ScoutNut

BSA has no position patch for a generic Roundtable Commissioner, because BSA National has no such position. There are position patches for Cub Scout, Boy Scout, Venturing, and Varsity Roundtable Commissioners, and Roundtable Staff. Being in charge of (Commissioner) Roundtable for just one Scouting level is a lot of work. Having one person in charge of all Roundtables, for all Scouting levels, is tons more work. Is your District Commissioner going to be combining all Roundtables into just one for everyone? I can't say that I am a fan of that. You also said that you will "be assigned a unit" sometime in the fall/winter. Roundtable Commissioners do not have assigned units. They are in charge of the entire Roundtable training at their Scouting level, which is open to all units in that level. Roundtables are not sorted out by unit. The only members of the Commissioner Staff that are "assigned units" are Unit Commissioners. I would hold off on purchasing any kind of position patch until you know what position you will be filling. From your description it could very well be a District/Council specific thing. And, as others have said, no, you are not trained for your position, so you can not wear a Trained strip yet.

>>"Requiring families to pay cash with their order to the pack presents some problems too. Do you really want someone with a packet of receipts collecting cash they then hold on to for several weeks?">"How about a rule that popcorn orders must be paid by check ---- no cash payments accepted? "

Look for Troops online at BSA National site - https://beascout.scouting.org/ Your best bet would be to become a member of the Charter Organization first, and let them get to know you. Then when you eventually ask about helping with their Boy Scout Troop they will be more likely to welcome you.

So you got no advance notice of this problem, or the meeting, from your Committee Chair at all? The Committee Chair has still not communicated to you that there was a problem, a meeting, or anything related to the issue? The only time you heard about this was when the DE called you last night? The DE would not talk to you on the phone about the particulars of the meeting? Did the DE request that you not talk to anyone before your meeting with him? Curiouser, and curiouser.

I do not have a problem with Kamelian talking to the IH about the problems the Troop is having with the COR, or the problems the Troop is having with recruiting. What I find troubling is Kamelian telling/urging/suggesting to the IH what leaders in the Cub Pack need to be disciplined, or even kicked out. What I find troubling is Kamelian getting the IH to appoint him as the COR for the Pack & Troop (granted not explicitly stated, but definitely implied), thereby giving himself the ability to fire the Pack leaders he finds troublesome, and place leaders from his Troop on the Pack Committee.

What was the outcome of this meeting?

>>"The only question I have about it, is it okay to take them on group rides. The MB specifically says the scout should plan the rides. Does that mean if I have 4 kids going for the MB we have to go on 20 rides for each to plan 5?"

>>"I liked the proposal (from a few suggestions back) for the IH to consider installing a couple of the troop's ASMs on the pack committee, and possibly also replacing the pack CC and one or more of the Webelos den leaders with other people."

Having the rules, and how the race is run, change every year is nuts. No wonder there are arguments. I can see having the Bear den host the event, but how the race is run should be a Pack decision, and consistent from year to year. Does your Council/District hold a Pinewood Derby? If so, those are the rules you should use for your Pack PWD. semperfiscouter stated - >>"Each rank races, at the end there is a final between all the winners, although, the fastest car of all entries is the one that receives the grand trophy - which is kind of strange considering I would think it would be fastest car of all the winners."

>>"turning it into a school outreach and open to the school members but charge a higher cost for the car to dove tail off it to bring in some much needed revenue."

