Tampa Turtle

We let them become a (un)patrol at the WI/WII point and mention it at the Pack meeting. Even though it is true it is only one program we gave them some informal recognition.

Power of the marketplace; I think it is fine. I am a big supporter of the Girl Scouts but if it AHG gets more girls into scouting than I am all for it. My son says he only wants to marry a girl that wants to go on adventures with him. Oaths are funny things. Recently I attended a presentation by christian pollster George Barna. I found it interesting that many "born again's" responses mirrored the general population. Only 74% believed in a God as defined in mainstream Christian theology (creator of the universe, all-knowing, currently exists). My take--a lot of people don't believe what they say they believe because their believes changes from moment to moment.

Good advice all. Don't do it unless you get total SM control with committee support. And it sounds like you wont. The signs are there that even if you step in as the official SM you will not last a year. I am sure there are other Troops that could use and value your help.

Con) My boy joined cub scouts because he was too young for boy scouts. By the time he was old enough for boy scouts no doubt we would have been embroiled in soccer, football, whatever instead.

Mom brings up a good point. I recently skipped a few campouts and...IT WAS GREAT! So she is correct in that if you break that continuity you will lose some keepers...

(1) I would go by what the Step Dad says. (2) Some boys are poor swimmers. They need work. I am more concerned about the fact he would not even try. If he is that scared he is more likely to panic even with a PFD and could drown. He should still need to learn how to right a canoe, etc. (3) I would probably let a beginner go but not a non-swimmer. That said we would give multiple chances for the boy to become a beginner before the trip. (We went through this once and we had 4 swim test opportunities mostly to accommodate two boys)

It is a tough switch from CS DL to ASM as many of us have experienced and viewed. We encourage the newbie ASM's to go to Summer Camp with us. The first year Mom is more likely to want Dad to tag along anyway. If Dad is willing to sacrifice a whole week of vacation time we know we might have a keeper! We also try to get them into Scoutmaster Training at summer camp. We try to get them trained up as much and as soon as possible. At Woodruff SR I highly recommend Sue Nunn's class. It gets the ex-scout adults up to speed on the changes today and less experienced ones some basic skills to build confidence. Camp gives the Scouters a chance to bond with the boys on any Troop activities and the adults to bond as well. I would pair up a newbie ASM with a more experienced one for a while to coach them on how Scouts work and your Troop in general. I would go so far as to encourage assigning them as tent buddies if you could. I have seen that and it works. We have a Committee member whose job it is to track the adult training and let the SM know. We encourage new folks to utilize those areas they experienced or interested in and get the appropriate credentials to do so. We also try to have each ASM support the PLC on one campout a year so everyone gets some experienced on the forms, rules, and logistics the adults may need to provide. Several times a year we have an offsite adult planning and issues meeting of adult "patrol" with steaks and cocktails.

Hmmm...good question. We would still do it; especially at 1st Class and below. We would stress the importance of it as a sign of them taking it seriously, as his official record. We tell our boys that when there is a conflict between a signed off book and our electronic Troopmaster record the book wins. It is their best defense. We urge them (and their parents) to copy/scan the advancement pages. We would tell the boys to appear with your book, just like we tell them to wear your uniform with proper rank and POR. But if they didn't we might give them a gentle reminder, ask them to look for it, and come around later. If they insisted or there was a urgent deadline we would probably go forward and err on the boys behalf. Boys will be boys. They will lose stuff. Qwazse is on the right track--I think asking the boy is a method.

My first reaction was "what!". But then... As something occasional...prob OK. We count Summer Camp and that isn't that challenging. If it was me I would sigh and then ask the boys to make it more challenging. Maybe cowboy camping, or real old-style canvas tents, or first time tarp camping. Survival practive. "Sure we camp after the game...you can only bring what will fit in your pocket". Make'm lash a shelter. No pop tarts. Make everything Dutch Oven or if they do that all the time something else. It is a pretty safe environment so the risk of failure is lower. I bet they might want to repeat the experiment in an more challenging environment later. Scouting is a game...make it so.

I noticed the same thing on one of the new guys shirts. I would not like front pockets.

I loved doing the cub thing and would consider doing Tigers again when I retire...if they do not think me a creepy old man. Cubs keep you young and they are so darn cute. I get more excited greetings from my former cubbies than any scouts I know. I seem to stand taller. I think a lot of Boy Scouters do look down at Cub leaders just like teachers look at the early grade teachers as glorified baby sitters. It is not right. It was harder work than boy scouts in many ways--every week was a production. Boy Scouts is more complicated with all its rules and has its physical demands but no where the meeting responsibilities IMHO. So Den Leaders remember what one of my trainers told me: "We never know what the future holds for these boys. Some will grow up to be doctors some criminals. Some have miserable secret home-lives, be a or may not live to adulthood. Remember cub-scouts may be the happy bright spot in their childhood. You make that happen. So be patient and remember that they are little boys" When you step back and look at the big picture Cub Scouts is really important.

