suspect and he denies it and since you didnt see the act, or non-act there is little you can do and see if the three can exert any peer pressure on the youth. Then again, you could schedule a troop swim and have all the boys who passed swimming merit badge at camp demonstrate how to inflate clothes. How is the accused otherwise? When told of his mis deeds, were you surprised? Not shocked? What about the other boys, what is their history?

As far as I know, although I've never seen the BSA Rules and Regulations. (sic) , there is no prohibition of having two (2) count them 2 or more Venture Patrols. You then have an Assistant Senior Patrol Leader responsible for Venture Patrols, that can be the leader Keep Venturing and their uniform parts out of it to confuse the issues

Pack, are you saying that there are plenty of people who would let their sons camp with Gay adult leaders? If so, then fine, the BSA would allow that mirroring the make-up of society Gold Winger so you would be ok with gay leaders as well, as selcted by the CO, Kewl

I have an idea. Let's kick it around, that that will be a challenge. We have the BSA allow gays to be adult members. A Chartering Organization advertises that it has the first gay scoutmaster in the Council. How many youth do they recruit on School Night? I think most families are like Gonzo, there is no way that he would let his son go camping with gay adults. I think most of the country would agree. I don't think there is a market for Gay lead troops, it would be interesting to try. "gay" lead troops would spring up I am sure, but how long would they last? I don't think most would make the first recharter. Then the gay issue disappears, yeah we tried it and the boys and families dont join, and the country moves on.

Aw c'mon now Pecos Bill dug the Grand Canyon to hold water for his cattle.

I understand the consternation about signing that we would abide by the Rules and Regulations of the BSA and so therefore we should be privy to what is written in them. But before we the townspeople organize a torchlight parade down to Irving, how many of us know about scouters who had their BSA membership revoked because he/she did not follow the BSA Rules and Regulations? What did the person do and what was the response.

Just to be clear, or to muddy the waters. whatever, but, homosexuality does not equal pedaphilia any more than heterosexuality determines that a person cannot be a pedaphiliac.

Ya know Acco, given you took you 2 months to reply, pardon me if i am not awed by the aclarity of your razor sharp wit

let it never be said I am afraid to evaluate my position. A very long time ago, like 1953, my father bought a house in the western suburbs of Chicago. Some of the Chicago area people may be familiar with it. Wood Dale, on Irving Park (Il Rte 19) between Itasca and Bensenville, DuPage County. It was a great neighborhood, many mature oaks were left standing as well as hickory trees and it had a County Forest preserve at the end. A great place to grow up. Across the street the lots were bordered by Salt Creek, a waterway familiar to many in the western suburbs. Salt creek drains the northwestern suburbs of Chicago and in the 50's and 60's the northwest suburbs were virtually non-exisitent, instead huge fields of corn and soybeans were grown along the flight paths leading to O'Hare Field. Then things changed. Hoffman Estates, Schaumburg began unprecidented growth. The WoodField Shopping center which was the largest indoor mall in the country when it opened, opended within a mile of the creek. Hundreds of acres of farmland which used to soak in the rain was paved over. Salt Creek became the drainage system of the Northwest suburbs, and used Salt Creek to drain it into the western suburbs. Within a few years having the creek flow over its banks stopped being a rare instance to expected every time it rained and then came real devastating floods. Today, most of the houses on the creek side of the street I grew up are gone and the property is a city park. I do remember people saying then that they had no sympathy for people who built in a flood plain, but most of the houses were built long before the area became a flood plain. We didnt build in a flood plain, the people upstream created a flood plain. So, I guess in retrospect, if you live in an area which historically is not flood prone, and upstream developments turn your area into a flood plain I can see that as different than building in an area which is known to be a flood plain. Communities that build higher and stronger levees to push the water south need to have insurance, not just for them, but for the consequences of their actions downstream. Oh boy, this whole thing could get quite complicated. My right to do with property as I see fit and the effects on people downstream whose land has been in their families for generations who never had a proplem. this living together in a community is a real bite

Ah, but John, would that not require the BSA to assure all denominations had a religious medal to be earned? What of the Wiccans who were shut down in their attempt to establish a religious recognition? Unitarian scouts?