Bob White

Let's put the Patrol Method to work for you. First, let's reduce your work load. You do not have to worry about leading all the scouts in the troop. Your job is to lead the Patrol Leaders. They have the responsibility of leading the scouts in their respective patrols. Next, Why did you select an assistant who you don't get along with? Perhaps you didn't select him? If he was chosen for you the chooser is out of line. selecting your assistant(s) is your job. If he was elected, you didn't follow the program. Only the SPL and Patrol Leaders are Elected. All other offices are selected by either the PL or SPL. So you need to get everyone (adult leaders included) to read their appropriate handbooks the Boy Scout handbook, the PL Handbook, and the SPL Handbook. Next you need to adopt a more positive and respectful attitude of those you hope to lead if you really expect them to follow. Deal with each individually. It sounds as if you see them as a group all sharing the same characteristics and the fact is people are not like that. Work with each Patrol Leader as an individual with individual strengths and weaknesses. Don't tell people what to do. Talk with them. Ask them what they should do next, then support them when they give the right answer and coach them when they don't know what to do. As you learn to use these skills you can teach them to your patrol leaders. Leadership is often a tough job, be patient with yourself as well as with others. Continue to read your Scout Handbook and the SPL Handbook and practice one skill at a time. Good Luck Bob White

My reaction is that that is information or skills best taught in an advanced or supplementary course. As you have correctly pointed out the goal of the Introduction to Outdoor Skills course is to teach the outdoor skills required to become a first class scout. Since the use of fixed blde knives is not recommended, that is what should be taught in this course. Since the use of a machete is not a requirement for BSA advancement to First Class it should not be taught in this particular course. It would be more beneficial to stick to the syllabus and thereby the purpose of the course and teach ONLY Basic skills for advancement to First Class. bOB wHITE

Barry, Not meaning to split hairs but i think this is an important point. I have never pushed hard for Scoutmasters to do the First Class emphasis program that has been part of Boy Scout advancement for nearly 15 years. The BSA pushes hard for it and has for over a decadde. I push hard for Scoutmasters to manage the BSA's program correctly. First Class emphasis is tied to the New Scout Patrol and the Patrol Method. It calls for an Assistant Scoutmaster and a Troop Guide to develop a program through which new scouts, by their active participation, will naturally complete the requirements needed to achieve First Class within 12 to 14 months of joining the troop. The SM responsibility is to make sure the ASM and Troop Guide are getting the job done. Unit commissioning is another story. It's Broken. It has been Broken for for over 20 years. It is the redheaded stepschild of the national office. No one has stepped up to fix it. Unit Commissioning needs a paradigm shift, a new way of thinking and approaching unit support services. The current model which is based on the family physician making house calls has one big problem. Physicians don't make house calls and haven't in over 20years. Why? Because the medical industry realized the inefficiency of such an approach. It will take years I believe to overhaul unit commissioning. In the mean time the more focus on getting more people trained the better. We are better off with a lot of trained leaders who misunderstand a few things than a lot of untrained leaders who don't know much of anything. Bob White

According to the National OA the 3 white sashes with emgroidered red arrows are approved for uniform wear. The others are appropriate for wall display or as collectibles but are not approved for unifrom wear. Bob White(This message has been edited by Bob White)

Have been there 3 times. My family had an incredible time. I really encourage others to share the experience. BW

We keep the tots activity separate and out of view of the cubs. The last thing they want to think is that they are doing activities appropriate for a pre-schooler. If the things you are doing with wolves and bears can be done by pre-schoolers aren't you aiming pretty low skill and interest wise. Just a thought. Bob White

The MB sash and the OA sash are only to be worn one at a time and only on the shoulder. Refer to the OA manual and the Insignia Guide. Since the OA sash is only to be worn for OA events there should be no conflict anyway. Bob White(This message has been edited by Bob White)

National allows (practically encourages) local councils to customize the titles (BUT NOT the content) of training coures. It adds local flavor and has no effect on the actual information. BW

"How can the BSA promising that the SM will personally get the first year scouts to first class in one year not be a by-product of adult self-desire? It use to be performance was driven by the scout. Now it's what?" Barry, but nowhere is that said in any training or resource of the scouting program. "Let's take the Youth Protection question last week and assume that each person that participated is a Training coordinator. Whats next? I don't understand your question. Please restate it and I will try to answer it. "Once a unit is off and running, how do we measure the performance of their training? Who reports to who about the Eagle Mill?" I don't know that we expect anyone to "report" an Eagle Factory. The national training goal is 100% of the adult volunteers basic trained in the first 90 days. With that many trained leaders within a unit the key volunteers should be capable of policing themselves. Certainly though a working commissioner corps would help. But as you have already noticed there are big problems nationwide in unit commissioning. Roundtable and other supplemental training opportunities will also help to maintain quality scouting. Everything really hinges on two elements. Sound consistent basic training and unit leaders committed to following the real program. Bob White (This message has been edited by Bob White)

