skeptic

The age thing is affecting our unit directly, and very seriously. Currently, I have no adults that can actively do real back packing or more advanced camping. While I can do the drive ins still, and day hikes are generally within my "eventual" capabilities, the more serious things we did at one time have fallen by the wayside. And frankly, that is not helping with the unit getting real growth. Summer camp had myself at 69, a 67 year old grandfather, and a 53 year old parent about 150 pounds overweight. We all survived, but that was summer camp. We went on a day hike last week of a few miles on an easy botanical trail above town. I had one 40 something with the boys, as I had to wait for a late scout, and the other two older adults stayed with me. We reached a point where there are a series of steps up the steeper hillside, made from ties, and the other two adults with me, both younger, chose (correctly) to not take the challenge. I fortunately was still able; but I had to rest three or four times. Last trip to Philmont in 1990 I was in my mid forties, and it was definitely much harder on me than the one in 1979, even though the itinerary was shorter and less strenuous. I keep trying to find some younger adults to get the outdoor program back on track; but it is Catch 22 of course. Once the program slides backwards, it is just much harder to find someone to step in when they know that they are going to be given much more than they may wish to take on. If it was not for the history of the unit, we are over 90 years old, I probably would have let it go by now. But, being a historian and feeling that the program is still worthwhile, even at the level at which we are currently working, I cannot yet do that. My two best prospects from the unit moved on, as is to be expected, though not out of scouting, just out of the area. Am in contact with many of my past scouts and still hope I may yet get one or two back into the unit. Have three young boys coming in soon, and may see something develop with one of their parents. Can only keep working it I guess.

Depends; if you are older it certainly would be "wise".

Happened onto a broadcast of the National LDS meeting going on, or that went on. My local church broadcasts its service from the previous week normally at 9AM on our local public station; but the LDS program was running most of the day instead. Anyway, listened a bit to one of the major leaders talking about God's love and their interpretations. He really stressed, numerous ways, that ALL are deserving of God's love and forgiveness. Indirectly, he seemed to me to be reinforcing the idea that they, the church, needs to love ALL people, even the ones that are not of their faith or beliefs. Also noted that while it was an LDS program, the speakers sounded like any other Christian denomination in their references to God and Christ. In about a fifteen minute period, quoting from scripture, the Book of Mormon was mentioned only once very briefly; but the basic bible was core material. Interesting, at least to me.

Yep, I think that is it. Was close; but not playing horse shoes.

Please correct me if I am mistaken, but the original World Crest that had to be earned was larger I think. Seems to me there was a time when you could still earn the large one, even while the small one was available. Am too lazy to go digging through stuff to verify, so taking the easy way out here.

My friend whose son just joined a pack as a Webelos is a good example of this. They are spiritual but not religious and do not belong to an church. The den leader is insisting that every scout earn the religious medal for requirement 8 because 'that is how we do it in our pack.' So the family has a choice, pull out of scouting or join a church to fulfill the requirement. Neither accomplishes the goal of the requirement. I see it as just another way BSA is used to support discrimination. What about just going to another pack that is less demanding and out of the loop? And it is not the BSA that is doing this; it is a particular misinformed and didactic leader who really needs to be shaken by a local Cub committee or similar district level person or group. Or maybe someone simply needs to go to the COR; maybe they are not aware of this.

And shall we add in the voting right restrictions so popular in Red states and the continued attempts to limit the rights of women in regard to birth issues?

I would suggest that no body there should be throwing rocks, as they all live in glass houses with paper thin walls. Like the woman on Las Vegas TV said the first morning of this nonsense; they ALL are like a bunch of spoiled kids in the sandbox, and they are throwing sand in our faces.

One of my 14 year old scouts last night sat down at my desk and pulled a magnet with the Bill of Rights on it off the filing cabinet. When asked what he was doing, since the others were supposedly working on improving their lashing skills, he said he wanted to see what parts the president had changed. Did not really know what to say, as I know his parents are pretty right leaning, and so suggested nothing was changed, but interpretations can be confusing. He did not pursue it further, but it really made me think about how misleading blind political commentary can be. Trouble is, that while he is 14 and actually thought to at least look at the real language, too many of the zealots and ill educated masses who are adults, on both sides, do not.

Sure we do Base; that way they are less likely to make a mistake and learn from it the hard way. And, if something goes wrong, then they have someone else to blame. Remember that in today's society in this country children are not allowed to experience negative events or feelings, as they might grow up emotionally damaged.

Yep; I would review the material with him and act like I was in a classroom when that element comes up. "A Scout is Reverent, and respects the religious customs and traditions of others". So, with that in mind; we do not require him to say the pledge or do any other things against his beliefs. But, he still needs to understand the significance overall and be willing to discuss it. Very likely though that if his family is strict, he will not last long due to too many conflicts.

With most adults, you need 300 feet just to get some sleep at night.

WAKWIB; I think the comments made in the very conservative and anti Gay group are slanted and likely questionable in their suggestions of issues. They are simply alarmist in order to scare some people and maybe a church a sponsor or two. Possibly some of the actual legal experts might weigh in; but it seems to me these are not reflective of the average run of the mill scouters or their sponsors. JMO of course.

