ScoutNut

Didn't mean to "scold". However, the point is to have the girls learn to do things on their own. In 12 years, I never once sewed patches on my Girl Scout's vests. Sometimes they were not perfect, but hey, they were their vests after all.

Use of the segment patches is a local one. Some councils have specific requirements to earn them. Some have specific events that must be attended to earn them. Some councils have them for adults. Some councils do not use them at all. My Pack uses them instead of purchasing large, expensive patches. They are basically used as participation patches. We do one for each Pack meeting attended and for Pack & den activities. The boy like getting them, they are a LOT cheaper than big patches, & they look real cool on the back of their red "brag" vests! By the time they crossover to BS they could have 5 or 6 rings around our council patch.

I'm suprised your Pack didn't do something on the history of "Cubbing" last year for the 75th Anniversary. As Kaji stated, yes, Cubs have had rank badges. Who, what & when they were earned has changed however. 1930 - Cubbing was launched with Bobcat as the first earned rank (as now). Dens were formed by age (Wolf-9, Bear-10, Lion-11, on to Boy Scouts at 12). Boys would earn each rank in succession, regardless of age, & only the most current rank badge was worn. Boy Scout Den Chiefs ran the dens. 1941 - Webelos rank was added as the last 6 months of the Lion level for boys who had earned their Lion rank. The Webelos rank looked like the current AOL. 1942 - Boys allowed to start earning rank at the age level they enter instead of starting at Wolf and going from there. 1945 - Cubbing changes to Cub Scouts 1949 - Age levels changed to Wolf-8, Bear-9, Lion/Webelos-10, Boy Scout-11. 1954 - Webelos, 10-1/2 yr old, get their own den. 1967 - Advancement program changed. Lion dropped & Webelos becomes 1 yr program. 1972 - Webelos rank becomes Arrow of Light badge. 1982 - Tigers started 1986 - Cub Scouts change from age based to grade based. Webelos changes to 4th & 5th grades. 1995 - Tigers get their own den, instead of a group. 2001 - Webelos get an oval Webelos badge & Tigers rank is introduced. Hope this helps!

Lisa, the case of a bad leader that the Pack wanted to be rid of is a whole 'nuther thing. In that case there is every reason to not let that leader "re-up" with the Pack. However, if the reason is simply because they no longer have kids in the Pack, and/or someone has made the decision (for the leader) that the leader will not have the time to do the job, then I take issue.

If you have Excel or Word it is a simple matter to make up your own receipt. I have a receipt that shows the scout's name, date, prize, number of units per type of popcorn taken, cost of each popcorn type, Grand total $ due, amount/date paid, scout parent signature, & popcorn kernel signature. The scout's adult gets 1 copy & I keep 1 copy. I also have excel spreadsheets showing show/sell distribution to scouts who worked, what each boy sold by den, total Pack received, sold, returned, transfered to Troop, for show/sell, take-order, & total. Just because BSA does not give you forms does not mean you can't create your own. In the last 6 years of council product returns I have worked, it is the folks with their own spreadsheets & paperwork that are the ones who breeze right thru.

And how do you discover these issues of control or manipulation? Do you have a questionnaire? Do you straight out ask them? Do you ask for references? These are people who have already been APPROVED by your COR & CC to be leaders. They simply want to stay with (or return to) the Pack instead of working at the Troop level. MaScout, folks who would drive 200 miles each month to attend a committee meeting for a scout unit they are no longer connected with are not manipulative or control freaks, they are crazy & scary & they would not be allowed to stay at our committee meetings.

"most families I know don't go through the regimen kenk suggests in their own homes." Most families that I know have a dishwasher that uses soap with a sanitizing agent in it & water temperature that would scald a youth's hands in their own homes. What I do in my home affects only me & my family. What I do when camping with Scouts affects OTHER families children. Big difference. BSA teaches the 3 pot method in their outdoor trainings for a reason. Most boys, especially young ones, could care less if their plate & fork really gets clean. Swishing quickly & then getting on with fun stuff is the preferred method of doing things. With soap & sanitizing they have a better chance of not spending their camping time sitting in an outhouse. When backpacking in the wilderness, the boys are older, more experienced, & hopefully more aware of sanitary needs. You would plan differently than for young, inexperienced boys at front country, developed sites. BTW - There are biodegradable soaps & sanitizers that are readily available.

