Bob White

Not really my wisdom, in case you did not notice I gave you the BSA resources that explain it. All I did that was different from you is read. Each CO has one CR because each CR has a vote in the District and Council. One vote for each CO, not one vote for each unit. No need for "heads to roll" (I really don't get the melodrama) just some paperwork that needs correcting.(This message has been edited by Bob White)

Hi Bryan, I don't totally disagree with you but I do have a question. Have you seen Citizen Kane a second time? Did knowing What Rosebud meant diminish the movie for you or did it allow you to see other details more clearly? How many people do you suppose see the movie after knowing about Rosebud and yet still enjoy it? The Game of Life does not depend on the players knowledge of it. (This message has been edited by Bob White)

Sorry GW but..... He is not CR for one unit. He is CR for the Chartering Organization. Each CO has one, and only one CR. Regardless of how many Scouting uits the CO has the same person is the CR. You can find this in a number of BSA resources including the Troop Committee Guide , The Cou Scout Leader book and the Charter organization Representative brochure just to name a few. Not to mention the raining courses that cover it. According to the BSA unit application form the only position that it says a CR can duplicate as is the Committee Chair. I believe if you check with your council registrar you will find that if the troop is a unit in the same CO where the individual is the CR he cannot also be the Scoutmaster.

I am not sure what kind of details you are looking for jtswestark? They went fine. Why shouldn't they?It's just a different location. You can hold a court of honor almost anywhere. Here are some places where we have had courts of honor and bridges of honor. A school gym, an auditorium, a courtroom, a campsite, VFW hall, a chapel, our meeting room, a restaurant, a park. The elements of the program change very very little. It's just a change of scenery. What kind of details are you looking for?

Absolutely

"All I can say Bobby is what about all the volunteers who devote countless hours helping young people grow into good and decent people, from the den leader to the scoutmaster to the venturing advisor to the district and council volunteers who not only represent whats best about BSA programs and procedures, they teach them to our youth." As you used to be a BSA professional for a few years I am surprised you have to ask that question BadenP. We are the people that promise the BSa to deliver their program. We each have our own set of responsibilities. The unit volunteers to serve their chartering organizations and deliver the Scouting program (the BSA Scouting Program that can be found in the training an resources of the BSA). The District and Council to support the Charter organizations Scouting programs, including training their leaders, and the professionals and commissioners to represent the national programs policies and procedures and to see that "every eligible youth has the opportunity to belong to a quality Scouting Program". I hope that helps you BadenP if you have any other questions please feel free to post again and I am sure one of us can direct you to the BSA training or resource where you can find the correct answer. You can learn more about the differences between the Commissioners responsibilities ant the unit leaders responsibilities by attending Commissioner basic training and the administration of commissioner training, as wel as the Leader specific Trainings for each of the programs.

Shat you need is the Cub Scout Leader Book, it is the adult manual for all positions of a Cub Pack. Turn your attention to chapter 23 where it explains the responsibilities fo each adult position in the Pack. You will note that it states in the job description of the Pack Committee Chairman "To Supervise the Pack Committee by: 1) Calling and presiding at pack leaders' meetings 2) Assigning duties to committee members. 3) Planning the pack charter review, round-up, and reregistration. 4) approving all bills before payment by the pack treasuruer." You say he is telling people what to do? that can mean many things. But you will find a list of duties for every positionand if the cc is making sure that those things are done, then she is doing her job. You say half the committee thinks she is doing fine and the other half doesn't. Well all you need to do is find out which half is right. A good place to start would be the training and resources of the BSA. Every leader in the pack should know their job, and it would help if they all new the same game. If everyone know and followed the Cub program according to the BSA trainingand materials then you would have a level playing field to be able to determine what was right or wrong. Good Luck.

There is nothing wrong with quarterly courts of honor. What you need to remember is that you don't need to hold the recognistion until the court. Recognize the scout as immediately as possible, preferrably the next troop meeting, withthe award. Then at the Court of honor recognize the scout again but this time in front of the parents using the poscket certificate card that is available with every rank, merit badge and most other recognitions. You can find information on youth recognition in the Scoutmaster Handbook and the Advancement Committee Policies and procedurea manual as well as in New Leader Essential Training and every adult leader specific training in Scouting. How long do you like to wait for a pay check?

Seems pretty clear when you use the official resources of the BSA doesn't it? Now to balance that, what are the responsibilities of the Scoutmaster in helping the Patrol Leader fulfill his duties?

I have never suggested that Scouters should rip the patches off their uniforms, you are certainly melodramatic if nothing else. The origin of the thread was that the CR told the leaders of the unit that CR is in charge of, that the patrol emblem did not belong on the uniforn=m, and had others heard of this. The only correct answer is that the Charter rep was correct. This is not an emblem that belongs on an adults unifrom accordfing to the uniform policies of the BSA. Not mine...the BSA's. Now if you feel the need to twist that into something it isn't, then that is a personal problem you will need to deal with on your own. I noticed another poster also suppoerted the correct uniforming info as I did and yet you siongled me out for your attacks. As a person who was an employee of the BSA's for a few years I would have expected a better understanding of the uniform regulations. There are no uniform police in the BSA. The program has always relied on the personal integrity of the volunteers and the people who select them to do the right thing. It is reasonable to expect that with 1.2 million volunteers there will be a percentage that will choose not to. I am pleased to know by gigibw's post that there are indeed Charter Organization Representatives who take their obligation to follow the BSA program to heart, and expect the leaders of their units to do the same.(This message has been edited by Bob White)

