ScoutNut

The $7000 did not just appear in the Pack's account overnight. Your Pack obviously has had a good year or two of fundraising. Have you discussed the Pack budget, and plans for that money in Committee meetings? Is a big purchase in the works? Is there an expensive trip coming up? Instead of sending out emails (just CM/ACM, entire Pack?) Why not give the CM a call on the phone, or visit him in person. You did call the Committee Chair, did she say there was a reason that much was being kept in the back? While having $7000 the Pack can not use is questionable, it is not necessarily a bad thing, or the end of the world. Why are you and other leaders ready to quit the Pack over it? What else is going on? You have stated in other posts that your Pack has already had the District Commissioner out to talk to the CM/ACM and they pretty much stated that it is their way or the highway. Have you spoken to your COR? The COR might not attend Committee meetings, but he/she might just be interested to find out what is going on in the CO's Pack that is causing Scouts to leave (36 to 24 to 12 or less) and the Pack to be on the verge of shutting down. Are any of the leaders in your Pack trained?

Per the BSA Insignia Guide, only official BSA headgear may be worn. Boy Scout Troops are allowed to vote for which of the official hats their Troop will use. Cub Scouts are not. They are allowed to wear only the Cub Scout hat for the level of the Cub Scout den they are in. The same goes for Cub Scout Neckers.

Hungry? Must be from a different Scout Law. If it is just to get their attention, or a smile, then change it every time to suit the situation. Don't really see the point otherwise.

There is no need for a meeting with any of the "back-rubbed" individuals at this point. It has been over a year since any of this happened. The man has bent over backwards to accomodate all this Troop has asked of him. He has appoligised to everyone involved, and has stayed out of his son's Scout life for one entire year. Now, why I don't know, but he says he "likes" this Troop, and he wishes to stay and get involved with his son. Personally, if they continue their ban, I think he should find a different Troop for his family ASAP and not look back. His family will be better off away.

Forgive me, but as far as I know, a person does not get put on the Abuse registry until/unless they are convicted of a crime. If this were not the case any time an allegation were made, true or not, the person could be put on the registry. According to you, charges have all been dropped and this man has never actually been convicted of anything. Being unfaithful, and having an affair, while not right, is not against the law. Why has the Charter Organization that owns your Troop, and who "hired" this man, not removed his membership? Are you divorced with sole custody of your son? I do not see a judge giving custody to a father on an abuse registry. If you are so afraid for your son, have you filed for an order of protection to keep his father away from him? An order of protection against his father would also protect the other Troop that you decided not to join because you were afraid he would go camping with his son. Abuse within Scouting is to be reported to the Council Scout Executive ONLY. The council is not required to tell you, or anyone except the person involved and the proper authorities, of the results of their inquiry.

If it is so hard for leaders to attend your UofS why not simply move that to a better date instead of adding another event. Leaders only have so much free time, and training events have to have enough people register to cover the costs to put them on. One event, which has great attendance, is MUCH better than 2 events that are both poorly attended.

Consider a Pow Wow open to all branches of Scouting. Have classes aimed at Packs, Troops, Crews, Ships, and Teams. This broadens your customer base so that the odds of having to cancel due to lack of registrations goes down. Some of the classes I can remember are - Behaviour Special Ceremonies Trash to Treasure Crafts Outdoor fun Cooking Dutch Oven Dealing with disabilities Merit Badge Counselor training COR training Safe Swim / Safety Afloat Pack Performances Flora & Fauna Committee training Tracking your unit Awards / Advancement LNT Places to go - Things to do Webelos to Scout Science fun First Aid Derbies (space/pinewood/raingutter - please don't encourage elimination races) Sparklers Games Songs Skits Campfires

"I believe that any Eagle Scout should have the right to wear the Eagle patch on their uniform into their adulthood - 18 or over.....My son earned Eagle and continues to wear his patch on the uniform shirt of the troop that he earned Eagle in - now he's an ASM there." It is your right to believe as you wish. However that is NOT the current BSA insignia policy. As an Eagle Scout, I would think your son would remember the Scout Law. Something about a Scout being Trustworthy and Obedient? There are a number of ways, along with wearing the Eagle Scout Knot, that your son can show he is an Eagle Scout. He can wear the NESA emblem on his right pocket. There is also an Eagle bolo, belt buckle, necker, and slide. All of which are allowed by the BSA Insignia Guide. "The knots should represent an award earned as an adult. Boy Scouts are allowed to wear their Arrow of Light patch on their uniform, even though that is earned as a Webelos and not as a Boy Scout." Boy Scouts and Cub Scouts are both youth programs, which is why the youth emblem is allowed. An adult Scouter is no longer in the youth program. Adults are not allowed to wear youth insignia, including the Arrow of Light. However, there is, like for the Eagle Rank, a square knot that adult Scouters who have earned the AOL can wear. There are also other knots for adults that represent awards earned as a youth.

