wildhog

Thanks for the response Gunny. We've had several people try to deal with Scout1's dad but I haven't seen any changes. He's trying to live through his son instead of letting Scout1 do his own thing. Dad was close to Eagle but never made it so now Scout1 is expected to succeed. I really get the impression that Scout1 is just doing his time to get to Eagle and then he will quit. It will probably come as no surprise that he has advanced further than the other two. Scout3 is officially Second Class but has finished the requirements for First Class; he just needs his SM Conf and BOR. But I am hesitant to pass him off; on the one hand he's definitely not showing Scout Spirit most of the time but on the other hand there are times when he is really participating and having a good time. The social structure at school is what bugs me the most. Scout3 is never going to be a leader (Scouting or otherwise) because he always falls into the pattern of following whoever the "cool" person is at the time. I'm sure when there aren't any uncool kids around that he gets picked on because of his follower mentality. I've talked with Scout3's mom several times but the person that she describes is nothing like the boy who shows up for meetings and outings. I'd like to have the Scout3 from her house show up to a meeting at least once. I don't think his parents give very much discipline at home; I certainly have not seen any changes in his behavior after speaking with his parents. He certainly seems to have more leeway than some of the other boys his age. I really think it's this is the school situation spilling over because we've had no problems with any other Scouts fitting into the Troop; it's just these three. And I think they need more guidance than a weekly Scout meeting can give them. I can't change what happens at school but I would like to prevent it from coming into the Troop. Compounding this is that whenever I talk to these boys they always tell me what they think I want to hear instead of being open. Wildhog

Hello again everybody. My Troop is getting ready to gear up again now that the school year is starting. I want to hit the ground running and get off to a good start but I would like to hear from you about three of my Scouts. I have three Scouts who do not want to be Boy Scouts. I will call them Scout1, Scout2, and Scout3. They are all going into 8th grade and attend the same school. Scout1 does the bare minimum to advance but he participates and I see him as a good asset to the Troop. He is a good kid but the only reason he is in Scouting is because of his father. Dad is enthusiastic about Scouting, enjoyed his experience as a Scout, but has absolutely no idea how to interact with the Scouts and is a constant source of embarrassment for Scout1. He was also the WEBELOS Den Leader for all three boys. Scout2 comes to meetings and seems to have a good time. I haven't heard him complain but he has told his parents that he wants to quit. I recently got his father involved as the ASM for first year Scouts. Scout2 went on our high adventure with his dad this last summer and I think generally has a good time. Scout3 does not want to be a Boy Scout and constantly reminds everyone of that. He has stated to the other Scouts that his mom makes him come. Often he half-heartedly participates and can be counted on to be sitting off to the side when everyone is participating in an activity. For one outing last year he was planning to buy the food for his patrol but when he found out that Scout1 and Scout2 were not coming he refused to buy food and tried to get out of the outing. His parents made him come and he refused to ride in the van with the rest of his patrol; instead he rode with the first year Scouts and his father was driving. This last summer camp started off the same way but then he became more engaged when the older Scouts helped him with some advancement. His brother is a first year Scout and is the complete opposite; actually practicing knots at home so he would be ready to tie them at a meeting. Whenever these three Scouts are together on an outing they are inseparable; if Scout3 is not present then the other two will interact with the rest of the Troop otherwise these three form their little clique. I know from talking with parents that their grade at school has some major issues; there are the "cool" kids and then the rest. This seems to be reinforced by the "cool" parents. The "cool" kids have made it clear that Scouting is not cool and I believe that this attitude is spilling over into the Troop. Have any of you dealt with a situation like this? This has been one of my biggest challenges as Scoutmaster. Thanks Wildhog

