skeptic

Here you go; appears to be a conservative organization with ties, or direct connections with the Koch family. Certainly the main supposed idea behind them is to strengthen, though education and study the understanding of the basic documents of our country's origin. That is something that is obviously important. Now, whether their offerings to educators and students are possibly overly conservative might be of concern to some; but it also may be of help in allowing more balance to some. But, if a scout gets some funding, what is the harm; whether you re comfortable with their personal politics or not? Do not let paranoia drive you away from possibly simply another educational aid. http://www.kochfamilyfoundations.org/ProjectsaBRI.asp

Agree; a big let down.

According to "Bryan on Scouting", there will be a segment from Texas tonight on some of a guy's collection of memorabilia. Might be fun.

There is, or was, one on one of the spoof sites. Do not know where or when; if googled and not there, then has gone away most likely.

Almost nothing will ever have one hundred percent agreement; even the most obvious subjects will be debated by "someone" using skewed and twisted logic (at least to them). We teach second graders how to try and discern "opinion" from "fact"; yet very often that skill seems to be lacking in these discussions. Our existence is mostly some shade of grey. We can deny all we want, but we all have some type of "prejudice"; it just depends on how you perceive something and how you were raised. How we respond to that prejudice is the real problem, not having it. Very few of us can claim, in reality, that emotion does not sometimes shade our thought process (or lack of it occasionally), and therefore our response. Just because we disagree about things does not make those with whom we disagree "stupid, ignorant, dumb, perverted, and so on. It is simply a disagreement! "Compromise" is not one sided; and it is useless without allowing it to happen at some point. Statistics are dependent on "opinion"; they do not make opinion. Experts can make anything seem to be supported in one direction or another. The actual "study" subject, the questions, the people queried, how they were queried (and even where and when), individual bias, the size of the study, and many other variable all are part of the outcome. If you reach far enough you are likely to find some type of connection between two ideas or persons. Whether you believe absolutely in creation or in evolution, at some point we all share ancestors in one form or another. I am sure others can add many additional things to this list. My point is that all too often we cannot seem to get past our first "knee jerk" to some ideas or conceptions. But, at some point, we need to accept that we can argue to the depth of eternity, but we will not convince everyone we are right, accept we may be wrong. At some point, usually within the first two or three pages of comments here, we have reached a dead-end; the place where neither argument will realistically change the other side of the debate.

Just in case anyone is interested: February 8th and 9th Oxnard Elks' Lodge #1443 801 South A Street Oxnard, Ca. 93030 Contacts: Greg Metzgus coppersmith@sprintmail.com Bill Sternberg bigjockewing@yahoo.com Friday night check in 5PM; Fish dinner available at lodge; setup and seller interaction. Saturday: Silent auctions starting at 9:30AM approx; number depends on donations; Break for lunch (lodge usually has hotdogs and burgers available with fries and soda) Final live auction of "better (?)" items. About 12:30.

These links were posted on scouts-L and are very interesting. A bit cumbersome, but some of the comments are very telling. If National actually pays attention and responds it could be very helpful program wide. Here are two links regarding this: http://www.scouting.org/filestore/mission/pdf/VOS2012SpringCycleFullReport_Spring2012.pdf http://www.scouting.org/filestore/mission/pdf/VoSExecutiveSummary_Spring12.pdf

I had similar issues, and had to have one come to my place and use my computer so I could watch what he was doing and sort it out. Not sure why he had trouble, as it only took a short time on my machine; but it may have been his using the wrong browser. I have had issues with Java and IE; it does not keep its update. So, since Chrome works for the training, but not the recharter, I used it. The other one was an email change that no one seemed able to reattach to his number, so it would not let him do anything. He finally did a completely non attached training and printed the cert, which I attached to the charter. We had one more glitch because of the delay, and had to get permission to sign the paperwork, with a contact number, for the minister, who had gone out of town after Christmas. I now have to go and get it to back up the "signed for", and also get the agreement signed, as the DE did not do it this year as he has done the past two. My main concern was that the past two years I had one hold out who they still took payment for and left on the charter, even though he never completed it. It is simply on the bottom as incomplete. This year I dropped him directly, as I still could not get him to finish it (he is busy and hates computers too). But, with all the YP and related things in the news, one would think that non-completed names would drop automatically after say 90 days, and a refund of paid fees be made, so something to that effect.