Your District will not do anything about this. Contact your CO. Your Pack belongs to them, so does the missing money. Before you start, forget the phone calls & have the CM or CC make a personal visit to his/her house. If that does not work, follow up with your CO. Good Luck.

Hey, 12 hrs is a virtual eternity! We had one a few years back just never show up! Our local OA dance team was a GREAT bunch. They were talented, trustworthy boys from the area who were very busy because they were so good. Unfortunately, as these things happen, the leader & many of the the group either finally aged out or went away to college. The remaining guys were not interested in continuing the dance team. Because of the great experiences we had with our Lodge's group, we decided to find another dance team for our Crossover one year. We called around to some other area councils/lodges & finally found one that sounded good & could make our event. Our CM made the arrangements. This was our final Pack meeting of the school year & graduation ceremonies were planned for every level with the Indian Dance Team as the final highlight. Everything was ready & the boys were hyped & looking forward to the ceremonies. The meeting starts & no dance team in sight. After many phone calls & much gnashing of teeth, the CM finally gets thru to the parents of the head of the dance team. It seems the dad driving got "lost" on his way & decided it was to late & raining, so he just went home. No phone call requesting directions, no phone call to let us know what happened, no nothing. Now, I could have been a bit sympathetic if we were at a place that is extremely hard to find, in the middle of nowhere. However, we are in a western 'burb of Chicago, practically on top of an expressway. The dance team was coming from a northern 'burb and was on another expressway coming into the city when they turned back. I think it was more a case of late & lazy than lost! Luckily, we were able to change the graduation ceremony (painted face) a bit to include the boys crossing to Boy Scouts, but the boys were VERY disappointed. Our CM did call their council to express his disappointment & we NEVER used (or recommended) them again!

The best place for Cubs to do wall climbing is at a commercial facility with qualified instructors. Check out your local YMCA, REI store, or fitness facility.

According to the "Age-Appropriate Guidelines" all Cub ages, from Tigers thru Webelos, can do bouldering & commercial/horizontal wall climbing. Webelos are allowed to do vertical wall or tower climbing. Cubs can NOT do belaying, rock climbing or rappelling. Even if they could do these things, they could NOT do them on a homemade scaffolding and climbing tower with just the Troop/Crew helping. According to the "Guide to Safe Scouting" there must be qualified supervisors, who are at least 21 years old & have been trained in "Climb On Safely". You also need someone trained in First Aid & CPR, a qualified (min 10 hrs instructor training) climbing instructor the activity must be conducted using an established site or facility & all equipment (helmets, ropes, hardware) must be approved (or new) & correct for the size and ability of the participant. http://www.scouting.org/pubs/gss/ageguides.pdf http://www.scouting.org/pubs/gss/gss09.html#d Bottom line - Don't do it. BTW - Even though this is not technically "camping" it IS an overnighter & you might need a BALOO trained person in charge.

My son is considering signing up with the Pack when he ages out of his Troop next February. Should I tell him to forget it until he has sons of his own? I don't think so!

Well, let's see. Total time as a youth in scouting - 0. Total time as an adult Leader in Scouting - 14 years. Girl Scouts - 14 years Cub Scouts - 11 years Boy Scouts - 6 years I took my daughter & her GS mates from 1st grade Brownies thru Silver Award, Gold Award, & 12th grade graduation to Lifetime Adult Girl Scouts. Then I was down to "just" working at the Service Unit level. I led my son & his Den from 1st grade Tiger thru 5th grade Webelos. I stayed with Cubs & also help with the Troop & District.

