skeptic

While the political issue is real, and BSA also does not allow politically related actions, the idea is worthwhile from the young people's perspective. My issue here is the apparent nastiness of the Girl Scouts, though we may not be seeing the whole picture. On the other hand, based on some of their verbiage in relation to girls being allowed in BSA and similar confrontations, thye are not known for being diplomatic. At least not from my observations.

There is a lot of hearsay that is out there of units that are simply doing it But I do not know of anything directly from National. It is simply logical and common sense. Having done summer camp with girl troops, and also COR, there is no real issue except from the fringe that cannot find change as positive and making sense, or who are frozen in some outdated concpet of genders somehow noncompatible. As noted, YP is the key, and that has always been the case.

With the emphasis on the Citizenship in Society MB, as well as the struggles to find membership in small units, the comment made regarding Coed units is important. I hope that National will recognize that as something needed, while still allowing separate units if they so choose. Our unit has struggled for years due to location and population changes, and we tried to generate a girl unit alone, but it folded fairly soon. We have more girls in our connect pack than boys, and they "want" to join the troop, as it is, but as a patrol. Personally, I think that is the best avenue to use going forward. Stop trying to adhere to biased studies related to adolescents and genders mixing, and simply assure YP is solid and in place.

I think there is some kind of bug in closets of older people. Though, I do know a few old friends that have gone the other direction, and one old HS flame that can still fit in her HS clothes. Her now almost forty daughter used to wear her mom's old HS stuff when she was in HS herself, especially for those throw back days.

This is one of the numerous judgment calls from my perspective. The Insignia Guide notes certain limitations, but ultimately, they are not absolutes as long as the owner can field objections by the Uniform Police. So, do what is right for you and deal with the nonsense as able. Not worth a serious verbal debate. JMHO of course. And, since I no longer am able to wear mine due to girth, I guess I could just turn it into a hanger brag rag of some sort.

If this is an accurate comment, it IS a poor and, to me, unfathomable situation. Obviously, we are only seeing part of the issue, but I would hope there may be other adults in the shared district that might work to help. While this Forum might offer some aid, you may find more by reviewing FB for local district and council pages, and maybe nearby units. I am fairly confident that someone might respond with a post to one of those, though I could be wrong. Good luck, and please look beyond your own unit for possible aid. And now, I need to respond to a youth on a merit badge we began last year.

So, tell me again that the legal buzzards are not getting fed. Meanwhile, those that should be first are last, or so it seems. Only in this country I fear is this somehow found okay by many.

And not just with skills. The PL Council, or Green Bar Council was the go to for both youth advancement on basic skills for the lower ranks, but also were the judges and juries for most issues of discipline or unit functions. Adults sat in to observe, and only if absolutely required would they use their adult power, and often even then it was taken to the committee if needed. Peer pressure is a good thing, and the expectation that you are NOT performing skills properly, as monitored by the peer group, is very powerful. And IF some type of disciplinary function was needed, it too was more likely to be accepted due to the peer issue, understanding that the adult leaders and committee still had the final say. But that was rarely something that happened, and I saw more than one scout turn their attitudes around when confronted by the PLC.

From my old guy view, only as a feedback for the actual approval of the SM or his assigned adult proxy. Part of the role of a SM is to mentor, and Scout Spirit is a primary element of that description. Still, the older days, when the PLC actually did boards for the lower ranks, is a great loss to today's leadership training, at least in my view. The take over by adults of the advancement board was one of the many changes that has catered to the concept that youth are not able to make sound judgements. Again, just my view, though we see the results of NOT allowing young adults to actually become adults in society, now reflected in the dearth of able leadership. Old guy venting.

Rover Scouts were used for a period in the thirties and forties, mostly fo special groups such as staffs and, in one case here, a place for some long cruise Sea Scouts to have like an alumni group of those that made trips to the Arctic from our area. I discovered the two units buried in our records, one for camp staff of our local camp, and the other the Sea Scout group. Cards and charters in a file and now in archives.

And that is simply a very poor reflection on both groups, or actually on those that make those types of decisions for them. Just like in many units, the worst problems too often are related to the so-called adults in the rooms. IF they were focused on the youth, they would do what is best for all.

Interesting that the news article noted the likelihood of a large percentage of false claims having been generated in this mess. It is sad that this Scouter that mentored so many over such a period was put through this. I would like to perhaps hear how the false accusation came about, since the Joh Doe recanted under oath. Why did he do it? I suspect it has some connection to less than honest legal birds I so distain. So, we have a man falsely accused who is now in his own way a "survivor"? How many more may appear? The pendulum may swing some more. While the Survivors that are real need to be acknowledged, so too should those accused wrongly recognized and publicly exonerated.

