TAHAWK

https://www.scouting.org/Home/HealthandSafety/Safety_Moments.aspx Links to: https://www.scouting.org/filestore/HealthSafety/pdf/680-055_SafetyHammocks_WEB.pdf

It was a Tenderfoot test to give the Scout Handclasp in the B.S.A., Boy Scout Handbook, 7th Ed. at p. 34 (1969). It was Joining Requirement to know the Scout Handclasp. B.S.A., Official Boy Scout Handbook, 9th (Bill Hillcourt) Ed., at pp. 11 and 47 (1980). As the "Scout Handshake," knowing how to give it s now a Scout rank requirement, B.S.A., Boy Scout Handbook, 13th Ed., at p. 10 (2015).

If knives cause violence, do spoons cause obesity? Student expelled by Superintendent Hutchings for using electronic device at High School contraary to "zer9 tolerance" rule banning them unless authorized by staff. Expulsion reversed when victim got lawyer. "Todd Kotler cited two studies (one from the American Psychological Association and one from a family law journal) that argue persuasively that zero-tolerance policies like Hutchings' aren't effective methods to rehabilitate and reform misbehaving children. Kotler, along with Trumbo, felt that punishments should be commensurate with the infraction.

I advise soaking in a bath tub with Woolite or similar product. Slosh (not Stosh) up and down gently. Drain in place. Fill tub and slosh. Repeat. Drain in place well before trying to pick up to hang and damp. When damp dry, use the tennis ball in dryer trick. The danger is stressing the stitching when the bag is heavy with water. I have seen a number of down bags tear apart internally from such stress. I advisew against washing any sleeping bag in a dasher washer. I even am worried by front loaders. Some companies say their bags are good to go on "gentle" in any machine, but their business is to sell more sleeping bags. The old Coleman company (pre takeover by conglomerate) training course advised against machine washing of sleeping bags or similar, quilted garments. A sleeping bag liner lengthens the period between washing. I have a 1958 issue USMC bag. Still fine. Feathers in the mix smell off when wet.

I would start by asking the Scout in question who he is friendly with in his patrol. If the answer is no one, I would ask if anyone in another patrol is someone he is friendly with. If such a person exists, I would ask the PL of the patrol with the friend, if his patrol would accept another member, explain why I think that would be important, and ask him to make smooth the way for the transfer. Boys don't join to be educated, learn to be responsible, or develop better values. That was B-P's insight and Bill's. It is my observation in nearly fifty years of unit-level Scouting. I joined, for example, because my neighbor was someone I buddied with and he asked me to join his patrol.

Good. Makes sense. The rule I was speaking about - I thought obviously -- was the type of rule most of use are questioning - the zero tolerance [reasoning] rule. But you remind us that communication can be hard. I should have been clearer.

"Scout Salute ...The Scout Salute is a form of greeting that also shows respect. Use it to salute the flag of th United States of America. You may also salute other Scouts and Scout leaders." Boy Scouts of America, Boy Scout Handbook, 25th ed,. at p. 28, accord, 5th Ed. at p. 46, 12th Ed. at p. 20, 11th Ed. at p. 7, 7th Ed. at p. 55, 9th (Bill Hillcourt) Ed. at p. 47 - and many other places. (The pathetic 10th Ed. seems to have omitted the Scout Salute except for a picture of it. It also lacks an index, having only the partial results of a word search for certain words.) " If not, I'll stay there as long as he wants, even if its past my bedtime. "

"When I was a scout we were sent off looking for smoke shifters and sky hooks. That is now called hazing or bullying. It is neither. Sure, it could go bad but if done right It is an opportunity for the younger scouts to learn how to take some discomfort with a smile, the older scouts to learn how to watch for where the line is on each scout, the adults to bite their tongues, and everyone to have some fun." For years, T22 took sky hooks, smoke shifters (Acme Universal Abishifter). elbow grease, (USP), snipe, and a couplr of other things of that ilk to every camporee. The joke was on the jokers when the newbies returned, item(s) in hand. "Hazing"? That would be rechartering. "Bullying"? _________________________________________

Such rules allow escape from personal responsibility - "I was only following orders." Some of us put our children in the hands of such people. Others vote the entire Board out at the next election.