Troops are lead by youth, Scouting programs are managed by adult leaders. I have never seen an eagle factory that was lead by youth. Eagle factories are the by-product of adult egotism. You cannot have the majority of your scouts working on the same merit badges at the same time, and running merit badge classes during troop meetings while making any claim to being a functioning scouting program. A fact taught in Scoutmaster training as well as Troop committee training, and Junior Leader Training. No, I do not expect every troop to look the same. I expect, and I think the BSA expects, that the same methods will be used, the same rules followed, the same aims targeted, and the same mission focused on, from troop to troop. After all it is a "national" program. We have a responsibility to provide program consistency. Every Scout reads the same handbook and sees the same promises of adventure, advancement, and opportunities. As adult volunteers we have an obligation to deliver the promise found in the handbook. The training coordinator is not the common demoninator here. The training syllabus is. Evey trainer has the exact same course materials, syllabus, videos, PowerPoint, handouts, course instructions. Each Scoutmaster Leader Specific Training course in the country should have the identical content. As should all the others respectively. Bob White(This message has been edited by Bob White)

Well it's been almost 4 months. Has anybody signed up for PTC traing this summer?

Actually most packs run year round in our area. They recruit in the spring because getting the boys to Day Camp is a great way to get them hooked on scouting as well as a great summertime activity that they are eligible for now that they are out of Kindergarden. It is an effective way of recruiting and programming, and it gives boys an entire summer to enjoy scouting that packs who don't do spring recruitment miss out on. Is it to pump up membership numbers? if that is a way of saying recruit boys into scouting..Yes. Is it to pump of fees made at the camps? The cost of Day Camp is not affected by the Tigers being present. The cost per boy remains the same. Why not recruit in the spring?

Go ahead and wear your Eagle Award along with your knot for special occassions Captainron, you are not violating any uniform regulation. Congrats on being an Eagle Scout. BW

Never heard of either on a national level Jon. It is quite likely that these were local acronyms used for the national training programs. The official course names for the training prior to the current curriculum was; Scoutmaster Fundamentals and The Outdoor Expierience Completion of these two courses earned the TRAINED strip for your uniform and completed the basic training for Scoutmasters, Assistant Scoutmasters and Troop Committee Members. The troop committee has now been separated to its own continuum of; New Leader Essentials and Troop Committee Challenge Prior to these courses Scout Leader training was called; Scout Leader Training (SLT) HEY! I just realized where they got SaLT from! Prior to that it was called Cornerstone training Bob White(This message has been edited by Bob White)

The uniform should function as > a representation of a national program > A tool to eastablish a sense of belonging in a local gang > A tool to eliminate signs of personal wealth or lack of wealth, which can effect opinion and self-esteem. > A billboard for a scout to display personal accomplishments. > A motivation for other scouts to achieve > A tool to promote personal grooming > a tool to positively affect behavior and self-esteem It should not be expected.... > to be worn correctly if adults do not set the example > to be an effective choice of outdoor apparel for a variety of environments, climates and activities. > to solve all your problems > to be the cause of all your problems BW

Several of the Packs in our district do a Spring Tiger Recruitment and send them to Day Camp. it has been a very successful program here. Bob White

Just food for thought. Eliminate the word fail from your scouting vocabulary. Failure is what happens when you choose to give up trying. In a well lead program, Scouts are trained to make their own own decisions. Sometimes thay make better decisions than other times. When they make a bad decision they evaluate, and make a plan for a different decision, that's called learning. At no time did the scout fail, they tried, they learned. Boys pick up on negative words very easily. Leaders who use negative terms tend to lead in a different way than leaders who think in positive terms. Just a personal observation. Bob White

Sorry no,I do not have that survey. Your local professional may be able to access it on ScoutNet. Even with a list of sites, specific approval must be given by the council based on the activities planned for your specific event. The list given by your council is general information and does not in itself qualify your outing as an approved BSA activity. Bob white

Barry writes"Assume one trainer comes from an adult driven Eagle Mill troop, another comes from a boy led Troop. One comes from an age based patrol troop, the other comes from a aged mixed patrol method troop. The training material is so basic that training between the two shouldn't change much. The questions that come up during the training will pull the differences." This is where the quality of the trainer plays a big role. A good trainer teaches the BSA program not the program they lead as a leader.I would hope that a leder who did not follow the program would not be selected for the training team, or if they did get chosen, the topics they presented were controlled by the training coordinator. Another point Barry offered was "And I know National understands this because they give so much discussion time." Actually they don't give a lot of discussion time in the current training modules. Though there is some, it is a controlled conversation directed to a specifc conclusion in nearly every case. "My fear is not that trainers don't teach identically, but that they don't understand what they are teaching." I share that fear. As far as the roadmap to better training, it is in the hands of responsible volunteers. >The District Chair must select a district training coordinator that understands the training programs and how to use them. >The Council Training Chair needs to have regular meeting where the training coordinators receive ongoing training. >Trainers need to let go of personal preferences and teach "the program". >Training teams need to be responsive to both the needs of the volunteers who seek training and the needs of the BSA to deliver the full course of information and not a watered down version. >Unit volunteers need to open the leaders Handbooks and the boy's Handbooks and really read them. Then they need to follow the program to the best of their abilities. "I've come to believe it is unrealistic for two teachers to teach identically. So maybe the question is what level of difference in units is tolerable for a quality program?" I don't think you need to teach identically to be able to teach the identical information. A good trainer can adjust the deliver of the information to suit a particular audience without altering the information itself. Trainers need to teach the entire content of the syllabus in a way to insure the highest possible retention rate by controling the pace, environment, comfort, and presentation techniques. But stick to the current program and the BSA course syllabus. Bob White

