Sentinel947

I agree with David here. Politely decline.

Ridiculous, considering nothing has actually changed yet. Best of luck to them wherever they are going.

In American Boy Scouts we have a set of youth protection policies mostly to prevent a repeat of institution wide sexual abuse of minors. I think Schiff is referring to the UK equivalent of that. My question is actually fairly similar. With Co-ed Scouting comes the management of teenage hormones. When I was in High School band, they would put us in hotel rooms based on gender. (All male and female rooms.) They would actually put duct tape on the outside of the doors, so they would know if you tried to leave the room to go mingle with the opposite genders at night without supervision. I feel like foreign Scouts would be just as similar as American ones. Are there rules in the TSA UK that address this?

So you want to keep your troop single gender. The change allows that. So nothing has changed. How has your troop been ruined by other troops in your town or across the country allowing girls? Was scouting ruined when Venturing went Co-ed? If so, why are you still here?

In light of @Cambridgeskips comment I have started a new thread: http://scouter.com/index.php/topic/29438-co-ed-scouting-overseas/ Purpose of it is for us American scouters to have our concerns or questions laid out for our foreign friends to be able to see and talk about how they handle it overseas. It is not a thread to continue to discuss the appropriateness of the change. This thread will be the place to continue to argue the merits of the decision.

I'd like to create a thread for the purpose of American Scouters asking questions to our foreign friends here. @@Cambridgeskip and others? Please keep in mind that the current changes do not make the BSA exactly like the the UK. These changes in theory require separate gender dens at the cub level and troops at the troop level. This thread is to talk about program concerns, not political ones. Please use http://scouter.com/index.php/topic/29428-official-news-release-girls-as-youth-members-all-programs/page-7 the megathread to discuss the merits of the policy change. Thanks

Oh it's definitely a money grab. And a chance to grab public facing PR. It's also a chance to position to the BSA for millennial parents who are starting to have cub age kids. (The oldest millennials are about 30 now.) I'm a Roman Catholic. Registered Republican. Social conservative. The rare millennial that opposes abortion and gay marriage. I don't see how these membership changes "ruin Scouting." I've been with my unit since 2005 and to be honest these changes haven't had a single impact on how we run our unit. The sky has not fallen. I'm ok with this change, but I'm upset with how National has surprised so many people with it. Proper leadership would be to poll most of the members, and if the BSA leadership feels so strongly about the change, it's ok to make it even if the membership disagrees, but they should have been more transparent and open about doing it, and why they were doing it. Sometimes leadership involves making unpopular moves. But true leadership doesn't mean sneaking in unpopular moves behind people's backs. In that regard, I totally understand the frustration. I don't see how these changes "Ruin" the character of scouting. To say otherwise is to say every other member of the World Scouting movement is doing Scouting wrong, or improperly.

Can confirm as a 24 year old, I still make really stupid decisions. Can also confirm as an ROTC cadet that a bunch of us made a whole bunch of really stupid decisions between 18-22 while in school. Sometimes I looked around and realized... "Holy **** some of these people will be leading soldiers next year...." I've been on board about adding girls for a while. I've seen foreign units and it definitely changed my opinion on the issue. I'm glad that the current situation will allow for single gender units, because I do think there is some value there. To those who are considering leaving because of this.... I want to thank you for what you've done for Scouting in your communities, and across the country through your participation here. I hope you will reconsider leaving the BSA, and this forum. You've made a positive impact on the lives of hundreds of young men. To those of you that are excited for this change. We have a big challenge ahead of us. The BSA doesn't manage these things terrible well, so we are in for quite a treat....

I became a Scout leader to help develop character in boys. I'll accept the mission creep of girls. I have no desire to facilitate/ operate family camping, as a single 24 year old adult male. I can just easily set up a group of 20 somethings to go camping. I understand you think the baby has been tossed out with the bathwater with this decision. I don't agree. The patrol method, the aspect of scouting that forces youth to operate in a small group environment, lead each other and cooperate as a group, would be lost in a family camping scenario. There's definitely value in family camping, but not for me at this time.

That's my own personal dealbreaker.

That could be a requirement of your district or council, but it sounds like an "Eagle Scout process" myth to me.