GS-CS your girls are in 5th & 6th grades, if they lose a badge THEY buy the replacement. If they don't get the badge on, oh well. Maybe they prefer their badges in a box on their dresser! Sewing the badges on for them is counter-productive in more ways than one. If they don't get the badge on the exact perfect spot, so what! The badge police will not strip the vest from their shoulders. The girls will certainly not care & neither will anyone else (except maybe you). Give them their badges, the info on the badge magic/badge bond, & let them go. Then it's up to them. BTW - There is no such animal as a "Cadette" anymore & (from a reference on another thread) according to GSUSA, "Studio 2B" is NOT a PROGRAM!

The bottom line is that it IS the decision of the boy & his family. Everyone in the Pack can be rooting for the other Troop, but it is up to the family to make the final decision. The Webelos have all been to your Troop's events, & I assume to visit the other Troop as well. The questions you should be asking the families that did not choose your Troop is what, exactly, are the qualities of the other Troop that they liked better. What, exactly, did they NOT like about your Troop. Let them know that you are interested in improving the Troop & need feedback (in other words-no blame/hard feelings). The part of your story that I find upsetting is last year's B&G. The Webelos leaders & presumably the CM, all knew that NONE of the boys were really crossing over to your Troop. Yet, they still had YOUR Troop at the B&G to receive the boys & not the Troop they were really crossing to. To me, that is not only unfair to your Troop, but to the other Troop & the Webelos as well. The boys deserve to be welcomed by the leaders & boys of their future Troop. We have had crossover ceremonies with more than one Troop represented when the boys were not all joining the same Troop. I would continue to invite the Webelos from that Pack (& others in your area) to events/meetings/etc. The boys have nothing to do with any of this & deserve to see your Troop in action. The Pack is another matter however. If you are asked to their B&G this year, I would make it a point to ask if any of the boys were planning to cross to your Troop. If not, I would suggest that the Pack contacts the Troop(s) that they ARE crossing to. If this Pack is chartered by your CO then the SM should attend the B&G dinner as a representative of one the CO's units. If not, & you are not receiving any boys, then stay home.

The Tiger requirements are not rocket science. Talk to the parents & let them know what their role is. Have them plan some den activities & outings that will help their son with requirements. If the event is different than what the others did to complete the requirement they should not be bored. Find out if your council sells small curved segments. Give the boys a segment for the activity if you feel they need some recognition. I bet many could also be used toward electives. Earning Tiger by the end of the school year should be very doable. It might take a bit more work on the parents part, but it can be done. And, even if he does not end up with his Tiger rank, he will will have his totem & a few beads & will have had FUN! BTW - He can work on his Bobcat along the way WHILE he is working on his Tiger.

If you look at the uniform inspection sheets under headgear, the only option given is the campaign hat. If a Scouter does not serve any youth in particular (district or council level), I suppose he can wear a Philmont or NESA hat if they wish. I have seen Scouters wearing sweat pants or camo pants with their scout shirt also. Does the fact that a Scouter is wearing it make it a valid uniforming option? I think for me, the sticking point is that you are using Pack funds for this. It does not matter if it is $5 or $1 per hat. Not everyone wears hats. If you gave one to me it would go in a drawer or to my son. I would NOT wear it & the cost would be wasted. With around 100 boys you have at least 10 dens. If you figure at least 2 leaders per den, CM, CC, COR, & at least 3 committee members that comes to $130 if everyone gets trained. Those funds can be better used elsewhere. For $130 you can send 1 or 2 boys to summer camp. BTW - With a Pack of 90-100 boys, you should have a good number of committee members. Promoting training is not the job of a Cubmaster (other than non-stop encouraging). Your Pack Trainer is the one who should be doing that. If you do not have a Pack Trainer, talk to your Committee Chair & have the committee select one.

The WEARING of a hat is optional. NOT the hat itself. If the adult leader elects to wear a hat, the hat is the same type as that of the youth they serve. Custom unit hats are NOT an option. In order for the Pack to get a halfway decent price for custom hats you would have to order quite a few. Personally, I am not much of a hat person at all & would probably not wear one. You get a "TRAINED" patch from your council when you have completed training. I think that Pack money would be better spent on the training cost itself & on program for the boys.