The worse part of what we are led to believe is that technically they also cannot hang with friends outside of scouting that do not meet the age restrictions. This is one of the many muddied interpretations. When I was in HS, I turned 18 before I graduated and at the time was on the baseball team in school, and some school groups. The YP today would suggest that I could no longer play on the HS baseball team because it had youth under 18, nor could I go to dances or social activities of the school and mix with my younger classmates. Common sense continues to take a back seat to paranoia in our society and its linked legal maze.

Sadly, the SE has finagled the board to his control more or less, and getting COR's to actually do their job is very hard. In theory, they could fire the SE, but unless a cooperative wave occurs, that will not happen, and attempts to get a list of all of them has been denied as private, even thogh it should not be. The President told me he would assure as many of them as possible would meet with him, but only time will tell. I hope the President is doing a stealth maneuver. Will see.

Certainly an issue with ours, sadly. We continue to flounder with most of the things noted not in clear use, and some missing for the most part. Volunteers, even those of us that have struggled in the past, are frustrated and we are not able to get clarity and straight info, or so it seems. Our Council board President assures us they are working on this, but it is very slow, just smoke and mirrors. I hope it is not the latter. Meanwhile, our only viable camp is shuttered, and the SE has insulted so many unit and district volunteers that the list is likely pages long. Will be interesting to see if some ideas to fix may show, but frankly, it is unclear if we have a way around the SE.

Just about my favorite poem. It, along with Crossing the Bar more and more come to mind for some reason. Both of course relate to getting old and entering that unknown.

Anyone caring to dig a bit, and have an open mind to look beyond the surface can discover indicators that BP's early efforts were more military focussed, but fairly soon changed to working to guide the youth of the time to be better citizens. Similarly, a close look at the BSA in the teens into the run up to WWII certainly show a similar emphasis, though obviously colored by the period in history. The serious and willing historians for the the program seem to have evolved to the concept of citizenship and responsibility and away from the direct military focus of some of the earliest knockoffs. Lost to many is the societal respect of Scouting, especially in BSA in the first half century or so. Chivalry and simple respect somehow fell by the wayside for some reason in many places, and the foolish "insult" of calling someone "such a Boy Scout" gained traction for some reason over time, and the concepts that are the foundation of Scouting fell into limbo of some type. Yet who, with any basic concern for others and our society could seriously say the tenets of Scouting are somehow bad? If just the Oath and Law were seen as important in broader society, we would have far fewer issues. JMHO of course, and I will be 80 soon.

It is often difficult to admit much of what we did then, prior to the seventies during the high point of Scouting participation was a bit dangerous. But most of us also were pretty aware it was. Still, helmets for bikes, seatbelts, not riding in the back of open trucks, and swimming in n inspected water all were more dangerous than we realized. On the other hand, that very thing made us more aware of our surroundings and challenged us to deal with obversities at times. But the concept that somehow we can make life, and its living, completely safe and sanitary is ignorant. Time again for my favorite stance; Balance along with the concept of Common Sense.

Did they drum up any new members?

Sadly, most likely would get hit by local health authority.

Yes, that was my intent. Sorry. We have chosen to no longer do the Popcorn, as it is NOT a good look due to the prices and such. Also, with YP, keeping scouts in front of stores and so on is challenging should we say? Thank you.

They cannot do that, period. They might though not allow a unit to participate IF they do other stuff too. But, the unit, as long as it is within the rules of National fund raising, can choose whatever they prefer. Now dealing with such a demand is dicy I would guess, but if you have a strong unit with good support, you can suggest some sand pounding I believe, but in a Scoutlike way.

Fine lines exist on how to challenge young people, or even adults. Many, likely most, would not be damaged by once common stunts like the snipe hunt. But, in the modern era, too many youth are unprepared for even a small amount of teasing, and too many parents overreact to it when it occurs. Society will not protect us from our own mental challenges and fears. Care needs to be taken, but much of that is the so called responsible adult being aware if someone is showing stress and removing them from the focus at a minimum, and maybe reviewing things with other adults and even the youth. It is often a judgment call, but awareness, as noted, by those in charge should always be a part of the issues. One of my favorite concepts; Balance.

Some irony here. I have been trying to update my YP off and on now for a few weeks. I use Chrome most of the time, but it will not work at all for some reason, even after assuring the background is cleaned out. Got on earlier using Edge, which I do not prefer. It locked up, and now I am in limbo with the first retake segment. Of course, it should have worked with Chrome, and the hangup is just very annoying. Yet, I get an email about my renewal needed constantly. Guess I will try again later.

As long as individuals or groups try to paint a picture of Child Sexual Abuse in the BSA that is not the truth, then these untruths will continue to be called out. Absolutely true; and the premise plays both directions.