Bob White

When all else fails have him read the advancement reference "Advancement Committee Policies and Procedures".

$3 for insurance? Are you sure? It was my understanding that councils are now paying for insurance, I know ours does and so do the councils that adjoin us. Even before they did, the cost was never more than $1.25. Is this something your troop is doing on their own NJ? As far as Boys Life, I have not heard any mention of a price increase. It wouldn't bother me if they did, at $9 I think it is one of the best values as far as publications go.

That's really a local problem Twocubdad, and not of national's doing. National released this news several months ago to the councils. It has not been a secret. You are probably hearing more talk about it now becasuse units chartering the first of the year when this takes effect are just getting their charter kits. I know our District roundtables announced it in the Spring when handing out the Annual Program Planning kits. Bob White

Where the testing falls apart in MBUs and also in many summer camps is in group testing. Merit badges must include individual testing for each applicants on every requirement. All too often if a requirement says "tell" one applicant tells and everyone else nods their head and all othem get credit for the requirement. Or the requirement says to "show" and one or two applicants demonstrate and everyone gets credit. Plus A big part of the Merit Badge program is the growth in socail and communication skills gathered by the scout as he learns to contact and deal with the various counselors. All that is cut out in the MBU. Bob White(This message has been edited by Bob White)

I would have no problems with Merit badge Universities if they only taught the information. Where I have have a problem is in the quality of the testing. I like the idea of the scouts seeing others working toward MBs and in our council it is held on a university campus which I think is a great opportunity for motivating scouts to continue their educational pursuits. I have seen several different MBUs. I only wish I could say that I've seen any of them done properly. Bob

A Schrade Old Timer

The bowline was used originally as a loop at the end of a mooring line commonly thrown from the bow of a boat. (or so I was taught) Bob

The bowline was used originally as a loop at the end of a mooring line commonly thrown from the bow of a boat. (or so I was taught) Bob

Several months ago a task force was put together by the Boy Scout Training Division to investigate possible changes at all levels of junior leader training. The head of the task force (a volunteer) met with several scouts and scouters at Philmont this last summer. He also had a discussion group on the Internet that lasted for several months. It is quite likely that other things were done to gather info and opinions but those are the only aspects I was involved in. The input is now being compiled and whatever is determined will likely be field tested first, then reviewed again before a national release. At least that is the normal track these things take. Hope this helps, Bob White(This message has been edited by Bob White)

I have never heard of a council charging a registration fee or do I think it is allowable. I would also not want to see a required popcorn sale or other forced fundraiser. The way scouting is financed is certainly not the most efficient or easiest way to raise the needed funds but easy isnt always better. The methods used by scouting have always been based on voluntary participation. I think the BSA wants people in the communities across the country to support the growth and continuation of scouting out of personal choice. They want people to donate because it is the right thing to do, not because it is the required thing to do. Another reason is that many families, especially those with multiple family members in scouting, could not afford to be members. Looking at the big picture, I think there are many valuable character and citizenship lessons to be learned by youth and adults by the way we finance scouting. My parents taught my brothers and me that we are personally responsible for the quality of the communities we live in. Being allowed to choose to support scouting, whether through personal effort or personal finance or both, helps develop and exercise that responsibility. Scouts make the choice whether to sell popcorn, a unit makes the choice to host a Friends of Scouting, An adult chooses whether to donate funds, the United Way chooses what best serves their community. Scouting continues to develop young people because the community wants to support scouting, not because they have to. Bob White

Make that the Charter Org. Executive (I was was heading out the door for a Tiger Den Leader course and didn't see the error till I returned. Bob(This message has been edited by Bob White)

This is the first registration increase in the BSA in 14 years. I cannot think of ANYTHING that has held its cost for that long. Bob

The job responsibilities of the unit trainer are taught in the Committee training for the programs. the trainer is a committee member and may earn the same recognitions as the other committee people. Bob

Eamonn, The Charter Org.G. Executive is not a registered positon in the BSA so for them to be a committee member is not a duplication. Bob

read the guide to safe scouting there are other behaviors besides homosexuality that would keep a child or adult from being able to hold membership in in scouting. what Nj said was exactly my point. It was inferred that scouting was for all children and it is not. Scouting has always had membership requirements that excluded some children from participation. Age,sex,religion etc. If a town has only one troop and that troop is sponsored by a Methodist church and they want to serve the eligible members of their church then the only kids in town who will get boy scouting are Methodist boys ages 11 to 18 who meet the value standards of the BSA. Just because you have a group of 3 million children doesn't meen you have a group of 3 million potential scouts. Some portion of that is female under 14 some are children over 18, some are under 7 some have no interest in scouting. My main point was the number in question is irrelevant to the argument of membership. We are a private organization and have never served the enter youth population. For decades we didn't serve boys under 12. It was deccades later before girls 14 and over were added. Our membership has changed to better meet our mission and aims. It has not changed due to moral or religious shifts in the population. I would not expect future membership changes to occur for those reasons either. Scouting in the USA is what the BSA's national executive board of volunteers says it is, not some rude, naybob who says scouting should change because he says it should change. Bob White

Good job fboisseau, I like the way you grabbed the job and ran with it. To answer Eamonn, the primary role of the pack trainer is to see that all adult volunteers are encouraged to attend training, have information on available training and that htey see the fast start Video as soon as posible. The next level of the job would be to attend Trainer Development/BSA 500 and develop yourself as a trainer so that you can deliver the basic units of training within your own unit. How this is handled varies from council to council and district to district, so contact your district or council training chairperson. Bob White(This message has been edited by Bob White)

