ScoutNut

TS - There is no Level Specific Training for Assistants. Assistants & reg leaders are pretty much interchangeable & should know the same stuff. Take NEL & then Specific for Tiger Leaders. In the spring you can take Specific for Cub Leaders (Wolf & Bear). Then you will be all ready for next year!

TwoSirius, if possible, do the online Cub Scout Fast Start training before your Pack meeting tonight. It is a great overview of Cub Scouts & gives you an idea of how a den & a Pack meeting should look. You will have to register with a name & password & info on your council, but it is painless. Then, after you are officially registered & have received a membership card, you can go back in & enter your membership number so your council will get the records of the trainings you have taken. Have FUN!

Beagle asked if an ADL was needed for a Tiger Den. It is not a necessity for ANY den. It IS a good idea however and sure can't hurt! As for the position title, you would register as simply an Assistant Den Leader (DA).

Welcome! As others have stated, YES to the uniform. At least the shirt to start with. You said that you have already taken Fast Start, Youth Protection & Basic Training? By Basic Training, do you mean New Leader Essentials & Tiger Den Leader Specific? If you have indeed taken these 4 trainings then you are pretty much up-to-date with training. As mentioned, Roundtable is a good monthly, supplemental training put on by your District's volunteers. This is a great place to meet leaders from other Packs (& Troops) in your area. Most councils also offer a yearly Pow Wow or University of Scouting. This is generally an all day Saturday event with lots of different "classes" you can sign up for. Well worth the time & cost (varies from council to council) involved if you can make it. Since you asked about books you must not have received your Cub Scout Leader Book when you attended New Leader Essentials training. Some councils include the book in the cost of the training. Check with your CM & CC to see if your Pack will cover any costs for training or books. While you are talking to your Cubmaster (CM) & Committee Chair (CC), ask when/where your monthly Committee / Leaders meetings are. It is a good idea to attend those so that you know what is going on in the Pack & at the next monthly Pack meeting & how it affects your Tigers. Maybe you could alternate months with your Den Leader (could work for Roundtable too!). Babysitting can be a problem, however maybe their dad can watch them? How about a friend or relative? Maybe you could share with your Den Leader. Find out if there will be babysitting available at the event. Meanwhile, the BSA National site has a lot of info - http://www.scouting.org/nav/cubscout/l-main.html Current & next month of Program Helps - http://www.scouting.org/cubscouts/resources/34304/index.jsp BSA Online Learning Center - http://olc.scouting.org/ Good sites on the Web - http://www.cubmaster.org/ http://www.cubroundtable.com/ http://www.fns.usda.gov/tn/ http://www.geocities.com/cybercubber/ http://www.scoutxing.com/default.htm http://www.scoutingthenet.com/ https://people.creighton.edu/~bjs74318/bluejay/pack114/library/ That should give you a little bit of reading! Also, for the Tigers, don't forget to use SHARED LEADERSHIP!! The den leaders should NOT be doing everything!! Remember - KISMIF (Keep It Simple - Make It Fun!)

Brian - Even after repeated requests, you STILL have not shared what SPECIFIC "terms, icons, & items of today" you WOULD use. Your website is NOT specific, so please do not pull out that old, repetitive, evasion.

Just an FYI, brianbuf has included quotes from our discussions on his website. Beavah, he seems to like you, but is also taking potshots at a poster who stated they liked WB. There is no way for anyone, other than him, to place a comment on his website.

Before you start dividing up the boys, you have to have something to divide them into. Between now & your next committee meeting, get to know the Tiger Teams in your den. See how the boys work/play together. See how the Adult Partners work with the boys & react to Shared Leadership. By your next committee meeting you should have a pretty good handle on the folks in your den. Talk to your CM & CC about splitting the den. Have a list of possible leaders for the 2nd den. Get feedback from your committee & den leaders. They might know some of the families personally & have some insight for you. After that, it is the responsibility of the CC to find a den leader if they decide to go with splitting the den. Once a den leader is found, you can get together & decide on how to do the actual split. If it comes down to it, pulling names from a hat is a good, impartial way to go! BTW - I have 10 Tigers this year, with a possible 14 (by the time the slowpokes who have older sibs already in the Pack get going). Even though we already have a Wolf leader on deck for next year, I do not think I will split the Tigers with him. At this point, I just do not know enough about the rest of the Tiger Teams. They seem a good group & historically speaking there are lots of meetings where we are missing a few Teams. So, I think the volume of people will not be such a problem for us very often. Have FUN! Tigers is pretty easy & laid back. Get them outdoors as much as possible. Meld them into a group. Have FUN! Get the Adult Partners excited with what their Tigers are accomplishing. Get the boys comfortable with Cub Scouts. Did I mention to have FUN? You should hear our rafters ring & see the smiles on the Tigers faces when they do our Den Cheer! TIGERS ARE G-R-R-R-R-R-E-A-T!!!