Hopefully it would recognize that what "we" had for meals is less important than many other things you have mentioned here over the years, like leadership, responsibility, and values.

That is not the law in Ohio, which has no permits for carrying a concealed weapon except for hand guns. The first inquiry in Ohio is whether one is carrying a concealed "weapon" -- a matter of intent -- rather than a concealed tool. One ought to inquire as to each particular jurisdiction, as localities such as New York City have draconian knife laws (the bill to repeal the N.Y. City ordinance passed the N.Y. legislature with a large bi-partisan majority recently but was vetoed by the Governor of New York. Ordinances in Ohio, such as the Cleveland knife ordinance making it a crime punishable by at least fix months in jail to pick up that knife at McDonald's, (any "knife" with a blade over 2.5", without exception, if "possessed" in a "public place"), have been held unconstitutional by Ohio's appellate courts on the grounds that they do not require proof that the item is possessed as a weapon, making them contrary to Ohio general law. http://www.knifeup.com/knife-laws/ https://www.akti.org/state-knife-laws/

Sure could be first BSA troop if up and running in 1909. Just needed to win the race to charter over all the other 1908 and 1909 troops. At least 22 1908 troops in what became the Greater Cleveland District (Councils came later, along with "executives.")

A 1909 Cleveland "troop" of a dozen Scouts walked from Cleveland to the Ohio River at Marietta and back (330 miles for crows; 360 miles as they walked it), pulling a trek cart with their gear and supplies. Nothing to the Argentinian's trek, but still pretty stout work. The Scoutmaster and his Mrs. looked in on them once a day. B.S.A. arrived in 1912.

Cultural norms are all over the lot. Eagle Scout expelled from Senior Year of HS because he volunteers that he has a 2" folding pen knife locked in the glove compartment of his locker vehicle as part of a survival kit (drives many miles to school in northern climes in Winter). B.S.A. norms are easier to find. The Guide to Safe Scouting, in 2011 recognized Scouting's duty to teach the proper use of all "legally owned knives" - which includes almost all sheath knives almost everywhere in the U.S. Hard to meet that safety obligation absent the knives we are supposed to teach about. Further, Boys' Life (September, 2008 at p. 12) had already proclaimed a short sheath knife as the "The best type of knife for camping trips." Yet B.S.A. still allows local council or unit option to impose zero tolerance (zero judgment) rules, which contradict B.S.A. safety and outdoor program policy. What if the focus was on the type of knife and it's suitability as a tool? I have 1" (total length) sheath knives and one folding knife with a 12" blade. Some allowed folding knifes are optimized to stab - as weapons - and some sheath knives are optimized as tools. And then there is the "axes are OK" and "non-locking folding knives are OK" blind spots of the supposed safety-consciousness of the sheath knife banners. Never saw a ban on a tomahawk with a spike opposite the blade - SPLAT! In two official B.S.A. books on wilderness survival on the Scout Shop shelves post 2000, the Scout reader was told to use a khukuri or bolo when the G2SS still did "not encourage large sheath knives." I figured out that seeming anomaly. These massive shopping tools/weapons are short swords in scabbards, not knives in sheaths. So A-OK. Seriously, bans are typically composed by those ignorant on the topic. (E.G. "Assault Weapons" ban not about "assault weapons [which are fully automatic]"; telescoping stock outlawed/folding stock A-OK; flash suppressor outlawed/compensator [allows faster rate of aimed fire] A-OK. And the knife banning started a decade before the rationale I keep hearing - "Rambo, First Blood." The big sheath knives showed up in 1946 when the U.S.A. dumped 7.5 million of them on the surplus market. MK II Fighting Utility Knife with 7" "clipped" blade for $.50 anyone? (vs, $3.00 for the B.S.A fixed-blade knife d'jour, the Western Cutlery L66 Skinner. I had a MK II [AKA "Ka-Bar"] but figured out for myself that it was clumsy for what I used a knife to do.) Our new Camp Director came in five years ago and eliminated the "47 thou shalt nots." Instead we have, "The law of this camp is the Scout Law." One of the 47 nots had been "No fixed-blade knives are allowed in camp." Gone now, and no problems he can recall in the wake of its departure. I wonder what the zero tolerance sorts would have produced as the Scout Law. Lots of "nots" I suspect.