I agree with everything Lightcrow wrote with one exception. I don't think it requires written bylaws to determine if the role will be done by a committee chair or ASM. If the person who is going to do the job would like to be an ASM I'd make them an ASM if they wanted to be on the committee I'd put them there. Bob White

And I apologize that I did not cover that. The restriction does not extend to individual troop activities where the Webelos are the center of the activity. They are still not to backback or do the other higher skill activities but can participate and camp with the troop. Bob

Congratulations NJ, you and Rooster saw beyond the anger. In addition to the conditions you mentioned there are also behavioral, moral and religious conditions that would restrict membership. So to just say there are 3 million children who can't be scouts without acknowledging that even if they or their parents were heterosexual many still couldn't join is misleading. TJhammer, I am amazed (though I probably shouldn't be) by the total misrepresentations that you insuated into my post. "some kids just aren't worth our time and effort" or "some kids Scouting just can't help" or "some kids we should ignore just because we disagree with their parents and church on one highly politicized issue".. Not only would you not hear BP, Hillcourt or others say that, you have not and will not hear me say that (or see me write that). To suggest that I did was an out an out fabrication of truth (polite for lie). I made an observation in my original post that attacked no one, a simple observation, and look at the totally distasteful way that you personally attacked me. No asking for clarification, no thinking, just knee JERK reaction because I was the one who wrote it. Bob White

All Kinds of rewards await scouts that attain eagle, including scholarships. contact your local scout service center for information. Bob

Hi MomScouter, I think these kinds of units exist in every council maybe even in every district. Remember the primary reason boys join a troop is for fun. But scouting is that and a lot more. Unless the boys and the parents learn that what real scouting is about they will gravitate to the only thing they know. One thing I will recommend is that when Webelos visit sit them down during patrol meeting time and talk about real scouting. The opportunity to choose their own scouting activities, to learn how to lead a group of friends, to be able to make decisions and have them respected, to make their own mistakes and have their own successes. All this while hiking, camping, canoeing, skiing , rock climbing, rappelling, skiing, shooting, swimming, fishing, cycling, doing activities that they select and plan. Let them learn that real scouting is like no ather activity they can join. I would tell them that not all troops run this way. That in some troops the adults make all the decisions. That in those troop s they will do alot of stuff too, but it will be the fun stuff the adults pick, and that's not the scouting that the Boy Scout Handbook promises. Then let them know that if they want a chance to do the kind of scouting promised in the handbook that you work with them to deliver that promise. Some will join your troop some will join the other, but at least they know what they are choosing up front. One personal piece of advice, focus on how you deliver the scouting program not on how the other troops do it. You know what the program is and isn't don't let the actions of others turn you from the right course. Bob White

And your troop didn't want you as a member? I can't imagine why. You're such a pleasant guy. Even National has seen fit to recognize you with a collector's edition form letter. I for one am honored to walk the same planet as you. I called the neighborhood association and we are making plans to rename the stop sign after you. Best wishes always, Bob

Carrying a chip on your shoulder ASM1? I'm not the only poster who saw no emergency in Chicago but I'm the only one you seem to like to take swings at. "Boy Scout Camping" is backpacking, long hikes, minimal shelter or natural shelter in inclement weather, winter camping in tents, cat hole latrines etc.. There is a big difference in how a 9-10 year old views the world and how a 10-11 year old and older sees it. What is adventure to an older boy is a frightening experience to a younger boy. What is a physical exercise to an older scout is painful torture to a younger one. The programs of the BSA are designed to meet the changing needs of youth at specific ages and stages of their lives. To give a Boy Scouting experience to a Cub aged boy is as bad as giving a Cub level program to Boy Scout aged boys. A good leader delivers the appropriate program at its fullest to an appropriate age group. Bob White

"Bob White is not responding to this because it is beyond his stop sign. I don't even know what that means? Actually I did not respond because I hadn't read the post. But that's not the only part you got wrong ASM1. "it is preferable that the COR be a member of the CO, but not mandatory" Actual it is mandatory. See page 7 of the Troop Committee Guidebook. "NO member of a CO, or Troop can serve as a Unit Commissioner. Impossible." There are no rules against this. It is certainly not an ideal situation but it does not violate any rules. The COR is a unit position and the Unit Commissioner role is a district position and there are no rules that keep a volunteer from holding any unit position and any district position simultaneously. "the Unit Commissioner is totally non-bias of membership on the District level. Fact!" If only it were a fact, but it is not. Unfortunately finding good unit commissioners is difficult and far too often volunteers end up commissioning units where they personal attachments. Your right that an impartial commissioner is better, and I never saw anyone be a good commissioner to their own unit. But it is not against any rule and is in fact very common. Lightcrow answered the question very well so I see no need to add to his post, I just didn't want ASM1 to continue to worry about me. I apologize if I caused you any concern. Bob White PS We just had recharter training at Roundtable tonight and according to our council registrar, and what I have always gone by during recharter, the only person that can hold two positions within the same unit is the Charter Organization Rep, who can also be a committee member or committee chair. And NO ASM1 the COR is not a committee member, read the Troop Committee Guidebook. The COR is a member of the Charter Organization and the District Committee not the troop committee unless he registers as one. Bob(This message has been edited by Bob White)

Does the total number or percentage really matter? The BSA is not for all children. it never has been. It is for any child that meets the joining requirements and not every child does. There are millions of children whose parents are heterosexual who do not meet the joining requirements. The BSA is not designed to be all things to all people. our membership requirements have changed several times in the past and they might change again in the future. But it will not be due to the demographics of who is not eligible, but on what best serves the aims and the mission of scouting. Bob White (This message has been edited by Bob White)