>>"A good National marketing strategy would work wonders for popcorn sales"

Moose - While from his previous posts over the last year, it is obvious that Fox76 has had a bad experience with Venturing combined with Boy Scouting, no where in any post of his, is it even so much as implied that the Crew at the Klondike in this thread is the same Crew from his old Troop. As far as I can tell these are two entirely separate incidents, involving two separate Crews. His main problem with the Klondike situation in this thread was the fact that a Venture Crew was participating in, what he felt should be, a Boy Scout Troop only, non-coed, activity. He dislikes Venturing in general, and co-ed Venturing in particular, and this bias has a tendency to color just about every contact he has with any of these BSA units. I have no problem with Troop only, or Crew only, activities. I also have no problem with multiple program units attending events together, as long as the activities are age appropriate for the youth attending. Like the Crew attending the Klondike. I would have a big problem with opening an activity up to Crews, but then restricting female members from attending. I think a lot of these questions would be solved, and the programs made stronger, if BSA would just get rid of the overlap (and Venture Patrols), and make co-ed Venturing the next level after Boy Scouts. Scouts would then go from Cub Scouts, to Boy Scouts, to Venturing. But that is just me. Fox76, as I stated earlier, if you really want to affect change, and keep Boy Scout and Venturing events separate, you have to work thru your District and Council. The best way to do this is to have your COR (who is a voting member) attend the District Committee meetings and bring it up there.

This page on the BSA National Web site should help explain things a bit - http://www.scouting.org/sitecore/content/Home/CubScouts/AboutCubScouts/ThePack.aspx

Do you know if the charter organization is a religious organization?

>>"Is there some communication missing here somewhere? "

>>"There is a huge difference. To me, at least."

>>"With the logic of the current policy, Boy Scouts should participate in the Cub Scout Eskimo Run as contestants."

>>"Late high school aged teenagers can't be really be compared with twelve year olds in a competition, can they?"

Welcome! What has you so confused?

What Baden said, and the sooner the better. In addition, your Pack's leaders can not stop parents from taking their own children on visits to any Troop they wish to. By "unworthy of any further attention in the pack", what exactly do you mean? Do the Webelos den leaders ban these boys from attending meetings? Do they not give them credit for requirements they have completed? Do they not give the boys awards/pins/etc that they have rightfully earned? If they do not drop them from the Pack charter, allow them to attend meetings, and present them with any, and all awards they have earned, then what Troops the Webelos visit individually, and what Troop they decide to join, is up to the individual families. These "concerned parents" need to get off the stick and look around on their own. There is also nothing stopping your Troop from sending out info on the Troop, and inviting 4th, and 5th grade Webelos to a Troop meeting. Information does not all have to filter thru the Pack/den leaders. Send it thru school, or since you both have the same charter organization, ask the COR for the mailing address of all of the Webelos.

The art belt loop works well with Elective #15. Also a safety themed meeting with Electives #26, #27, #28, #29, might work.