While I personally believe these modern versions of movies and games very likely have some effect on a few people, the fascination with violence and so on is not new. Think about the gatherings of people in the ancient periods to watch gladiators and people fighting for their lives against lions. We have evidence of similar lure to violence in the mobs that gathered to watch hangings, or the people that are observers, but do nothing to stop violence on the streets. Of course there is the so called gentleman's sport of boxing, and the worse ultimate fighter interchanges. Add into that the inhumane things such as dog and cock fighting, bull fighting, and so on. Does the more graphic abilities in the movies and games today add to the possible corruption of weak minds? Possibly. But, the fact that for whatever reason, many of us are drawn to these things, at least passively, is a fact. I would like to hope I would never become a serial killer, yet I have still found Dexter, The Sopranos, and the ilk to be somehow fascinating. Maybe the trick is being able to notice when someone appears to be stepping over that psychological line to perhaps become a threat.

Here is the second part of the sheet of paper I found. Dear Fellow Citizen: I have the pleasure of being a member of a committee to raise fifty billion dollars to be used for placing a statue of Truman in the "Hall of Fame" in Washington D. C. We have not decided not to tease it by placing it next to Washington - who never told a lie, nor next to Lincoln, who was known as Honest Abe. It should not, either, be put next to Thomas Jefferson who served a third term. The committee was in quite a quibble. But after much and careful deliberation we decided to put it next to Columbus who didn't know where he was going; did not know where he was when he got there; didn't know where he had been when he returned; and did it all on borrowed money. The manuscript to be put on the Statue will read; "I pledge allegiance to Harry S. Truman, and to the independence for which he stands, one man indispensable, with corruption for all". Five thousand years ago Moses said, "Pick up thy shovel, mount the ass and camel, and I will take you to the Promised Land". Five thousand years later Truman said, "Lay down thy shovel, sit on your ass, light up a Camel, because this is the Promised Land. If you are one of those who have any money left after taxes have been paid, we will expect a liberal contribution from you immediately. Yours truly,

My grandfather was a life long republican and pretty straight laced; so this piece I found in his old papers was interesting, as well as amusing. Dear Mr. Anthony: I am a sailor in the United States Navy, and I also have a cousin who is a Democrat. My father has epilepsy and my mother has syphilis, so neither of them works. They are totally dependent on my two sisters, who are prostitutes in Louisville, because my only brother is serving a life term in prison for rape and murder. I am in love with a streetwalker who operates near our base. She knows nothing of my family background but says that she loves me. We intend to get married as soon as she settles her bigamy case, which is now in court. When I get out of the Navy we intend to move to Detroit and open a small house. My problem, Mr. Anthony, is this: In view of the fact that I intend to make this girl my wife and bring her into my family, should I, or should I not, tell her about my cousin who is a Democrat? G. Whizz

Pack; read the first entry, and it will all clear up, hopefully.

Find it odd that after twelve years of this issue, the possible final resolution brings barely a nod. At least common sense appears to have won out this time.

Well, we took cubs and scouts to an assisted living place on Friday evening, and I wore my other Santa hat, the one with pins on it with seasonal quotes, including "Jesus is the Reason for the Season", and we sang both secular and religious songs, and I read the poem. No complaints, just lots of smiles and some following along. "Merry Christmas to all, and to all a goodnight!"

Assuming they do not drag this any further, the question arises as to whether the ACLU will now have to return the settlement paid by the city to get removed from the suit?

Your point with your quote? This was the statement as to why the lawsuit was brought; and the court ruled otherwise. So, why are you posting this?

Ninth Circuit finally gets it right. http://www.latimes.com/news/local/la-me-boy-scouts-20121221,0,2116614.story

FScouter; apparently the NRA agrees with you to some extent. See their AM announcement. "ALL" issues could be solved by only one ban; "IGNORANCE".