Deciding if changing Packs is the right thing is a VERY personal matter. We can't really help with that. You need to take a good look at your Pack, Charter Org, & family & decide (with your son) if this Pack really works for you. Setting a example for the boys in your Bear den has nothing to do with it. You main focus should be what is best for your family & what your son wants. As for removing a CC, that is the job of your Charter Org Rep (COR). It sounds like your Charter Org could use training & a refresher course in just what their responsibilities are, because, yes it is EXACTLY their problem!

e-scouter, you can't find anything on who votes & who doesn't because voting is NOT part of the process. If you have unqualified people simply "signing up" to be a committee member, then your Pack is not doing things the way the BSA has it set up. The members of the committee should be selected, not just "signed up". These committee members are not just bodies with the title of committee member. They should have specific jobs. Some of these could be Secretary, Treasurer, Advancements, Outings, Training, etc. BSA has developed a method for finding qualified leaders for your Pack that works quite well. http://www.scouting.org/commissioners/resources/13-500.pdf They also have a good training for your Charter Org Rep that every unit should get theirs to attend : http://www.scouting.org/relationships/04-113/04-113.pdf If a person trys to "hijack" the committee or push for something that is against BSA rules, then all that should be needed is for SOMEONE at the meeting to state firmly that it is against the rules & CAN NOT be done. I did that many moons ago with the infamous "Upside Down Bobcat"! Training is the key for committee members, CM & den leaders alike. Boy, our leaders & committee are not perfect by any means, & we are not always strictly by the BSA book, but we try, & we really do work pretty well together to give the boys in our Pack the best program we can. Sometimes, reading the posts here, I realize just how lucky we are!

Both Home Depot & Lowes have Kid's Workshops. Both require a parent to attend with the child. Home Depot has theirs the 1st Sat of every month. They give the kids an orange apron & a pin that coordinates with the project they made. I know a lot of folks who have done these & they have always liked them. Call your local store to find out the project & register. Lowes has theirs the 2nd Sat of every month. I do not know anyone who has done them, but Lowes is fairly new in the Chicago area. You can sign up by calling your local store, or online. Coming up in April, not wood craft, but cool - The Chicago Herpetological Society's, ReptileFest 2006. Touch a tortoise, itch an iguana. April 8-9 at UIC's PE building. If you go as a youth group with leaders the cost is only $7 for adults & $5 for kids 3-11. A GREAT Pack activity! http://www.chicagoherp.org/fest/main.htm

Although I do not have a copy of the "Cub Scout Leader Book", I am sure it is spelled out in there under Pack Committee. Meanwhile, here are some quotes from the online "Cub Scout Leader Fast Start" training : "The pack committee meets as part of the monthly pack leaders' meeting." AND "The pack committee oversees the pack program, helps the Cubmaster plan the upcoming pack meetings and activities, and makes necessary decisions about pack administration." AND "Although the Cubmaster, Tiger Cub den leaders, Cub Scout den leaders, Webelos den leaders, and their assistants are not members of the pack committee, they attend the monthly pack leaders' meetings and participate in planning activities." As has been stated before, there shouldn't be a need for "voting". Everyone should be working together as a team. If there is a decision that needs the input of everyone it is usually arrived at by discussion & a consensus of everyone present.

The current concept is a Webelos-ree (not Webelos Woods). It is usually put on by a District or Council. You might want to touch base with your DE and Cub Scout Program Chair. Here is the National Webelos-ree site: http://www.scouting.org/cubscouts/resources/13-238/index.html

Crystal balls using balloons with glitter glued on glued onto a base. 1/2 large stryo ball painted blue with gold or silver wire star garland stuck in & curled around. You can also add some gold or silver pipe cleaners coiled into springy shapes or with foam or paper shapes glued onto them. Paper bag puppets made to look like "future" cubs. Decorate front & back of bag & display over cans on the tables. Small jelly canning jars with blue or gold construction paper wrapped around & a tea light inside. Cut star shapes in the construction paper.

Sometimes Scouting for Food is tied into the USPS Food Drive. Maybe USPS Letter Carriers were supposed to be picking up the food in your area. If your Pack participated, then you should know who the coordinator was for your District. Give him a call.