The purpose of the Summertime Award is to keep Packs active over the summer months. Attending your council's summer resident, and/or day camps certainly meets that purpose. Any event, or activity, that is planned, advertised, promoted, attended, etc, by the Pack qualifies. Saying that a council summer camp does not qualify because it is a council event, not a Pack event is like saying that a 4th of July parade would not qualify because it is a town event and not a Pack event. There was a Cubcast in 04/2007 where the Assoc. National Director of Cub Scouting talked about the National Summertime Award. He specifically included Council/District Summer Camps in a list of possible activities Packs could do to earn the award. If you are concerned, consult your DE. Personally if my council did not accept Day and/or Resident camp for the Summertime award, I would complain BIG TIME. It is not at all fair to the boys, or to the Packs who are promoting the Summer Camps to their families.

Since there is no such organization as GSA, I don't have a clue if it is moral or not. I applaud AHG for stepping up and creating a new organization that met their needs instead of complaining, or demanding that other organizations change to satisfy them. However, I really do wish that they would stop saying that "Girl Scout oaths that no longer acknowledge God". This is entirely untrue. The Girl Scout Promise On my honor, I will try: To serve God and my country, To help people at all times, And to live by the Girl Scout Law. As anyone can see, their Promise CLEARLY states GOD. What AHG is complaining about (along with other things), is the fact that GSUSA specifically includes any and all gods, not simply the Christian version. "The word "God" can be interpreted in a number of ways, depending on one's spiritual beliefs. When reciting the Girl Scout Promise, it is okay to replace the word "God" with whatever word your spiritual beliefs dictate." Personally, I find this to be very inclusive, and welcoming to girls of all faiths. While GSUSA does not include religious requirements in their program, they do encourage all girls to earn the Religious Emblem of their faith. They also celebrate Girl Scout Sunday and Girl Scout Sabbath. I did notice that there is no mention of this agreement yet on the BSA National website. (This message has been edited by Scoutnut)

Don't call it scouting. Get a lawyer. Create a program. Incorporate a 501©(3). Do some fundraising. Get youth members.

I would go with 1 per month. The point is to be active all summer, not just in June. Three activities in June will not get the Pack a streamer either. Having multiple events each month gives all of the boys plenty of opportunity to find 1 they can attend each month. Wait until the end of August and see what it looks like then.

As a member of my council's training staff, I think they do a pretty good job of training. We have well publicized trainings all year (only Wood Badge in summer) long. They are also spread around to each district so that there are a lot of choices for convenience. Since we had problems getting enough attendees at our council Scouting University, we combined with a neighboring council to present a joint one. That has worked pretty well. I do like the idea of a Cuboree, or some type of weekend family camp during the school year. Maybe a council sponsored sleepin at a zoo/museum/aquarium/etc. I would like to see the time frame for our Early Bird summer camp pricing extended a bit. I wish my district would get out info on their events earlier. Unfortunately, I know that their main problem is finding a volunteer willing to commit to running them earlier. Sigh! BTW - "Intro to Camping" is called Basic Adult Leader Outdoor Orientation (BALOO). BALOO trained folks should then help their Pack's newbie campers.

I really doubt that there are any DISTRICTS at all that run a Cub resident camp. Costs to much money with not enough available participants to cover. Resident camps are run at the COUNCIL level, and I would bet just about every BSA council has some kind of Cub Scout Resident Summer Camp. My council runs six weekend (2 day/1 night) Cub Summer Camps, one of which is Webelos only. This is held at our "local" (approx 1hr) camp. Council also runs four 4 day/3 night Cub Summer Camps at one of our long range (approx 4hr drive) camps. Both the 2day and 4day camps are considered Resident Camps.

As your employer, does your council have any ideas, recommendations, resources, lesson plans, guidelines, goals, etc, for you?

Will it just be you, or will you have any other adults there to help you? Actually, with 25 boys, depending on the adult to cub ratio your council uses, you should have 3 or 4 other adults there to help. Personally, I think it is to hard to find things to do that are pertinent to, and fun for, that big of an age range all together. Openings (flag ceremonies), games, songs, some crafts, and closings would work well done together. For any activities dealing with advancement, I would break off the Scouts into Tigers, Wolf/Bear, and Webelos with other Program Aides or adults.