While the program is simply a major element in my own life, it still has to take a back seat to personal issues at times. As a senior scouter with no skin in the game other than my own interests, I have more time. But, I try to make my scouts' families understand that the troop is not the first priority; simply let me know if there are other responsibilities and so on so we can plan appropriately. Basically, it is family, school, possibly church, then scouting; and sometimes seasonal sports before the unit. I expect a scout to keep average or better grades, especially if going for the higher ranks, where it is one of my determinants regarding progress up. Also expect them to be active, cooperative members of their own families. Totally understand parents with other children being less invested, specially if the others are not in scouting. Always is a balance line for everything in our lives. That line is easier prior to, or after family and work priorities. But, we all also know a few senior scouters for whom the program is their family now. Have seen more than one elderly scouter for whom the program and fellowship has been his or her savior. I have nothing but respect for them. But I also know, when they had family around, it took precedence. Merry Christmas; or happy seasonal wishes as you prefer.

http://blog.scoutingmagazine.org/2012/12/20/bsa-chief-visits-newtown-presents-spirit-of-the-eagle-award-to-tiger-cubs-parents/

In 1960 we had the then young and very attractive Lennon Sisters, and 13 year old Brenda Lee who had just had her big hit, "I'm Sorry". So, headliners were found back then too.

I subbed yesterday in a fourth grade class for part of the day. When checking in, I casually mentioned I had remembered to bring my Santa hat and a favorite copy of THE NIGHT BEFORE CHRISTMAS to read if time was available. They informed me that I could not wear the hat, and only read the story to myself; NO holiday clothing or allusions are allowed. I have a white beard, and every year at this season some children ask if I am connected to Santa in some manner. The older ones are just trying to be funny, but the younger ones often are serious. Had one of the class girls ask me twice if I might be able to let Santa know she would not be home, but at her uncle's. Told her I would do my best. But, then I could not help but think about what they told me at check in. Just a bit depressing. This whole thing has been beat to death before; but it still astounds me that somehow we are forced to cater to a very small minority because they do not have enough individual strength to simply believe what they choose, and let others do the same. So, Merry Christmas to all that celebrate; and a festive something or other to those that do not. Just please accept that my wishes are not taking any thing away from your personal beliefs.

It is all because those of us from earlier days were allowed to play cowboys and indians, have cap guns, and watch those horribly violent B movies with Tom Mix and Hoppy. So some pass it on to their children and grandchildren who add the influence of video games.

Any average family, even in California, should be able to live on 100K per year comfortably. But they would have to actually budget and live within their means, rather than their wants. There lies the biggest problem with too many families. You do not need a new car regularly, and leasing them is a waste since for the same cost you can own it outright within 4 to 5 years, then drive it another 8 to 10 or even more. Am almost seventy, and have only had 5 cars, all of which were owned. Also have driven economy level for 40 years. Never saw the need to buy things I could not really afford; yet never starved, or felt deprived. Have more clothes than I ever will wear, so why do I need more? I would wager that over three quarters of the families in this country could live on half of what they spend, if they simply understood need versus want. In Scouting, it has been my observation that the scouts that had to earn their way financially for major activities, either partly or totally, always seemed to be the ones most enjoying things. Know that was the case for me at jamboree in 1960, and noted it in 1985 within the troop I served as ASM, and two Philmont expeditions. Extends even to summer camp for most kids. The ones whining and least willing to participate fully are the ones that refused to participate in fund raising because their parents would pay. Ironically, boys that choose to not work at all are also the ones that complain they did not get to do something when their parents cannot afford it. While we are retired and have SS and Medicare, our combined income is no more than $40k, before taxes. Yet we are comfortable and able to share at times with kids and grandkids. Compared to the rest of the world, our country is simply spoiled. Even our poor are way better off than most. That is why it is so sad that we have kids going hungry. I can guarantee that many of these children's parents have the latest phones and so on, cable and more than one tv, and often new, or close to new cars. They also likely smoke, drink too much, and possibly use drugs. Just another reflection of the selfishness too prominent in many here. Maybe it was being raised by parents that were teens in the depression. I know to this day that I seldom waste food; I turn off lights; I repair things if I can, rather than simply throw them away. So don't expect me to feel sorry for those that have made far more than we have over the years, yet are now unable to live in comfort.

One perspective on this thread. https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?v=10151195531403915