NO; absolutely not.

It is highly likely that most youth under 14 or so really do not have a clue about what they really are. They go with what their parents tell them, or what they see as the cool thing to be, or something to that effect. Yes, a few may have actually began to postulate their eventual "adult" belief structure; but for the most part, they are not yet really very rational about it.

While patriotism is often over done and even flaunted by some, there is nothing wrong with using the generic term American. If, for some reason that really is bothersome, then just put whatever you want there; but try and be civil. Geeeez!

Probably will hear about it soon. It just occurred recently and found out it was approved just last week. The goal was specific; to be the youngest ever. Soooo.

As has recently occurred in our council, a parent has worked the system through legal technicalities, threats, and troop and district changing until he got what he wanted, his eleven year old passed through. And, of course, even though he passed, the whole thing has simply left an acid pall over the proceedings. The boy has a lot of potential, and hopefully may yet prove himself; but I have a feeling even he realizes he really should not have passed; but he is too young to stand up to the parental intrigue. Bad example for the boy, and even a worse example for those that know him. It started in cubs where he somehow "earned" every loop and pin available, even though none of the other boys even knew the opportunity was being offered for many of them, and they were last minute by the, you guessed it, parental "leader". Moved into a troop at the absolute minimum age, then transferred soon afterwards when the leadership said he had not satisfactorily met certain requirements and that the "parent was not authorized to sign off stuff like in cubs". Buffaloed the new unit for a few months, then it again hit the fan, eventually resulting in parental legal threats and moving to another unit in a neighboring district. Again worked the system and got a board. Current unit had developed huge concerns, but nobody was willing to stand up to the realities of what went on and force a final challenge at National. Do not make waves is the norm once these things reach a certain stage. The really sad thing is that the boy himself likely would have made it on his own and actually felt good about it; but you can tell he is embarrassed when confronted by those that tried to challenge him early on to "earn" rather than just get blanks signed and then forget, and to prove himself with his peers. Now he has little or no respect even from them. Still, he could grow into it, assuming he stays around long enough with his current peer level issues and the bad feelings generated on the adult level, he will have learned a really good life lesson. Of course, he will have to be able to confront the poor parental example to succeed. One can hope.

Multiple generally refers to either a youth in two types of units, say Venturing and Scouts, or to adults that are registered with the district or council in other positions that require separate applications. They are so only one place gets the money, usually the dominant unit or position.

Not sure where you would get the idea there is no standard. That is pretty much what the Uniform and Insignia Guide is all about I think. It is on line, so you do not have to have a hard copy.

Some people simply do not handle any changes well. For some reason it is always the end of the world. Just ignore. It should have never been removed in the first place IMO.

Just curious if many think this type of thing is really something any state legislative body should be doing, especially with the myriad other concerns for which they seldom find time? I do not disagree we need to be aware of this, but do we really need it in a resolution? Seems to me simply another example of politicizing an issue rather than actually dealing with it. http://leginfo.legislature.ca.gov/faces/billTextClient.xhtml?bill_id=201320140HR23

CAVE PEOPLE They sit or stand, silhouettes within a campfire cave. Unintelligible, animated voices echo, punctuated by laughter, hissing sap, the sudden popping of burning logs. 9-12-03

I think a couple of things. First, these lawyers are simply money grubbers. Look at their web site and tell me they are not, remembering that they get a huge portion of any judgment. They are no better than the people allowed to advertise now on TV looking for someone, anyone who may have had ill effects from drugs, or been in an accident, and so on. They are taking things decades old and beating the bushes until they find someone to cooperate with them because they think they will get rich. Read the actual info on the Ineligible Volunteer files that has been posted, especially the details of those in the sampling done in the research. A majority WERE brought to the authorities, and many were prosecuted; we really do not know how many were specifically not due to lack of concrete evidence, parental choice, or simply the era they were in. And the files DID keep some out by being there, even in the age before computers. It continues to astonish me how people cannot understand that much of the problem with these suits is that the occurrences happened decades ago when the general public and community responses were completely different. It was also before EASY cross referencing by computer, so it had to be done by phone or mail. Of course today, almost any REAL evidence or actual witnesses are gone in most of the cases being DUG out of these files by the ambulance chaser lawyers. Take these facts and add to them the current antipathy by many against the BSA in general, along with the way the media skews everything, and these guys see slam dunks. Does anybody remember the earlier "sexual predator" witch hunts that ruined peoples' lives when most were finally exonerated too late? As some have pointed out, these same people, if they were really trying to help people, would be digging in the far richer fields of schools and youth sports. But, they do not have the same media antipathy or the files that were kept in an attempt to actually keep some of this from occurring. But, as I have often said of late; common sense and actual reason are not generally seen in today's society.

Owning one may only mean there is one in the house; maybe left there by previous generations. Like any book, it is almost useless unless actually read, other than for a door-stop or some such thing.