skeptic

Amen! Thank you for the reminder epistle. I find most of your "advice" posts to be very insightful and to the point. It is great to have such a generally calm, sage voice here on the board. YIS

So, Vol; are you one of the doctors who will quit if health care changes finally occur? Part of the supposedly 40% or so, according to the "truth news station", Fox? Just curious.

Am I again missing something here? Are not the sites mentioned all open to public scrutiny already anyway? If you post anything on a web site, especially these kind, it can be viewed and spread by somebody if they truly wish to. "Hello; Mr. Common-Sense,please come out of hiding!"

Sorry; "old timer disesase" ; forgot the comic relief intended.(This message has been edited by skeptic)

vol: Perhaps the problem lies with your statement. "We lost the war". Somehow I often get the impression that still IS the issue with too many. "We won; they lost". That was over a hundred years ago; maybe it is time to try to put it aside?

"The right sort of camp is an education. It supplements the teaching of the school. ................. "Camp teaches the boy self-reliance, self-support, self-respect ..... "Camp teaches the boy that it is the spirit and the spiritual side of things that count. It is not only in the church that the boy comes close to God. The starry sky above him, the wonders of nature around him, the wild things that live in the woods and the streams reveal God's message."

When you apologize, then get in the media and basically recant the apology, it has little meaning. Putting a disrespectful person on a pedestal as some kind of hero because you dislike the person at whom the disrespect was aimed says as much about you as it does the perpetrator. And there lies the rub. It would likely have mellowed and been put in the background if "crazies" had not immediately made him a martyr. He is not; and now he has negated any pretense of a real apology. The President though, can be the better man, and publicly ask his party members to let it go. He might care to point out to them that he already said he accepted the apology, so they should leave it at that. With the general political environment today, it likely won't; and that is too bad.

Sctldr; Limited funding I can definitely go for; but I would not only limit, but make it funds that they raise, not granted from government in any way. As an adjunct to that, add on a requirement that each would be allowed only "n" number of tv ads, and local markets would be required to donate say 1-3 spots for every local candidate (no national ones). Would never happen of course in this period of history, because the control is not ours. But these kind of things might again allow candidates to run that do not now, due to the ridiculous cost of winning. Also still feel term limits have their place, but they need to be designed far better than most in place now are. JMO

Hopefully, those on these boards that do not see a problem with this type of behavior, do not relay that attitude to their scouts. "Live the Twelve"; "Do Your Best"! Simple, it seems. If we can even come close, it will be an improvement.

Priorities: Assuring most people "can" get coverage, at least at the minimal level. Eliminating overlap in government programs already in place and making them more efficient. (I have been on V.A. since "losing" private coverage due to expense after downsizing. But now I am more or less forced into Medicare too with a $100 a month cost, even though my needs are met by V.A. So far, it does not appear that Medicare will cover my out of pocket for V.A., nor the reverse; and copays for Medicare are relatively high). Making preventive care, especially basic physicals mandatory. This is the dumbest component out there in most "plans". Why would anyone not prefer $300-$500 a year preventive costs in lieu of possibly thousands should something show up due to lack of screening? Just simply does not make sense. Taking profit component out of the public system. That, as has been shown many times, is probably the number one reason for much of the inflation in costs. No denials for preexisting conditions, or cutting people off when it suddenly becomes unprofitable. No clerks, or so called billing specialists, making medical decisions and denying coverage. Only "properly trained" medical specialist should do this. Surely there are other things, but these are the things most irksome and unfair to me at the moment. And, I would like to see opponents of suggested changes and proposals currently offered "publicly" publish their alternate proposals, rather than simply cry "NO" and endorse fear and half truths. (This last one of course would relate to more than just medical care).

mmhardy; Someone will, I can almost guarantee; watch for it tomorrow when the holiday is over and Fox comes back on in hyper mode.