Baked and everything? Next thing you'll tell me they grind the coffee. Oh, and we paid for the gasoline for outings. "A Scout pays his own way." Right up there with unsliced bread.

Gasoline was $.19 to $.25/gallon when I was a first a PL in 1957. That's the same nominal price as 1918 and cost the same in 1957 as 2 - 2.5 loaves of store sandwich bread (all taken from campout budget, Eagle Patrol) . Adjust for inflation, and gasoline today is about the same as at the high end ($.25) back when I was first a PL. In Southern Calif it was a long drive to any decent camp site and longer to decent backpacking - like 85 miles to the nearest trail head at San Gorgonio Wilderness. So we needed adults to drive -- and then leave us be. They volunteered to do the former and were carefully trained to do the latter. Any who proved unable to keepa' da' hans' off, were not drivers in the future unless one of our Marine noncom Asst SMs were along to maintain order - among the adults. Master Gunnery Sgt. Stearns was particularly valued in that role, and later became my second SM. (We were also told we were being issued adults and needed to turn them back in unbroken.) The troop in which I Scouted for twenty-five years (We should NOT have moved!), more recently bicycled around Lake Erie and canoed the toughest part of the Voyager route from Fish lake to the Ottowa River. The Venturer Patrol (not Venturers), canoed Isle Royale, did Philmont, backpacked the Whites (over Mt. Washington, of course), and backpacked in Rocky Mountain National Park. Each of these activities was selected, planned, and led by the elected leaders of the troop or patrol involved. Any coaching they got was on their request. Typical? No, but obviously possible for Scouts from an inner ring suburb with the right training, support, and example. The Scouts also elect to tent out twelve months a year, but it's largely example as it has been this way since at least 1981. It started when the troop they shared a klondike cabin with was "too" noisy in January, 1980, and they decided tenting was more pleasant, even when -17ºF nominal. The majority of campouts ARE "troop" outings. Some are multiple patrols less than the Troop. Others, as indicated, involve a single patrol. Some are with patrols from other troops. It is what they chose, having been told what the Patrol Method involves and what their roles are in patrol and troop. Over the years, they have noticed its not the norm, and take pride in that fact. Our SPL was SPL of the Klondike one year, and when his adult "advisor" started getting too advisy at the awards ceremony, he gave the high sign to the ASPL (from a different troop), who whipped a tarp off a nearby rocking chair labeled "ADVISOR." The adult, a good guy who has led NYLT, instantly got the message and sat down and rocked with a big grin on his face. "That," he told me after the awards ceremony ended, "is why we do this." Troop 504, that I am hoping to join, meets twice a month, with its patrols meeting weekly. I don't know the history, but it seems to be working viewed from outside.