I did not go with a scout group. Because I did not go with Scouts, we hitchhiked from our ending destination to our starting point. That meant that our car was waiting for us at the end. Death Canyon Shelf was awesome. I liked Alaska Basin as well. Paintbrush Canyon was a bit of a disappointment, most of the flowers had already died by early September. Highlight of the trip was Avalanche pass. It is what remains of the original Teton Crest trail, and it runs right by the Teton teton mountain's summits. Not sure about camping options. We stayed at a hotel in Salt Lake City, drove straight to the tetons the next morning, hiked for 4 days, then we straight back to SLC. I imagine there are front country camping near Jenny Lake, but I can't tell you for certain.

I really like that approach! Really connects your unit to your CO and there's a great diversity in experience there.

I believe John Huntsman, Eagle Scout, former Governor of Utah and former Ambassador to China was named Trumps Ambassador to Russia. Saw a press release on that somewhere this week.

I actually removed his post that you replied to. I agree with Schiff, lets redirect back to the original topic at hand if there is anything constructive still to say about it.

There's no place in Scouting for foul language or demeaning or belittling others. Particularly coming from adults. That being said, I think people these days are too sensitive. One of the formative moments of my childhood came my Freshman year of high school. I was in band class, and I sucked at the song we were playing because I was too lazy and apathetic to practice. The Director calls me out in front of the entire section. "Sentinel947, Why do you suck so bad?" I kinda just blew him off. So he came after me. "You know why you suck? You suck because you are wasting away your potential, and you could just be brilliant if you cared even a little bit." That interaction was harsh, but it was a pivotal moment in my life. 3 years later I was a Section leader in the band, responsible for leading the other percussionists in rehearsal. That band director was one of my Eagle References. While I don't like that approach for working with Scouts, sometimes a little "Tough Love" and rough around the edges is good for them. One of my favorite ASM's growing up was kind of a jerk. Underneath his snark was a genuinely caring and talented ASM, but he was tough to warm up to. I'm a generally soft power person. I try to privately (within the rules of YPT)deal with Scouts when I make corrective actions. To some Scouts me coming up to them and quietly saying "Lets have a chat" is more terrifying to them than if I reamed them like a Drill instructor, because the authority figures in their lives already take that approach. Having that conversation over their behavior is hard to them. They are just used to having the punishment and moving on. Heck, as a moderator here, I generally will PM somebody if I have a problem with what they posted. But if I think a bit more blunt force will work on a particular scout, like @@David CO describes, I'll go for that approach. There are more than one approach to working with Scouts. Each of our Scouts are different and will react differently to how we work with them. It's important to use the right tool for the right scout, in the right situation. I have shouted and barked at a Scout. I was running a rifle range and despite being behind the Scout, I saw down the barrel of a loaded gun. There was no "soft power" in that situation.... Just my two cents.

16 years in Scouting. 6 years as an Adult. Been a grand time so far.

Wow! Welcone Steven! Good on you for your service to youth in your community! Just keep in mind everything dies. It's sad, but its not a failure. Each of the youth you've impacted for 36 years is your successes. Hopefully some folks here can give you some advice. Recruiting Gen X parents or Millenials is challenging.

I'm a little less recent Eagle. Been a Troop volunteer through college and now as a "real" adult. It's about gaining trust. At 24 nobody involved in the Troop questions my involvement like they did when I was 18 or 19. I imagine if I changed Troops it would become an issue again. When I leave my troop I'm done with troop level volunteering till I have kids of my own.

Good luck with the rest of your project!

Eagle Scout and current Project Coach: I'd include it under "Other Needs"

Nice to see you are doing well!

BSA: "How do you do, fellow kids?"

I just finished a Teton Crest trip. Started at Granite Canyon Trailhead and ended at Leigh Lake. I'd be happy to answer any questions! It topped Philmont as the best place I've backpacked so far.

No need to use curse words here... As for the OP: I think your Sons arrangements are acceptable and he'd be meeting his obligations in our Troop. As a Catholic Scouter myself I'm sympathetic to what you are trying to accomplish with your son. As for the SM, if wants to force your son to resign I suppose he can, but he must still count your son's term of position of responsibility for advancement up to that point. I think that he's being foolish. He reminds me of the sports coaches and band directors in my town that demand the boys make all of the practices, games, retreats all season AND offseason, or they will be benchwarmers.