ScoutNut

Your Pack sold $5000 in popcorn ($2500 for SS + $2500 for TO), and your councils portion was $2000? That means your Pack earned a 60% profit of $3000, and you are complaining about it? Most Councils give anywhere from 30-40% profit on popcorn. As to your contention that $2000 is to much to give to council. That is a mere drop in the bucket when it come to paying their expenses for a year. Unfortunately, in many councils the profit from council sales like popcorn is their MAIN source of income. Think about what it costs you to run your household for a year. Then consider what it costs a small to medium sized company to run for a year. Your council has to pay for utilities (electric, heat, gas, water, etc) for every single property it owns. It has to pay for insurance for every single property it owns. It pays for office supplies, salaries, health and pension benefits, automotive insurance, tag fees, and maintenance for all council owned vehicles, property taxes, maintenance on all buildings and property owned by the council, paper and printing costs for all of those placemats/recruitment flyers/notices/forms/etc that are given to units FREE OF CHARGE, equipment costs (copiers/dvd players/telephones/projection screens/fax machines/computers, furniture costs, equipment costs for all camps, and lots more. Then there are the special problems that happen. When you need to get a plumber in to your house it can easily cost you $200 or more. What do you think it costs when the septic system at a 600 acre camp goes bad? Or when the water pipes in the ground break? Or when a 60 year old oak tree falls thru the roof of a cabin? Or the roof over the server area for the computers springs a leak during a thunderstorm? That $2000 paid for new ammunition, and repair and maintenance on all guns and arrows, for the season of shooting sports at all of the council and district day and summer camps. How do all of the rest of the bills get paid? Scouts are not selling popcorn (or cookies). They are selling SCOUTING in their communities. OK, off my rant and soapbox!

You are not "wasting" your time sending "her" information. You are showing Compassion, Cooperation, and Positive Attitude (you know, those pesky Cub Scouting Core Values) to a SCOUT who is still a member of your Pack. How much time, energy, and money can it be to send a few sheets of paper via the USPS? If you feel it is to much trouble, simply contact your Council registrar now and tell them the boy, and anyone else in the family that is registered, is immediately off of your Pack's charter.

Does your daughter like charm bracelets? You could get her a charm bracelet and a gold filled Gold Award pendant to put on it. None of our girls were into keepsakes, or jewelry (especially of the GS variety!). I got each a crystal vase with some gold roses tied around with a fancy gold ribbon. Attached was a card which included a note from me on their experiences over the years. Not a dry eye was to be found!

If she has "washed her hands" of you then it does not sound like she is interested in having her son return. However, since the boy IS STILL A MEMBER, I would make sure to keep the door open for him. Keep them on the Pack mailing list to make sure they get all updates. I would also send her a copy of the Pack calendar and newsletter for the next few months. Other than that, there is not a whole lot to do. Simply take them off at recharter time if they do not come back.

If even the Pack that is under your CO is taken in by the tall tales about your Troop you have a big PR problem. You need to really put yourself out there in the community more and let them see the "real you". You say you are having a double Eagle ceremony next month, why not invite the Pack from your CO to attend? Maybe the boys would be interested in incorporating a Cub from each level into the ceremony in some way. Would the Boys be interested in doing a service project for your CO, jointly with the Pack? Anything you can do together (whole Pack & Troop, not just Webelos) helps form a connection between the CO's units. Does anyone have little brothers in a Pack? How about big brother bringing his little brother to his den meeting a bit early and talking to the den leader personally about running some programs. Big Bro could look thru the Cub Handbook in advance and have ideas ready to run past the leader. It is harder to say no in person, especially when one of your Cubs is pushing for it. How involved is your CO? Your COR? One way to handle the lying and backstabbing is to have your COR give the other Troops COR a call, or corner him/her at the next District Committee meeting.

You have a good 1/2 of your Troop who are fairly new Scouts. Are they advancing? Are the activities and service projects ones that the BOYS wanted to do? I agree with BP, if you have this apathy in all areas of your Troop, then you need to take a hard look at your Troops program.