A discussion of the Patrol Method, benefits from a shared understanding of what that B.S.A. "method" involves. We lack that shared understanding. Nor do we share an understanding of what the "troop method" might be. I contend that the "troop method" is as much exemplified by the "boy-led troop" that does not follow the "Patrol Method" as by a troop in which the adults do the leading without the other aspects of the Patrol Method. I contend that, as shown by the B.S.A. pronouncements above, the Patrol Method is expressly far more than just youth leading. I fact, It is especially, the concept that the Scouting experience centers on the Patrol - hence the "Patrol Method" rather than the "Boy Led Troop Method." "The Scout Way of Developing Leadership This training is carried out by giving to the boy through the Patrol System, opportunities for learning how to lead, by handling a small group, gang or Patrol. But if we are to get results, this responsibility must be a real one, and not merely one on paper. A Scoutmaster who does not make It his Principal objective to use his Patrol Leaders, rather than himself, to put over what he wants done, is failing, and need not be surprised if the result is a failure too. For a Troop to be successful in Scouting, the boys must live, move and have their being, in the Patrol." . . . One, two, three, four or five Patrols may form a Troop, but the Patrols are the working unit whenever practical and the Troop organization is designed to provide supervision, coordination, institutional loyalty and service." Boy Scouts of America, The Patrol Method, 1938 ed. at p. 2. Thus, the troop supplies administrative support to the patrols which collectively form a troop - "supervision, coordination, institutional loyalty and service" - a league in which the patrol teams play the game of Scouting. “Your Boy Scout troop is made up of patrols, with each patrol’s members sharing responsibility for the patrol’s success.” B.S.A., The Boy Scout Handbook, 13th Ed. (2015) at p. 25. I urge that Scoutmasters should surely take pride in the success of their troop - their league, but the real measure of success is the accomplishments of the teams, the patrols, within that league. How are your teams doing, Mr. Scoutmaster?

Any idea who made this decision or at what level it was made?

You could try Google. Lots of troops have websites.

I was reading an account of the serial murders of Osages (to get their oil "head rights") in the 1920's, and the author mentioned Pawhuska Troop 1 and its claim to be the "first troop in America." Certainly very early.

You could ask, or thy to find someone close to him/her to ask. If you are CIA material, you could engage the Scouter in a probing conversation about what to get ANOTHER Scouter. Some of the new self-inflating foam-filled air mattresses are super comfortable and insulating. Alps ("Hiker Direct" dept) had a discount sale for Scouters on a 3"-thick model -70% off. Lesser but still nice (>50%) discounts for Scouters every day on Alps stuff at Hiker Direct. If you are thinking knife, be sure there is not some local-option zero-tolerance rule that would get in the way of certain knives. Is the Scouter willing to wipe off and oil regularly? if not, stainless steel might be an important feature of a knife gift. Is the Scouter OK with sharpening? A good diamond sharpener (Even WallyWorld has them.) might be appreciated.

“[The patrol members] interact in a small group outside the larger troop context, working together as a team and sharing the responsibility of making their patrol a success.” B.S.A., Scouting.org (2017)[emphasis added] “ Scouting happens in the context of a patrol.” B.S.A., Scoutmaster Position Specific Training (current syllabus) “[The patrol is] the place where boys learn skills together, take on leadership responsibilities, perhaps for the first time . . . . ” B.S.A. Scouting.org., (2014) “Patrols are where Scouts learn citizenship at the most basic level. . . . ” B.S.A., Scouting.org. (2017) “Patrols will sometimes join with other patrols to learn skills and complete advancement requirements.” B.S.A., Scouting.org (2017)[emphasis added] “A patrol takes pride in its identity, and the members strive to make their patrol the best it can be.” B.S.A., Scouting.org (2017) “Your Boy Scout troop is made up of patrols, with each patrol’s members sharing responsibility for the patrol’s success.” B.S.A., The Boy Scout Handbook, 13th Ed. (2015) at p. 25 “Patrol spirit is the glue that holds the patrol together and keeps it going. Building patrol spirit takes time, and because it is shaped by a patrol's experiences—good and bad.” B.S.A., Scouting.org, 2017 "The Patrol Leaders bring the needs and wants of their respective patrols to The Patrol Leaders’ Council and the members democratically select the troop program." B.S.A., bsahandbook.org (2017) "Patrols are the building blocks of a Boy Scout troop. A patrol is a small group of boys who are similar in age, development, and interests. Working together as a team, patrol members share the responsibility for the patrol's success. They gain confidence by serving in positions of patrol leadership. All patrol members enjoy the friendship, sense of belonging, and achievements of the patrol and of each of its members." B.S.A., Scouting.org (2017) "The patrol method isn’t one way to run a troop. It’s the only way. B.S.A., Scouting (2014)(currently posted https://blog.scoutingmagazine.org/ 2014/09/05/patrol-method/ Obviously, that last must be read in light if what B.S.A. tolerates. "The Scout Way of Developing Leadership This training is carried out by giving to the boy through the Patrol System, opportunities for learning how to lead, by handling a small group, gang or Patrol. But if we are to get results, this responsibility must be a real one, and not merely one on paper. A Scoutmaster who does not make It his Principal objective to use his Patrol Leaders, rather than himself, to put over what he wants done, is failing, and need not be surprised if the result is a failure to? For a Troop to be successful in Scouting, the boys must live, move and have their being, in the Patrol. . . . One, two, three, four or five Patrols may form a Troop, but the Patrols are the working unit whenever practical and the Troop organization is designed to provide supervision, coordination, institutional loyalty and service. Boy Scouts of America, The Patrol Method, 1938 ed. at p. 2.