It is easy to get mixed up and separated on a river. Happened to me on the Peace River which, as the name suggests, is peaceful. So I think the boys did pretty good. I am frustrated about the cell phone apron strings. I get snarled by them too. Mrs Turtle wants to be able to reach me in case of emergency (which only seems to happen when I am away). Of course my cheap cellphone coverage is pretty scanty on some campouts (we do want to have adventures away from civilization) and I catch heck when I come home and she could not reach me or my batteries are dead from trying to get a signal. Mrs Turtle can become a Snapping Turtle when she gets her back up. I guess it must be love... Today everyone starts to panic if we cannot be in instant and constant communication. How did we ever survive before? We really crack down at summer camp especially with the newbies. Only the SM has a cell phone for parents to contact. (and he was averaging 70+ messages a day last year) We deal with newbie parents by having a ASM do a daily text or email update to everyone--heavy on the "everyone is OK" and low on any problems. As to this kind of river incident is where a sealed cell phone in a dry bag for emergency communication would be OK. Then the separated parties could have communicated a common rendezvous the next day. No need for a rescue effort. We have become a nation of wimps.

Yeah we had the tick experience as well during Wilderness Survival at La-No-Che. Grassy field had tons of them mush less so in the woods.

Oh...didn't know about the Dad and the scout thing. Seen that before...that always mucks things up.

Cambridgeskip, Thank you. Yes I have been following the SNP referendum thing a bit but got confused. I know more about London than the rest of the UK and the whole London governance thing has always been much of a mash-up I never could figure out the town-council-district thing in the rest of the UK.

Seems kinda normal. Might want to see if he has some personal conflicts...as to wanting the rank required MB's and not doing a thing he may just need a little help on learning to organize himself. I have had to sit down with my almost 14 year old and have him read the requirements to me. Then I ask if he had done them or what he needs to do to get it complete. He needs the verbal prompt. Ideally I have another adult do this. I did the "sink or swim" approach on him and he sank like a rock for a year. 14 is a tough age. A lot going on educationally, socially, and hormonally. In the boys I have been working with since they are 9 many are getting really stressed out by 13-14. On the other hand is there something else that he is really passionate about? (video games and girls excluded) Sometimes boys just enjoy other activities more.

Basement I am with you. My sons want to go to Sea Base, Jambo etc. It is hard for my family to justify the expense when we can make our family trip dollars stretch farther elsewhere. Scouting can get pretty expensive and it doesn't have to be. I get very turned off by these fees required of volunteers.

Cambridge, Maybe you can explain what "devolution" is in the UK and how a Scotland MP can vote on taxes in England and vis versa. And what the heck is a "Council"?

Most Car camping adventures will survive the poor selection of food stuffs but add a 10 mile hike or do a 3-4 day high adventure and the careful selection of the food-fuel you take becomes very important. So proper nutrition training and cooking on those first camp-outs becomes important. Funny is if the boys get hungry enough they will eat the healthy stuff. The extra bag of apples or oranges always gets eaten. The Dutch Oven concoctions can get pretty unhealthy--we adults call them (As to fried stuff, I just went to our State Fair and do not think there were ANY foods you could not find fried--Oreos, Candy Bars, Coke, any kind of meat, water, fruits. My personal favorite was the the good 'ol bacon cheese burger with Krispy Kreme buns AND then deep fried and served with ice cream and fudge. No I did not eat it.)

KC brings up a good point, the constantly mutating nature of the devices. I used to depend heavily on my Palm PDA until a technophobe boss banned it. 3x5 cards are just not the same. As for manners there is no way to know if a boy is websurfing or looking up a relevant point when I was talking about something. I told one boy to put one away and he was actually taking notes on it. A Card has the advantage of having boys earn the privilege as an incentive to learning the rules and as something to take away from them. I would not like the extra administration.

Always was a Hydrox man myself. (it came 1st) I don't think Oreos taste as good as when they had lard in the cream. Kinda like the beef tallow in the McD's fries--don't know what you are missing until they are gone. Funny thing about Scouts and camp food is that many boys will eat things they would be reluctant to eat at home. My sons will eat things -- Rooster Sauce, summer sausage, sardines, kippers, squab, sushi--that they would not touch at home. Some things like Nutella they will gobble down camping and not touch if available at home. We try to steer the scouts to these different "exotic" foods rather than junk foods.

Yes, Basement and I am moving in your direction. I used to be in the ban camp but they are getting so ubiquitous that it is hard to ban them outright. Also the leaders are using them so much. We also find them to be such as much a distraction as a useful tool --much as a knife or fire--and think that a E-Chit may be something to consider.

We are dealing in risk management not risk elimination. But if we enforce the YPT and screening folks we are moving in the right direction.

We have kicked this around the block a few times. Naturally it really presents a few problems--bad nutrition, undermines the patrol meal planning, invites other boys to pester for goodies, etc etc. I came down pretty hard on one boy on this last year. Now I am much more familiar with him I see his problem was one of his meds that depressed his appetite. His parents were desperate for him to get ANY calories into him. It is still a problem as he is pretty underweight. We tried to compromise so he could have healthier snacks (jerky, trail mix) timer around when his medication affected him least. We have also had some boys who really just had some awful eating habits as well and had to talk to their parents.

If you have already read it I think John Gardner's "On Leadership" is pretty good. (I met the guy once--he had the touch). He talks about the different types of leadership physical, moral, etc that individuals have. Really broadens the conversation and is a pretty quick read. I do some emergency/disaster stuff and I see folks with natural leadership--almost situational leadership--where they excel in a particular time and place.