A couple of years back I had a knot board as one of the activities at our Day Camp. Nothing fancy, just the basic knots that the various levels would be needing to learn. I also had some great pictures of easy step by step instructions for each boy. None of the boys in any group got thru all of the knots. Most had problems with even the simple overhand knot. We ended up giving the boys the materials to finish at home if they wished. If I ever do that again it will be in a different format and be focused on just the overhand and 1 or 2 other real, real, easy ones.

If HOAC expects you to "teach" the BSA program, I think it might be a good idea if you were at least minimally trained. I would recommend taking all of the online training here - http://olc.scouting.org/ If you take it all, you should then have a good basic knowledge of the program you are a part of. Since you seem to be doing the work of Cubmaster, den leader, and Scoutmaster (11 and 12 year old boys are no longer Cub Scouts, they are Boy Scouts - entirely different program), I would also suggest you take Cub Scout den leader specific, Webelos den leader specific, and Scoutmaster Essentials, as soon as they are offered anywhere in your council.

There is no "heirarchy" of training in BSA. There is training for your position, and supplemental training that will help you with your position. Unless you are simply a training junkie, there really is no point in taking training just for the sake of taking the training. For instance, take BALOO - The time to take BALOO would have been when you were active in Cub Scouts. Taking the training then could have benefited your Pack by allowing you to plan and lead Pack overnighters. There is no point to taking it now that you are in Boy Scouts, you will not use it there. The same goes for a number of other trainings. Unless you are a UC, or a COR, why take their specific training? You can not use it, and it will mean little to you. An explaination of the trainings that might be of benefit to you as a volunteer in your son's Boy Scout Troop can be found here - http://www.scouting.org/sitecore/content/Home/BoyScouts/Adults/Training.aspx Depending on your registered position, and what you will be doing to help the Troop, not all of the training will be pertainent to you.

Oh Lordy Xlpanel, before you go around telling the world that you would let underage youth drink alcohol at a BSA campout, I suggest you ask your parents what they would do if they found out that while you were on a high school field trip, you were drinking alcohol, one, or more, of your teachers found out, and the only thing they did was tell you not to share it with anyone, and not to let them see you drunk. If you ever get to be an adult, perhaps you will realize how absolutely idiotic, not to mention irresponsible and illegal, your comments and suggested actions are. Sheesh kid ! (This message has been edited by Scoutnut)

"I wouldn't wait until National made their decision and then appeal again." They can't. National's decision is final. There are no more appeals after that.

Cub Scouts are a part of BSA, and as such are bound by BSA requirements. BSA also states that the CUB SCOUT criteria is DO YOUR BEST. If their best is only a few meetings, then YES, I would consider them active.

We went with Scoutmanage. I like it a lot.

Posters seem to be under the impression that what ehweinmann is talking about is a real, honest to goodness, 2-handed back rub. I really doubt that is the case. Granted, we really have no idea what went on, on either side of this. However, to me, it sounds like a case of instead of standing with a hand on your shoulder talking to you, this guy stands with his hand on your back. The "back rubbing" part comes in because his hand is most likely moving a bit. Could be a nervous movement, or just habit, like the back touching. "Lingering over a bra clasp" could be as simple as the fact a bra clasp is centered in the middle of the upper back, right where a hand would go if you were patting someone on the back. Some people just have no sense of personal space. Their personal bubble is nonexistent so they do not recognize when they are infringing on others. While talking to people like this, I have often found myself backing away. I have gone so far as to put a table between us. I also know a few "huggy" people, and some who are into cheek kissing too. I will usually make sure to say hello from a "safe" distance. If I do not know them well, or they get to pushy, I have let them know that they need to back off a bit. There are only a few who are close friends who I will allow to do the huggy/kissy thing. If these women were uncomfortable they should have said something to him then and there. As I understand it, he respected the request of the one who actually did say something to him. So, why couldn't the rest of them have acted like adults and spoken up - to him - too? If they asked, and were ignored, it would be different, but they did not. As for the "licking his lips" thing - What the heck is wrong with you folks? Since when did licking your lips get to be a crime? This comment, more than any other, tells me this was nothing more than a witch hunt. BSA has specified that parents have a right to attend activities when their children are present. There are no closed, or secret, activities. Yet this parent has respected your "suspension" for an entire year. He has missed participating with his son, seeing him grow as a Scout, and watching him be recognized by his peers. I REALLY hope that the righteous people in this Troop did not take out their ire on the son. Grow up, and follow the Scout Oath and Law. The example you are setting the boys in the Troop is not a good one.

Suggest to the Committee Chair that a Pack Secretary is needed on the Committee. As the Pack Webmaster you could include a Pack calendar on the website. Make sure you check with your local council on their rules and policies for unit websites.