"Moderator bias"? You do know the mods do this thankless task as a good turn to Boy Scouting? There is no "Troop Method" in Boy Scouting. There are simply adults, including some at B.S.A., who either do not believe in Boy Scouting as formally defined by B.S.A. for generations, or do not know what that definition is. The latter is quite understandable given the failure of B.S.A. to coherently define the Patrol Method for decades. It is also understandable given that BSA and its councils not only tolerate adult failure to supply Boy Scouting but do not even do the simple things that might be done, and have been done in the past, to encourage the use of Boy Scouting, such as recognizing those units which follow B.S.A. policy on the Patrol Method. It is far more understandable to me that those adult volunteers who sincerely do not believe in the Patrol Method will not use it than that persons employed by B.S.A. and its councils will not support with behavior the words that B.S.A. publishes - do not walk the talk. The most obvious manifestation, but not by any means the only behavior, that shows the belief system of the non-complying adult volunteers is their refusal to allow Scouts to freely elect their leadership: "They will pick the wrong ones." That canard was offered to explain why in fully 2/3 of the troops represented at a roundtable in 1986 adults reported that they appointed patrol leaders and SPLs. It is a short step to having adults plan and lead the program becasue "We do a better job." Nor, with respect, do I think this thread should be about "Which came first," although Scouting started with patrols and had independent patrols into 1969, however much that sincerely seems like "folly" to one of us. 1911 1930s 1969 I add that the the Troop Log of Troop 43, in which I was a Scout, began with the report of the meeting of the Eagle Patrol of the First Asbury Methodist-Episcopal Church. The real issue is, or ought to be, whether official B.S.A. program will be provided to the Scouts, why that should be done (beyond authority) or why it is an inferior idea to the the non-patrol method, sometime called the "troop method" or "boy-led troop method." "The Scout Way of Developing Leadership This training is carried out by giving to the boy through the Patrol System, opportunities for learning how to lead, by handling a small group, gang or Patrol. But if we are to get results, this responsibility must be a real one, and not merely one on paper. A Scoutmaster who does not make It his Principal objective to use his Patrol Leaders, rather than himself, to put over what he wants done, is failing, and need not be surprised if the result is a failure to? For a Troop to be successful in Scouting, the boys must live, move and have their being, in the Patrol. . . . One, two, three, four or five Patrols may form a Troop, but the Patrols are the working unit whenever practical and the Troop organization is designed to provide supervision, coordination, institutional loyalty and service. Boy Scouts of America, The Patrol Method, 1938 ed. at p. 2.