Let's call it what it is; PARANOIA and HATE. This comes directly from the crazies that have found their way into public view with more and more outlandish accusations, off the wall stories, and bigotry. They do not like President Obama, period; and they will say and do anything to try and make his job more difficult. Their biggest fear is that he might actually make some positive change. It also appears some are intimidated by the fact that he has a brain and actually tries to use it. Why do so many of these fanatics seem to denigrate intelligence? The man is certainly not perfect, and obviously, he has made some decisions he likely would change if he could do a "do over". He took over the most difficult job in the world (most likely) and some of the absolute worst problems the country has had in decades. Even if you do not like the man, he is still the president. What are we teaching kids when we give these kinds of examples? Shields up. Just do not send Beck after me, please.(This message has been edited by skeptic)

What do we need to do to block someone and keep it blocked? I have tried to block a number of posters whose nonsense eventually annoys me to the limit; but they never stay blocked. They are still listed, a couple more than once, on my list. But they continue to show to me. Is this a function of automatic cookie removal? Anyone have an answer?

Both miracles and magic have to be believed to start. But, magic does actually have a valid explanation, though often difficult to comprehend for most of us. Miracles, as Ed notes, defy any logical or known explanation, even with in depth analysis; or they have valid reasons perhaps, but seem supernatural in a particular context or time. But, to believe in miracles, one is likely to also believe in God; both require a level of faith. For me, when I was about 9, I saw a miracle; but I cannot prove it was, and it had logical scientific explanations. But the occurrence, in context, was a "miracle of faith". To me, it proved my grandfather's faith that God would take care of things at the moment. Many will say, especially since it does have meteorological explanations, it was a simple coincidence; but in its context it was more than that. So, like much discussed or argued, miracles will never be validated or proven false in everyone's eyes. Faith is personal. Blind faith is foolish. Denial of faith as real is egotism. JMO

Oh, so should our old friend "Common Sense" be introduced to the web? Sorry, I forgot that he/she seems to have disappeared, rarely resurfacing. And when she/he does, it immediately seems to be seen as either a miracle or an attack on civilization. Do what you can to protect yourself, your family, and personal information. If they want to find it, and you put it there, even behind barriers, they likely can get to it if it if they really want to. Just like we lock doors, close windows, and sometimes use security devices on our homes, offices, and cars; thieves and miscreants still get in. Often it is because we become complacent, because our precautions have worked.

Lisa; Years ago, when I had only been a SM for a couple years at most, I remember having a conversation late at night with two older scouts standing by the dying fire. I was asked a question along the same lines, though maybe a bit more pointed. I remember discussing the idea that searching is okay, and that everyone eventually arrives at a personal conclusion. But we also talked about how things change with experience and maturity. After a short time, I asked them to come away from the fire a ways to a clearing. It was a clear night with no moon, or at least not up yet, at 5700 feet in the mountains of Southern California. I asked them to just spend a few moments looking at the sky, then consider their question again. Then I went to bed and left them alone. Later, they both indicated to me that they had not come to a final conclusion; but they had no doubt that something greater than themselves existed. One of the great "impact" possibilities with our outdoor program.

Lisa; While this is a "walk carefully" situation, I am somewhat confused by why the term agnostic is of concern anyway. As you noted, this is beat to death in the other area of the forum; but agnosticism seems to me to be the act of searching for something, and that still recognizes a spiritual significance, just does not specify it directly. Possibly a simple explanation to that effect is all that may be needed. Please, for those that do not agree, this is not the place to argue. And I choose not to argue. This is simply my take.

Part of being a teen is questioning and searching. We need to do what we can to help a scout find "his" beliefs and direction, without pushing him to accept things he does not want at this time. Still, we do need to try to bring to the front that his position is normal, and that being reverent is a personal thing that can manifest itself in many ways, not just in established, main line religions. Spirituality is personal. As an adult, I have found myself questioning again and again, especially when confronted by truly challenging occurrences in my life or in public view. Ultimately, he needs to reach his own decision. Most, in my experience, do find their own spiritual grounding.