In order to be a Lone Scout he must be registered with the council as one and have an approved Lone Scout Counselor. While it is preferred that a Lone Scout participates in Council, District, and local Pack activities when he can, it is not mandatory. I take it that you only removed the mother from her position as Secretary, and did not remove the boy from your Pack Charter? Have you (CC), or your husband (CM), called the family to determine if the boy is still interested in being a member of the Pack? Since he is a Tiger Cub Scout there is really no problem with his working at home. All of his requirements can be signed off by his parents. Have they been in communication with the den leader at all? Have they asked for the Pack to purchase any awards for their son? Depending on how strict your council Scout Shop is they will need a signed advancement form in order to purchase any rank awards. Any non-restricted stuff they can simply purchase on their own. As for moving to a Wolf Cub Scout, that happens automatically at the end of the school year. He does not have to earn his Tiger rank, or anything else. He simply has to finish 1st grade. When does your Pack recharter? Unless you take this boy off of your charter before then, he is a paid member of BSA until recharter. He can transfer to another Pack at any time. I would call the family and talk to them. It is a shame that the boy is not being recognized in front of the other Cubs for any work he has been doing at home. Let them know that their son is welcome to attend all den and Pack activities. Let them know the particulars of all upcoming Pack activities. You can also offer to help them transfer to a new Pack if they do not feel comfortable returning to yours. All you can do is to keep it civil, and to keep the door open for the boy. If you don't hear from them by recharter, take them off of your Pack charter.

You have to be 21 to be a Den Leader, but getting Den Chiefs into some of the Packs is a good idea. You stated that all recruiting was done by the boys. What exactly do they do to reach out to the Packs? Do you have any Troop/Webelos campouts? Do you attend District Camporees? While at Camporees and Klondikes, do the boys talk to any the the visiting Webelos? Do all of the area Cubmasters and Webelos den leaders have contact info for your SPL? Does the SPL regularly contact them to offer Troop assistance in activities? You said that there are 3 Packs, and 2 Troops in your area. Do either of the Troops share a CO with a Pack? Or are you all chartered independently?

From the BSA Guide for MErit Badge Counselors - "The merit badge counselor is a key player in the Boy Scout advancement program. Whatever your area of EXPERTISE or INTEREST whether it is a special craft or hobby (basketry, leatherwork, coin collecting), a profession (veterinary medicine, aviation, engineering), or perhaps a life skill (cooking, personal management, communications) as a merit badge counselor, you can play a vital role in stirring a young man's curiosity about that particular topic." From the BSA Merit Badge Counselor Application - "To qualify as a merit badge counselor, you must Be at least 18 years old. BE PROFICIENT IN THE MERIT BADGE SUBJECT BY VOCATION, AVOCATION, OR SPECIAL TRAINING. Be able to work with Scout-age boys. Be registered with the Boy Scouts of America." The CAPS are mine for emphasis. How can you stir anyone's curiosity in a subject if you only have a passing knowledge of it, or really don't care a whole bunch about it, and find it boring?

If the Pack is not requiring the boys to purchase the hat for their level, why would you require your den to purchase one? Personally, required or not, I would not (did not) buy my son any hat at all. He very rarely wore any hat, and when he did it would get lost in 2 seconds flat. Not worth the money, or the trouble. You can let your parents know about the 2010 hat, but REQUIRING it is another thing altogether.

>>"That's true, but when an ASM thinks that it is, and doesn't say anything about it, it makes you wonder what else he's not coming forward with."

"He said that one of the younger Scouts mentioned to him having heard another younger scout make a comment about the muscles of one of the older Scouts. He took it that it was meant in a "sexual" way" Per above, the ASM thought there were "sexual" overtones in the comment. My problem is that he never mentioned what this young Scout told him to anyone at the camp last year. He seems to have been concerned enough that he brings up the shirtless policy again, almost a year later. Yet, he still never tells anyone what that young Scout told him.

Since you say you have RE-built them, I take it that means that you have had patrol boxes before this. What happened to all of the gear in them? Pots and pans an such might look dented and dirty, but usually a bit of soap and elbow grease is all that is needed to get them good to go. However, since you seem to want to purchase all new equipment, although the patrol cook kits might not be available, Scoutstuff has a number of different cookwear and utensil sets you could use. In my opinion, two weeks is cutting it VERY close to order anything online at this point. I would visit your local Walmart, KMart, and all local camping goods stores. They all carry camping cookwear and utensils.

