Scouter99

Just out of curiosity, how did you end up in this unit? Has it always just been crummy and you didn't know til you showed up? Did they trick you with a glitzy open house?

"Frankly, I would think that the best assumption would be that the trained SM would have a better grip on what is proper over most parents." SM/ASM and Troop Committee training is a joke and does not cover the nuances--much less basics--of the Guide to Advancement. Our committee and ASM corps are 100% trained (council mandate for recharter) and I am regularly accused of making things up and/or "my way or highway" because I am the only person in the unit who has read the GtA, UIG, GtSS, SM Handbook, etc. Troop Committee Challenge is literally a joke, and SM/ASM training is not much better. Fully trained leaders, even veterans, leave training sessions and online sessions basically ignorant. For example, our Committee Chair literally emailed the District Adv committee to confirm after I said that ASMs cannot sit on BoRs, and the guy has been trained, trained, trained. He's not a special idiot, the other 7 trained ASMs and committee sitting in the room didn't believe me, either. I saw a statistic somewhere the other week (some Wood Badge-related thing, probably something Kudu posted) that said some [astounding/confounding] percentage of WB participants had never even read the SM Handbook. "Trained SMs" are, as I've said, in my experience, ignorant and proud of it. Take JoeBob--completely insulted that I and others say SMs are ignorant and egotistical, yet just a couple months ago when he included pistols (which are not allowed) in his ideal Boy Scout camp, he went ballistic when I pointed it out, demanded evidence, and upon receiving it called the policy stupid and advanced circumventing the policy with registration fraud. Yeah, mea culpa for calling SMs egotistical and ignorant. There is no doubt that Myboy is giving us only his/her side of the story, and it is entirely possible (and maybe even probable) that there are missing details that vindicate the SM. But all we have is Myboy's side, and that's all I can comment on. The SM cannot hold the boy accountable to a participation caveat after the fact. That doesn't mean that I think Eagle medals should be handed out like candy, it means that I hold the SM as accountable to regulation as I do the boy.

Yep, find a different pack, let her be queen of nothing if that's what she wants.

Unfortunately, my experience with SMs as both a youth and adult is of ignorance and ego as described by Myboy. There's a book--a few, actually--with 90% of this stuff in it. My opinion in my troop is always the minority and written off as "my way or highway" because I am literally the only person who has ready any of these books. The SM handbook, the PL and SPL HB, the Guide to Adv., and the Guide to SS, etc. Every one of these threads is situational, and this SM is ignorant--willfully or inadvertently, it doesn't matter--and his position is wrong. I don't care about his intentions, I don't care about his heart: He's wrong. He is either wrong on purpose, or he is wrong because he is no good at his job, whichever, same difference. If he's wrong because he's unfamiliar with the GtA, his heart isn't in it. If he's wrong because he refuses to abide by the GtA, his heart isn't in it. Next week someone might come around to pan their SM and if they're wrong and the SM is right I'll be right there by the SM. But in this situation, taking Myboy at face, the SM is a heel. You'll have to pardon me for not assuming that the OP is a liar, BD.

I donno, BD, sounds like your chance to get in early and make the big bucks down the line.

Let's look at it this way: Mazzuca was paid 34 cents per member. Garibay was paid $4.31 per member.

This thread has apparently outlasted the Spiral Scouts since their website is locked-down with "unauthorized to view" messages even for the home page.

That's a great summer camp price.

The local council is responsible for supplying the medals (unless they got cheap and switched to patches, or got really cheap and offer neither) to the parks, so you should start by calling the Michigan councils.

To round out the convo, what were the requirements at the time?

That's a political question. If the CoH is the Eagle's responsibility in your troop as in mine and Sent, Q, and Pack's troops, of course you could technically have one. But if going over the SM's head sours people to your son, then what you're really asking is if anyone will cooperate. We can't answer that because we don't know the personalities involved.

It's my schtick.

Definitely down. I had no idea they hosted sites here.

Yeah, and if you don't deposit/"recharge" at least $1000 onto them every month you get dinged with this and that fee.

