Sentinel947

I think Wood Badge as a concept is fine as is. It just needs to be more clearly marketed. At it's core, the new Wood Badge is supposed to teach adults about Scouting, and how to work with kids. I think IOL's fits the need of teaching camping skills. The issue is double pronged, we have alot of parents who volunteer to be Scout leaders who don't understand the program, what they should do, and why. They also lack the outdoor skills to be effective in the backcountry with kids. As a result, we get plop and drop camping troops that are adult led. I hope this isn't news to any of the regulars on the forums, just explaining my thinking here. TL;DR WB21C and IOL's are trying to meet different and important needs. How successful they are, is a different discussion entirely. I'll give my thoughts on WB21C. I'm going this fall. I've been in Scouting 15 years now, after being a member on this forum, I doubt there's much I'll be taught there that I don't already know. We'll see. Sentinel947

Mgood. you should definitely look up the changes made to the policies. 18-20 year olds have been considered Adults in the boy Scouts for a long time. They could never tent with -18 Scouts. Venturing had different rules that were recently changed.

Also if this discussion takes a turn, it will be moved to I&P or locked. Play nicely ladies and gentlemen.

Is there something from an Official GSUSA source?

I think that's very insightful actually. While most use the terms interchangably. There's not a whole lot of clarity in those terms. One could argue that in a "Boy Led" Troop that the boys lead, but the adults make all the decisions.. That's about what my Troop used to do. In the end, we slap a lot of monikers onto what we should simply called the Patrol Method. In the Patrol Method, the Scouts make the decisions, and they lead. (Something I didn't really grasp until I joined this forum and was promptly reeducated by Stosh and Beavah. Sentinel947

Yep. Although in alot of the old scouting literature that I've seen, the neckerchief was predominately worn OVER the collar. Not sure when that changed to under the collar.

My Troop uses propane for car camping and isopro-butane for backpacking stoves.

I think a big aspect of it is training. I had my eyes opened when I took Scoutmaster Fundamentals, but the knowledge of how to actually be a better Scoutmaster came from talking to and learning from experienced Scouters, both in real life and online. Websites like this one have the potential to be really helpful, if we play our cards right. Sentinel947

Somebody sent me a website that sells uniforms. They collect them from Salvation Army Stores and have agreements to buy them from factories that turn old clothes into rags. http://ascoutisthriftyuniformexchange.weebly.com/prices.html Some councils, districts and Troops offers the same. I imagine my troop could outfit maybe 10 new Scouts with the spare uniforms we have floating about. May not fit perfectly, but for a family with financial difficulty, it could be really helpful. Sentinel947

Thanks, I was too computer illiterate to figure that out myself! Sentinel947

Matt I'm glad to hear things are moving in the right direction for you!

Or in the Soviet Union, China or North Korea, their governments, since they are officially atheists. I'd say murder is double faceted. It's both a legal term and an action that has moral implications. However ones religion of philosphy defines it is the question.

I thought multiquote was being able to quote multiple people in the same reply.

Trying to follow this thread but I got lost when the Pope got compared to David Koresh and Jim Jones. As far as the Old Testament/New Testament laws I think a few people have already covered that. That being said, I think I'm pretty well versed in my Catholicism, I don't see any reason why a homosexual leader couldn't be a Scout Leader. Sentinel947

My area was inhabited by the Shawnee. I'll have to see what our local teams wear.

I think the change is inevitable, the writing is on the wall clearly for all to read. One merely needs to find polls that take the temperature of millenals.

I'm not an expert, and I never claimed to be. However, I don't agree being a parent makes one an expert on teenagers. Regardless, I see we aren't going to agree on this topic, and I don't see our opinions changing. Sentinel947

Mozart, I'm 21 years old. I'm much closer to being your son than being you. In other words, in the last several years, I've spent far more time being, and being around teenagers than you have. My statement was not to say, kids never rebel against authority, but more so In situations like the singing (or any hazing situation really), I don't think kids are likely to object to the situation. Like Robert Champion, even when they feel weird about the situation. They aren't going to challenge the group. Sentinel947

Eagledad: show me where anybody banned positive recognition. Also show me how making Scouts sing for possessions or get sent on snipe hunts is positive recognition similiar to singing happy birthday.

First of all, I cannot be a helicopter parent, for I have no kids. I would be careful to label other Scouters here as helicopters (JBlake a helicopter? Lol.) Second, your argument is a straw argument. Nobody made any statement about singing happy birthday being bullying. The difference between somebody losing their stuff and singing versus the troop singing happy birthday is intent and results. Can somebody be embarrassed by the singing of happy birthday? Sure. Is it the intent? No. What is the intent of making a scout sing for lost items? Can it be accomplished without needing to use humiliation as the tool? The answer to that question is yes. I'd argue the intent of making a scout sing for lost items is to humiliate them so they won't lose that item again. It's an intentional infliction of humiliation by authority figures. It's not a casual by product, it's the main tool. There are better ways to help Scouts learn how to keep track of their stuff than by using public humiliation as the method. Again, children and teenagers don't challenge authority as much as society pretends they do. A scout will probably play along with anything in order to not stick out and be harassed for being soft. I'll concede that in the grand scheme of teenagers and bullying, this type of behavior isn't very serious. It doesn't need PSA's done about it, nor being added to youth protection. While some of us don't mind having to sing in public, the principle of using humiliation remains, and I doubt any of us want to be publicly humiliated for mistakes we make in different manners.

Why not teach without the theory of gravity? It was taught without it before.

Problem has been fixed. You saw nothing....

Getting ads for credit card swipe readers.

Perhaps I mispoke. It's the difference between institutionally sponsored harrassment vs the embarrassment of failing at something.

"I'm a little teapot short and stout... here is my handle... here is my spout.."