Certainly, from the photo, they might not meet the recently posted standards. On the other hand, we do not know for sure. The actual standard is pretty broad, and appearances can deceive. If it is all in their midsection, they may very well fit somewhere in the acceptable parameter. Still, as noted, appearances too are important. Reality is that a huge percentage of our country is in the same boat. Push comes to shove, it is each of our responsibilities to do what we can to help correct it. Some will, but others won't. And the limits only appear to apply to high adventure and overly strenuous activities anyway. Maybe I am misunderstanding that part; but am pretty sure that is the most recent clarification. So, obese, or very overweight leader can still go to drive-in camps such as regular summer camp; and, on a case by case basis, they can also participate in many other challenging activities, with a doctor's approval. They will not be allowed to do a trek or hike the Tooth at Philmont; they won't be allowed to do the canoe base or sea base. Just my take.

Theses they were; 95 of them. Martin Luther: An Augustinian priest, biblical scholar, and linguist, was born and died in Eisleben, Saxony, a duchy in northwestern Germany. His attack on ecclesiastical abuses, the Ninety-five Theses, signaled the beginning of the Protestant Reformation. Luther's father wanted him to be a lawyer and sent him to the University of Erfut, where he received a B.A. degree in 1502 and an M.A. in 1505. Like other German Augustinians of this era, Luther sought a stricter observance of the rules of the order and this was reflected in his teaching and writing. Luther taught at the new University of Wittenberg from 1508 to 1546 and received a doctorate of theology in 1512. Ideas - Human nature is corrupt, weak, self-centered, and in a state of rebellion from God; the fruit of the fall from grace is death. - God's laws show sinners their distance from God and arouse a desire for redemption. - Although God in his justice could condemn humanity, he chooses out of love to redeem sinners; this love os most fully manifest on the cross. - In the process of redemption one can do nothing but have faith, an absolute trust and response to God's words; human merit and good works are rejected. - The foremost vehicle of God's saving word is the Bible, which presents the whole of the good news for human salvation. - The Catholic priesthood, monasticism, and canon law are rejected as human institutions that make the false claim to control the spirit of God. - The sacraments are signs that communicate God's saving word.(This message has been edited by skeptic)

So, are we going to see some new edicts nailed to the door(s) of some of the Lutheran churches?

In the case I shared, it was circa 1961, and we also had fewer members elected, as there were limits to how many. Also, they still had the possibility of less interested or focused candidates not passing through the Ordeal (later eliminated due to occasional "blackballing"). Still, as noted, our Lodge level things were well attended.

Certainly xlpanel has some validity to his comment, though his scale is probably too high. When I was in OA as a youth, I was elected our chapter chief. But, we had fewer than 20 total members, including any adults, and we were spread out over an area spanning 29 Palms Highway from Morongo Valley to 29 Palms, as well as the base and the area towards Amboy. The distance seemed to be the killer. We never were able to get enough attendees to have a viable meeting; but at the larger lodge functions, especially at camp, most came. Today, I believe they likely do not have that problem, as there are more members I am sure.

Am I the only one here that finds the back and forth between FOX and MSNBC to be like a comedy show? If one says it is black, the other immediately says white. It is good to be able to see Tavis, and a few like him to help sort things out. Of course, on occasion there appears to be a tiny bit of "rational" discussion here and there in local papers. Just another observation.

Hal; If you go to one of the other threads, we seem to have at least three now, that discusses health care, I gave a detailed description of my own personal experience with COBRA, as well as scary examples of private coverages from major carriers. I also touched on VA and Medicare. I do not know what the cut off is for no pay Medicare, but I do know that I have to pay just under $100 a month, and I had to sign up or have it increase each year when the sign-up period came up. While I have not had to pay directly for VA, it is not always very easy to get in, or very efficient; and "real" doctors are heavily replaced by "nurse practitioners". There are no easy answers. I do know that I would rather pay the $100 to VA, or have VA incorporate their coverage with Medicare when the time comes, so as to not put us in the "have to choose which is best this time" mode. As long as I am healthy, or relatively so, VA works well; but not having Medicare could be disastrous if I should get seriously ill. But neither cover the two most common issues with aging, eyes and teeth; I have put off new glasses because of the out of pocket cost for my serious prescription, and because I have had to deal with major dental issues. They finally came to a head, and now am paying on a no interest loan to cover the cost of removal and dentures. Just one "real" picture.