I'm not sure what to do with one of my ASMs. First a little background; he joined the troop a year and a half ago when his son crossed over and he was the WEBELOS leader for that den that crossed over. He was a Scout in his youth but did not make Eagle. He's very enthusiastic but doesn't seem to "get" the program. About a year ago he held a Metalwork Merit Badge clinic; which the boys who participated in it loved. But he Troop ended up spending hundreds of dollars more than he budgeted for and we ended up with alot of equipment that we do not need; safety glasses, gloves, etc. He has also purchased MB books and other BSA literature that he then asked the Troop to pay for (even though we have a library). Often times he shows up at meetings and outings with activities for the Scouts to do when the PLC already had other things planned. Basically he does things without asking or thinking things through. What concerns me more is some of the things he said/did at summer camp. To start with he made letters that spell out our troop number out of sticks, each letter is about 1 foot by 2 feet. Again, without asking or telling anyone. He came up to camp at mid week in time for dinner. Afterwards he proceded to clean all of the cooking gear that his son's patrol was using. Another Scout was going to help by cleaning one of the Dutch ovens. The ASM harshly scolded this scout for attempting to put soap in the Dutch oven. The ASM also complained loudly and in front of Scouts that a certain Scout always seemed to disappear when it was his turn for clean-up; then he said it again. On the last night our ASPL came up to me before the closing campfire to say that another Scout had taken off his uniform shirt and turned it inside out. Before I could say anything the ASM said "What are you telling him for, don't you know this is a boy run organization?" in a strong tone and then let out a chuckle. On Friday at lunch I asked the boys if they wanted to come back to this camp next summer or if they wanted to go somewhere else. One patrol unanimously decided to return; the ASM's son's patrol was noncomittal (ASM kept telling me which camp we should go to while I was talking to these boys). When I asked those boys again on Saturday they said it didn't matter where they just wanted to go to summer camp, so I signed us up again for next year. On Friday night when the Scout families were visiting the ASM told them that we were not coming back to that camp next year. He's been through all of the trainings and can recite all of the Patrol Method mantra; but when it comes to practicing those principles he falls short. His stance on "boy run" only seems to apply when he does not want to deal with something; like discipline and that is when the youth leaders ask for guidance the most. I left some other things out but I think you get the idea about this ASM. I really question how much his son wants to be in Scouting, the feeling I get is that ASM is trying to relive his experience as a Scout. He's pushing his son to advance, the camp he suggested is where he went to summer camp. Has anyone else dealt with a leader like this? I'm tempted to ask his wife how she deals with him at home. Thanks WildHog Go SpeedGoats!

We got to the bottom of the whole situation last night. It turns out that Harry was just tired of Scott poking everyone with the walking stick and Scott was also throwing rocks. So Harry decided to take matter into his own hands and threw the stick into the woods and then into the lake. It was almost humorous to watch the look on Scott's mom's face when Harry told her that that's all there was to it and that Scott had not been entirely truthful when he admitted to throwing rocks. Apparently Scott told his mom that Harry was looking for revenge for something that Scott did to Harry's sister years ago and that Harry picked on him for no reason. Unfortunately both boys have decided to quit the Troop. Scott's mom cites that Scott has been continually picked on since he joined and summer camp was the last straw. The truth is that he has never made any attempt to try and fit in and has picked on the other Scouts himself. My opinion is that he has been manipulating his mom all along to make things sound worse than they were so she would let him quit. He really did not want to be in Scouts and would rather be playing sports. Harry was never really invested in the program either. He was always screwing around (not maliciously, just looking for attention). I never like to see any boys quit but I have to say that Scott's patrol always seemed to function better when he didn't come on an outing. What disappoints me the most is the way both parties handled the situation. Harry for not coming to an adult and Scott's famlily for not coming to me at camp on Friday night. Instead they made a snap judgement that Scott was the victim and accused everyone else of wrongdoing. The part I find both amusing and sad is that Scott's mom is in charge of training (leadership, conflict resolution, etc.)for her employer. Thanks for all of your responses. WildHog "Go SpeedGoats!"

Scott is 12 and going into 7th grade. Harry is 14 and going into 9th grade. They both attended the same school until now, Harry is going to high school in the fall.

Hi all. This is my first post so please bear with me. I am looking for some feedback on fallout I'm dealing with from my Troop's week at summer camp. Here's the situation. We have a Scout, Scott, who told his mother that he is the victim of bullying. When Scott's family came up for family night on Friday night he was in tears saying that he wanted them to take him home. On Thursday I sat down with most of the Scouts individually, inculding Scott, just to see how the week was going; he said everything was fine and there were no problems. His mom makes it sound like it's him against the whole Troop but when I asked she mentioned the problem is with one individual. She is absolutly convinced that this other Scout,Harry who is two years older, is going to physically harm Scott. We have had other issues with Scott in the past. At the beginning of the year I sat down with Scott's mom because he complained that he was being picked on. When I talked to the other Scouts they said that he was picking on them and they were reacting to that. When confronted, Scott said he was reacting to the other Scouts. So we ended up in a "blame spiral" that resolved nothing. Since that got us nowhere I told the Scouts it was time for a clean slate. We're going to forget about all the stuff that happened before and Scott and the other Scouts were going to start over from scratch. Scott never came to me or any of the other adults at camp to say he was being bullied. Everything I heard was second or third hand information. The only incident I heard of was that Scott's walking stick had been thrown into the woods and he accused Harry of doing it. Harry denied it when I talked to him and when another adult talked to him. All that being said, and after talking with the other adults at camp, nobody picked on other Scouts more than Scott did. He intentionally soiled other Scout's uniforms, he threw a cup of water at another Scout ("for the fun of it" in his own words), he routinely ignored the youth leaders and his camp duties. I could go on but I think you get the idea. I'm disappointed that his mother did not bring up the issue with Harry while everyone was still at camp and so far I have only dealt with his mother. My next step is to get Scott and his parents and Harry and his parents together with some other Troop leaders and find out what's going on. I appologize for the length of this post but any ideas, feedback, etc. I can get from you guys would be greatly appreciated. I think it always helps to have other points of view. Thanks WildHog "GO SpeedGoats!"