I am not sure exactly what you mean. Surely, since 1969, a "Boy Scout" (TM B.S.A) is registered in a "troop," which may consist of as few as five Scouts, and in this area often has under ten active Scout members. Much of what Bill wrote about a patrol's (and its PL's) role in a troop makes less sense in this declining age when many "troops" are patrol size. Beyond that fact, since 1930 B.S.A. has insisted that a Boy Scout primarily experiences Boy Scouting in the context of a "small" team of Boy Scouts called a "patrol," which is to have separate "life," "spirit," and program. If you mean to say that patrols, when operating separately from other Boy Scouts, are not engaged in "scouting," you disagree with B.S.A. and all the "authorities" down through the history of Scouting and of B.S.A. Do you feel adults can deny patrols any separate life and still call it "Boy Scouting"? Wouldn't that more fairly be called the "Troop Method," and where do I find that method defined in B.S.A. literature? "The patrol method isn’t one way to run a troop. It’s the only way.” B.S.A., Scouting.org (2014) “You join a patrol, or raise a patrol yourself….” Baden-Powell, Scouting for Boys (1908) “The Patrol System is the one essential feature in which Scout training differs from that of all other organizations….” Baden-Powell, Aids to Scoutmastership at p. 29. “Unless the patrol method is in operation, you don’t really have a Boy Scout troop.” B.S.A., Scouting.org (citing Baden-Powell) (September, 2015) “The patrol method isn’t one way to run a troop. It’s the only way.” B.S.A., Scouting.org (2014)

B-P's advice to a boy who wanted to become a Scout was to join a patrol or get together a patrol. The issue, to B-P and Bill and B.S.A. in 2017 (according to what they write most of the time), is where the Scouts spend their Scouting time. The bulk is supposed to be spent in the small group context, with a number of claimed benefits. Same theory since 1907 in the UK and 1930 in the U.S., although UK "Patrol System" still has adult-appointed leaders (I am told by Scouters and the Scouting Association. Cambridge? ). That idea, or Bill's "Patrol Method," is hardly inconsistent with multiple patrols in a "troop." My very Patrol Method troop as a Scout had six patrols and two Explorer crews (after 1958 two Senior Scout patrols). Bill repeatedly said that a Patrol Leader, after his loyalty to his patrol, owed loyalty to his troop, being part of the troop leadership team. But you know that. A single team makes for a rather limited "season." Our council for decades has had many "troops" with fewer than ten active Scouts. They are "troops" because BSA since 1969, judged by behavior, wants Boy Scout "units" to be "troops" and only "troops." Before 1969, BSA was OK with registered patrols ("Neighborhood Patrols"). If the adults would let these mini-troops be run by Scouts, they would not be far enough away from the small group dynamic to get upset about - 8, 9, 10 - NBD. It's just a label at that scale. Given the near death of the Patrol Method (and coincidentally, Scouting as a particularly relevant movement) in the U.S. (market share now under 5%), it would hardly be surprising for Scouts to opt for the familiar - the troop, perhaps even the norm among troops around here - the troop run by adults. It is harder to be responsible than to let someone else run the camping/play club for boys, especially when the principal authority figures communicate by word and, especially, deed that they are supposed to be in charge and resist the Patrol Method - that has probably never been explained to them. The argument is that, since whatever this we are trying is spiraling downhill, why not try Boy Scouting as defined since 1930 and as officially defined today -- whether enforced, encouraged, or even taught coherently. It might work. It was working better than what we have today when official training stopped explaining the Patrol Method circa the dawn of the "Improved Scouting Program." The Patrol Method was not eliminated, per the national head of training until a couple of years ago, merely "misplaced," along with much of the "Outdoor Method." Yes, many things have changed in forty-five years other than BSA fumbling training. Society has changed. More things to do. Adults reluctant to join anything. But some think we might try again, in basic structure and program, what did work. If not, stop pretending. Declare the age of the "troop method." and be done with it. And given everything else that you know about B-P and the "Patrol System," yes:, "pushing buttons."