Again, Rick, as gay writer/editor Karl Andersson has explained in his book Gay Man's Worst Friend, your knee-jerk assumption that any criticism of homosexuals=charges of pedophilia is the result of several decades' effort to dissociate homosexuals from their proclivity to youth as a culture obsessed with sex. If you're comfortable subverting documented (by gays) history to politics, more power to ya (everyone else does it).

I think the CC and AC are overthinking it.

Unfortunately, my experience with SMs as both a youth and adult is of ignorance and ego as described by Myboy. There's a book--a few, actually--with 90% of this stuff in it. My opinion in my troop is always the minority and written off as "my way or highway" because I am literally the only person who has ready any of these books. The SM handbook, the PL and SPL HB, the Guide to Adv., and the Guide to SS, etc. Every one of these threads is situational, and this SM is ignorant--willfully or inadvertently, it doesn't matter--and his position is wrong. I don't care about his intentions, I don't care about his heart: He's wrong. He is either wrong on purpose, or he is wrong because he is no good at his job, whichever, same difference. If he's wrong because he's unfamiliar with the GtA, his heart isn't in it. If he's wrong because he refuses to abide by the GtA, his heart isn't in it. Next week someone might come around to pan their SM and if they're wrong and the SM is right I'll be right there by the SM. But in this situation, taking Myboy at face, the SM is a heel. The question is irrelevant, NCMount. The boy's PoR period ended 4 months ago and has been signed off. If the SM had an issue with the scout's performance, the time (as spelled out in the GtA) to address it was at least 8 months ago.

Any/every city/town will have an embroidery place or 7 that could do this. Heck, you can buy your own embroidery machine at a fabric store.

Unfortunately, my experience with SMs as both a youth and adult is of ignorance and ego as described by Myboy. There's a book--a few, actually--with 90% of this stuff in it. My opinion in my troop is always the minority and written off as "my way or highway" because I am literally the only person who has ready any of these books. The SM handbook, the PL and SPL HB, the Guide to Adv., and the Guide to SS, etc. Every one of these threads is situational, and this SM is ignorant--willfully or inadvertently, it doesn't matter--and his position is wrong. I don't care about his intentions, I don't care about his heart: He's wrong. He is either wrong on purpose, or he is wrong because he is no good at his job, whichever, same difference. If he's wrong because he's unfamiliar with the GtA, his heart isn't in it. If he's wrong because he refuses to abide by the GtA, his heart isn't in it. Next week someone might come around to pan their SM and if they're wrong and the SM is right I'll be right there by the SM. But in this situation, taking Myboy at face, the SM is a heel.

Like I said, TCD, your adult situation is not the same as this boy's situation. But as a mature young man, he's got decisions to make on his own.

What Q said. Twocubdad's son is an adult and professors can do whatever they want. Your son is not an adult and scoutmasters cannot do whatever they want, and this scoutmaster is out of line. If your son doesn't mind playing the SM's games, then that's that. If he does mind, like Q said, he'll just have to call the council and start the appeal process. My 17-yr-old self would have hit reply all and let the SM know that he does not have the authority to do what he's doing but that I'm a reasonable guy and will camp 3 more times in addition to the a,b,c,d,e,f,g,h,i,j,k,l,m activities that I had already participated in, and wished he'd been there to see how active I am.

Rick, if you're familiar with my knowledge in the area, then you will also recall that I have very plainly said that homosexuality and pedophilia are not the same. The fact is that from the moment homosexuals began to become organized, they did not "end up in youth groups" they organized around youth groups to effect their vision. Their attraction to pubescent boys is not, by definition, pedophilia, it is simply homosexuality. And every Ineligibility File that involves a scout over the age of 12 is not a file about pedophilia, but a file about a homosexual, from the troop in Louisiana founded by a group of gay men specifically to get access to young men to the one-off crimes of opportunity. Every movement tries to capture youth, this is the only one whose end is to have sex with them.

There's a good history of homosexual activism in youth groups and other institutions in the book Toward Stonewall here: http://books.google.com/books?id=0qjwZeKNyh4C&lpg=PP1&dq=toward%20stonewall&pg=PA153#v=onepage&q=toward%20stonewall&f=false