Do you need the Police Station Visit to complete Requirement #2G, or have you already done a Fire Station visit? If you still need to finish #2G, you can give your Police, and Fire departments a call and see if one of them can get you in tomorrow. Then call your families and change the meeting from tonight to tomorrow. If you are completely done, then go with more Tiger Electives. There are lots of them. Some electives that worked nicely for me - 1) Think of a time when your family celebrated something, and tell the den about it and how it made your feel. - Scout Anniversary Week is here, and Blue and Gold celebrations are coming up for many Packs. This is a great time to have a discussion on different celebrations. 2) Make a decoration with your family or your den. - What is your Pack doing for Blue and Gold? While you are having the above discussion, have your Tiger Teams make decorations for your den's table at the B&G. Follow whatever theme your Pack is using, or go with a Scout birthday theme. 4) Make a frame for a family picture. - Cut up cardboard into squares. You can use one piece for the backing, and one for the frame edging. Can you get any pine cones, rocks, twigs, etc? These are great for decorating the frame. You can also use craft sticks, or just have them color/cut/paste stuff around the edges. Give the families a call and have them bring a picture to the meeting. 7) Make a musical instrument and play it with others. - Rain Sticks are always fun. Also kazoos, maracas using foil and dry beans, and more. Lots of ideas online. 12) Make at least two cards or decorations and take them to a hospital or long-term care facility. - Valentines Day cards would be wonderful! 15) Mix the primary colors to make orange, green and purple. - This can be lots of messy fun. You can also combine this with #2, 4, and 12. 17) Make a model. - If you have enough room make different kinds of paper airplanes and have races. http://www.paperairplanes.co.uk/planes.php http://www.10paperairplanes.com/ 18) Sew a button onto fabric. - Get those Tigers sewing! You can also do this while making sock puppets. 21) Sew a button onto fabric. - Sock puppets, paper bag puppets, paper plate puppets, finger puppets. All you need is a great imagination! http://www.teacherhelp.org/puppets.htm http://www.freekidcrafts.com/finger-puppets.html 22) With your family or with your den, have a picnic -- indoors or outdoors. - Have each family make a snack to bring (Elective #25), play board games (Elective #3). 30) Plant a seed, pit, or greens - Now that we are up to our eyeballs in snow, this is always a fun activity. I use clear plastic cups, paper towels, seeds, and water. The seeds go between the side of the cup and the wet toweling so the boys can watch them grow. I use beans, or peas. Nasturtiums are nice too because you can use their leaves in salads. I buy the seeds the spring before, but they start showing up in stores around now. You can also bring carrots/avocados to your picnic, and then plant the tops/seeds. You can also do the marbles or chess belt loops if you have the equipment. You might think chess is to complicated for Tigers, but my last group had a blast. I dragged my son along to do the teaching, and made printouts of the rules/moves for the Tiger Partners. He showed them the basic moves, had each boy do a bit of practice, then played a game against the den. Partners were able to coach as each boy took a turn making a move, and the others cheered him on. Son played two games against them and all had fun.

bokris - You stated that the 5th grade Webelos have not, to your knowledge, completed the requirements for AOL, and that you have told the den they will NOT be receiving the AOL at your Pack's B&G meeting. You also stated that you are trying to get them to commit to a Troop so that you can hold a crossover to Boy Scouts ceremony at the B&G meeting. Are all of the 5th grade Webelos currently 11 years old? If your Blue/Gold meeting is this month (not at the end of the school year), and none of the boys are/will be 11 years old by the B&G, then your problem of what Troop to cross them into is solved. NONE. They can not cross into any Troop at all. None of the 5th grade Webelos currently meet the BSA requirements for joining a Boy Scout Troop. If your goal is to hold a ceremony only because the Scouts "look forward to them immensely", then hold some kind of Happy Birthday Scouting ceremony (that is the purpose of the Blue/Gold after all), have birthday cake, and give all of the Scouts a small Scouting themed birthday present. If your goal is to use ceremonies to recognize the Scouts accomplishments, then put together ceremonies to present to the Scouts any awards they have completed/earned. Since the 5th grade Webelos have not completed their AOL, nor are they eligible to join a Troop, leave them alone. Let them continue to have fun in the Pack as the Cub Scouts they are, and work toward their AOL if they wish. Why are you in such a hurry to kick these boys out of Scouting?

If your charter organization is going to be closing down, what kind of bridges are you concerned about? Your Pack needs some advance notice if your charter org is going to be closing down. Showing up for a den/Pack meeting, only to find the place empty, and the doors locked, is not the way you want to find out. Your Committee Chair (CC) needs to have a business talk with your Charter Organization Representative (COR), and the Institutional Head (IH) of the organization as soon as possible. It would also be a good idea to include your District Executive (DE) in the meeting.

How many boys are in your den (you are the leader of one of the Wolf dens, correct?)? How many boys are in the leaderless Wolf den? Do you have an assistant Wolf den leader for your den? Do you know what happened to the leaders of the other den? Did they change Packs, to much den adult drama, drama with CM/CC of the Pack, quit Scouting completely, etc? Do you know any parents in the other den, or your den, who would be willing to take on the job of Wolf den leader? You need to contact your Cubmaster right away. Tell the CM about the emails you have been getting, and the confusion in the other Wolf den. Find out what the CM, and CC, are planning, and talk to them about any help you feel you can offer.