Individual Scout Accounts seem to be getting more popular at the Pack level. Especially if the Pack has an exceptionally large number of boys who do no fundraising at all. Other Packs raise their Pack dues to a high enough level to cover their budget. Then they give the families a choice to pay the dues thru fundraising, with cash, or with a combination of both. I really prefer the boys to work some money earning activities. They have promised to "help the Pack go", and one of the first principals of Scouting set by Baden-Powell was that the Scout pays his own way in Scouting. They also can learn quite a bit by participating.

I am glad it all worked out in the end. However, one thing still concerns me a bit. >>"It seems that his concern comes from something that he was told earlier in the week last year at camp. He said that one of the younger Scouts mentioned to him having heard another younger scout make a comment about the muscles of one of the older Scouts. He took it that it was meant in a "sexual" way"

50 gal. "bathtube" ??

I agree that this is not something the Committee should be taking a hand in. And to have the Committee dictating what apparel the boys sleep in - creepy is putting it mildly. What did you say to this brand new, never been in Scouting before, dad, last year when he complained about the boys? How has he been over the past year? Is he a micro manager in other ways with the boys? Has he been fully trained? Why is this such an issue for him?

Some councils have stricter regulations than National. Always best to check with someone at your council offices. The person who approves Tour Permits is a good place to start.

Beyond YP, This is Scouting, Webelos Outdoor, and Webelos Den Leader Specific, what other kind of Webelos training are you looking for? If you are looking for help with individual Activity Badges, and where to go on outings, your District Roundtable can help. Also, most councils have some kind of yearly all day training (Pow Wow, Super Saturday of Scouting, etc) where you can sign up for a bunch of classes covering just about anything you might want to know about.

On the BSA National Web site - http://www.scouting.org/Training/Adult.aspx

Dollars to donuts they were an OA ceremony team. They do a bang up job! Glad your crossover was memorable!

I would work hard at registering enough boys to have individual den meetings. Even with only 2 or 3 boys in a den it is WAY better if they meet on their own, and work on ONLY their own program. Meeting as one big group makes it hard to follow the individual programs. The Tiger program is VERY different from other Cub Scout programs, as is the Webelos program. The Wolf and Bear Cub programs are the only two which are similar, and can be combined if it is ABSOLUTELY necessary. Starting one unit is hard enough, but with boys in both the Cub Scout and Boy Scout worlds, you would need to start up both a Pack and Troop. With just you and your husband, once again you will find yourselves stretched VERY thin. If it was me, I would start visiting other Packs, and Troops, in the area. Also visit the den meetings of the dens your boys will be in. Finding a good Pack and Troop to join would be my first priority.

The BSA New Unit Organization Process - http://www.scouting.org/scoutsource/Media/Relationships/TheNew-UnitProcess.aspx

That is up to the unit. For most units, if the boy is staying in Scouts, and simply transferring to a different unit, he will be allowed to take his "Scout Account" money with him to the new unit. The old unit will generally mail a check to the new unit, payable to the unit, with a note stating it is for Billy Jones Scout Acct. If the boy is leaving Scouting completely the money stays in the unit.

Yes, self-chartering IS allowed by BSA. From the Rules and Regulations of the BSA, 2007 printing - Organization of Units Clause 1. General. The Corporation (Boy Scouts of America) shall have the power to grant charters to organizations and groups of individuals meeting the requirements of the Bylaws and these Rules and Regulations to organize and maintain units of the Scouting program, and to issue certificates of membership in such units to the officers and members thereof who comply with the requirements of the Bylaws and these Rules and Regulations. Charters for Community Units Clause 3. While the formation of units in connection with existing organizations shall be preferred, when conditions warrant a charter may be granted for the formation of a unit independent of any relationship with an existing organization, provided, however, that the applicants are citizens of the United States, who subscribe to the principles of the Scout Oath and Law, and whose interest is primarily in helping boys and young adults through the Scouting program, and who shall have the resources to provide the necessary leadership, supervision, and facilities. In such cases the obligations upon the applicants for a charter shall be the same as those required for organizations. So, Moosetracker, your district was NOT turning a "blind eye" to your unit. It was fairly, and legally, granted a charter by your council. The CO was most likely something along the order of "Friends of Troop 123". This is actually fairly common in some areas. As to why they were eventually "made" to find an organization to be their CO, I can only speculate. Any number of reasons could apply.