"Last years Family Overnighter Council Approved Cub Scout Camp Site .Yes The G2SS rules followed.Yes Tour Permit No Baloo Trained.No" Unless you said Yes to the last two, you cannot say yes to the first two. The council approves the cub camp location and activities based on the information in the tour permit which was not filed. The G2SS requires that the leader have BALOO training and that a tour permit be approved by council. By what authority does a Den Leader risk the finances of the chartering organization by leading an unapproved activity? I do not want to beat a dead horse, and what has happened in the past cannot be changed, but to say anything goes if it's for the kids is not a responsible or safe attitude. As the leader of an overnight activity you have a responsibility to keep your family, the other registered adults, and Charter Organization safe as well as the scouts. The purpose of BALOO is not to make someone an expert camper, that takes years of experience. The purpose of BALOO is to give a Cub leader the basic administrative information and resources needed to operate a family camp within the regulations of the BSA program, and to introduce some very basic camping information they can share with the families to help less experienced campers be more comfortable. Take cubs camping as often as you can, but do it right. Bob White(This message has been edited by Bob White)

I would hope no adult leader would ever set a boy up to fail. In my thinking that would meaning giving a scout advice or direction that you know will result in failure. I do however allow scouts to make their own decisions based on their training and resources. Unless there is a question of health or safety I will not interfere with that decision. Afterwards I would lead the scout in an evaluation of the activity and let him tell me what went wrong, ask him what could have avoided the problem ,and how he would adjust his decision making in the future. Bob White

Laura, please share our condolences to Scot's family and to his scouting community. My family's prayers are with you all. Bob White

Twocubdad, fotoscout said "Last year I did a Den Family Camping Trip. This year, after sitting through Baloo,..." The difference between the den and pack camping is communications. The pack committee has the responsibility to make sure the proper training has taken place, that responsible leadership is in control of the event, that the correct permits have been filed, that liability protection for the leaders and the CO are in place. That the location is approved by Council. The difference is the courtesy and responsibility to protect those who were left unprotected when the Den when camping. Bob White (Follow Me Boys is a very fun and heart warming movie, I enjoy it every time I see it. It's just not good scouting.)

Here is the trap that fotoscout fell into twocub. >He said this was his den only He said he did not refer to the pack >He said he was not BALOO trained >Since he went to out of his way not to mention scouting we can assume he did not use scout owned or managed property >and did not file the appropriate permits, other wise he would have had no hesitation to mention cubbing. Each of these points individually is enough to invalidate the pack leaders liability protection. Endangering not only himself but all the registered leaders in the pack AND the charter organization. This is no time to split hairs. It is either a pack activity or it is no activity at all. It is done on a Council approved property or it shouldn't take place. The leader is trained and authorized to lead such an event or they are not. An individual has no right to risk the personal finances of every registered adult in the pack just because he wants to take his den camping. This is not a dressing down of fotoscout. This is an effort to warn others that there opportunities for cubs to camp but they come with rules that must be followed to keep everyone safe. This is not an activity to look for short-cuts or loopholes. Do it right or don't do it, the risks are too high. Bob White (This message has been edited by Bob White)

I've heard of Den family camping, I would never do it, nor would I ever recommend anyone doing it. As you know, Den camping is not recognized or endorsed by the scouting program (Webelos being the exception). Den leaders (Tiger, Wolves and Bears) are not trained in the safety, sanitation, and program rules for den camping. Don't fool yourself into thinking that just because you don't put a scouting name on it the parents don't think it is scouting. If you plan it with cub leaders and parents and invite people because they are in the den or pack you have a cub activity. Parents have the misconception that this is a scouting activity they are going on, and they expect the leaders to have full knowledge of what they are doing. The BSA wants the scouts protected. They also want the scout leaders protected. Since Den camping is prohibited you (If you are a leader on the event) have just left yourself and the units's charter organization exposed for criminal and civil prosecution should something go wrong, without the benefit of the protection of the BSA. You would be responsible for your own legal defense, and for any fines or loss due to liability claims. Now maybe this doesn't bother you personally, but did you explain the exposure to your charter organization head before you took the Den out? You know the scouts aren't the only ones the BSA cares about. The rules are there to protect the leaders and their families welfare as much as they protect the safety of the boys, but that doesn't work if the rules are ignored. I have never met a commissioned professional or volunteer who followed the rules out of pride for their role. Their earned their role by keeping their pledge to abide by the program. I'm all for cubs camping but do it right, do it within the rules. When you shortcut the rules what kind of an example are you setting for the scouts and their families. Bob White