Doc came to his understanding by taking the training and reading the BSA manuals for commissioning. Doc is not agreeing with me nor I with him. We are agreeing with the training and resources of the BSA. You want people to agree with you because of being a professional for a few years once in the past. Eamonn is asking questions trying to understand the topic. Beavah is basing his position on his personal opinion and ability to type with a northeasternish accent. None of that alters the topic of the thread or the correct answer to ASM59's question. Who does the BSA rely on to represent its programs, policies, and procedures? The folks wearing the wreath of service according to the BSA. (This message has been edited by Bob White)

Doc has an excellent understanding of the topic.

Doc, I apologize that I was unable to give you a direct anser regarding the Game of life. Pleaswe understandt that it has no reflection on the openess policy of the BSA (which by the way says that there will be no secret organizations within the BSA and that all activities of the BSA are open to parents). If I answered your question it would be removed by a forum Moderator based on his personal judgement and not based on any policy of the BSA. Since this is a private sight not operated by the BSA i do not know how you could hold tat against the program? I am sorry you are chossing to leave, I t was nice to have another person on the site who cared enough about the program to try to learn and follow it,. Happy Scouting BW

Well jblake if nothing else you have established that humility is not your bigest problem. You need to be very careful when you try to use your personal credentials to prove your knowledge of the scouting program. For one thing yopu have ten years of experience the BSA has nearly 100. 2) You promised to use their program and not visa versa. 3) While I understand how happy you are with the jamboree trip, the speaking opportunities etc, (I am am happy for you as well) there are a lot of scouters out there who have done far more for far longer by simply following the program than you have trying to change it and you don't see them using their personal credentials to try and impress folks, they just use the scouting program. Something to consider. If you think you are right due to your credentials, then that must mean that anyone with more credentials than you knows even more than you do right? It's better to make the BSA the authority on the BSA program, don't you think? That way you don't need to try and prove more than others just that you know the BSA program has all the credentials they need to deliver a strong Scouting program.(This message has been edited by Bob White)

Understand that Bolingbroke did not use scouting as his bio in this case. He used it as a title on his signature. Big difference. By using it as a signature rather than as bio element he is in essence saying that Scouting, through him, endorses the content of the petition. That is an improper use of his office.

Welcome Debby Sorry Printman31, someone gave you some incorrect info. Unit committee meetings are not public meetings and parents are not automatically invited nor must they be allowed to attend. While I agree that most parents would be welcomed most of the time, it is important that people have accurate information. Committee meetings are private meetings. And with the thousands of units nationwide with who knows how many units coming and going every month, I don't how how you could possibley know if most units publicize their committee meetings to the parents or not.(This message has been edited by Bob White)

There is nothing that prohibits a person from stating in a bio that they are a volunteer in the Scouting program.

No, it was a comment about the reasons some use to do things wrong based on how they measure the "size" of the incorrectness.

It doesn't have to be a big deal to be wrong. It would not take a big deal to do it right. So as a responsible leader, if you could choose to easily be wrong, or easily be right which would you choose?(This message has been edited by Bob White)

Liz Too long.

Beavah the rule you refer to relates only to the active membership requirement and not to the leadership requirement so it is not relevant to the topic of the thread. GW you cannot have it both ways. You have already condoned the boy's actions.

Eamonn Who determines that commissioners and professionals wear the wreath of Service? National not council Who determines the responsibilities of Commissioning? National not Council. Whose program policies and procedures does national say the commissioner supports? National's Are they commissioned by the BSA, Yep. Do I agree that they are registered at the council level? Yes. Is their area of service restricted to the council they are registered in? Yes, fs they are commissioners at the council level (not all commissoners are registered at that level).

Saying that you volunteer in the BSA as part of a bio is a far cry from speaking on a political issue using your title and position in the BSA as your position of authority. This is no different than wearing your uniform to a polical rally in support of an issue. You as a volunteer do not have the leagal authority to lend or suggest the supporty or endorsement of the BSA to anything.

the CR is correct. Patrol emblems are not for wear on the adult uniform shirt. National does not make District patches for wear on the BSA uniform. They may make the patches, but there are a lot of patches made and sold by the BSA that are not for display on the official uniform shirt.

Hey GW remember how a few posters have said that every now and then you post something that's actually worthwhile? Well your views on Boy Scouts urinating in other peoples water bottles as being acceptable youthful fun is probably not gonna be of those times. Do I understand that some kids would do this, sure I do. I also understand that some would shoplift, and some will trespass and some will bully. I also know that all are wrong and so does an 11 year old. What is more surprising is that some adults don't know it. Highcountry if you have a scout that is bullying other boys and you have not removed him then you are in violation of the BSA youth protection policies. Advancement is the last thing with that scout you should be worried about. Forget the grandmother, forget whatever the last Scoutmaster did or didn't do. You are the Scoutmaster now and YOU are responsible for the health and safety of the other scouts in your charge. You need to get your priorities straight and take action to protect the other scouts.