Hey E - Looks like one of your young ladies hit the "big time"! Are your uniforms similar? I'm glad to see BSA has Ships represented too. I don't think they publicize them enough.

Brian - Ding Ding Ding ! I am curious as to how you KNOW this is how the BOYS feel? Everything I have read from you, both on your site & off, says the same exact thing - I SAY the boys are leaving Scouting because of outdated uniforms, icons, & merit badges. I SAY this is why Scouting is "dying on the vine". I SAY if you don't agree with me then you are "sticking your head in the sand" because I KNOW WHY THE BOYS ARE LEAVING. HOW? How do you KNOW that all of the boys are dropping out of Scouting for the reasons YOU state? Have you asked any boys? I HAVE, & the answers I got FROM THE BOYS do NOT match anything that you are saying. The BOYS I have talked to have NO big problems with the uniform, icons, language, or program materials. NO we HAVE NOT forgotten that Scouting is for the BOYS, but it seems to me YOU have. It seems to me that you are making this about YOU being RIGHT & the ONLY one who has all of the answers. While EVERYONE here agrees that BSA's membership is down, we do NOT necessarily agree with YOUR reasons it is down or YOUR methods to correct it. Can't you even CONSIDER another point of view except YOUR OWN? Can't you even CONSIDER the idea that you might be WRONG about the reasons BSA's membership is down? Because the BOYS that I have talked to, & there have been quite a few, do NOT agree with YOU. (This message has been edited by ScoutNut)

Flexibility is the key at ALL of the Scout levels. Even at the Tiger level, sports & outside activities has an impact. First, find out from your families what day/time would work best for MOST of them for outings. Then try to make the outings for that day/time whenever possible. You can also mix it up a bit and include a few different day/times for events to try & capture everyone. I encourage my Tiger Teams to work on any den activity or outing that they have missed on their own time. Sometimes I will also include a family activity during den time (neighborhood map hike is a good one). If I see that some Teams are having trouble completing things, I will do different variations of outings (or den activities) to give them plenty of opportunities. The boys who need an outing for achievements will get their bead plus a patch segment, those who already have their bead will just get the patch segment. The outings are fun & everyone gets something so they don't feel like they are simply repeating stuff. For example, for Ach 1G the Pack is planning on attending a Civil War re-enactment. If I have Tigers who miss that, we have a nature center that is also a historical schoolhouse, an old mill that was a stop on the underground railroad, & a working, live-history farm that we can do outings to. All fun, all different & all fulfill Ach 1G. And, if someone is STILL short that achievement, I can pick a nasty weather day & visit the library (or tell the Tiger Team to visit it on their own)! For the Sport Go-See-It we will visit games the Tigers are playing in. Between all of those & a Pack outing to a pro hockey game, all Tigers should be covered. The communication one is tricky, but for a quick alternate, a visit to the police station & their 911 center will work for both Ach 2G & 4G. And, if it comes down to it, you have to remember that you can lead a Tiger Team to their Rank, but you can't make them earn it! Do NOT give them their rank award because you don't want the boy to feel "bad". Life will not stop if they do not earn their Tiger Rank award. They will still graduate to Wolf in June and maybe they will make sure to earn THAT one! WELCOME! & KISMF! TIGERS ARE G-R-R-R-R-R-R-E-A-T !!

NOTE - He asked what SPECIFICALLY you would ADD or DELETE. Your web page is full of GENERAL complaints & GENERAL comments (update icons is NOT specific). The only info that is in ANY way specific is all stuff that can be found on the BSA National website. From what I can tell, looking at your website, most of your complaints have ALREADY been, or are in the process of being, addressed by National. Even though National works s-l-o-w-l-y, it does work. The program we have today is NOT the program as it was when BP created it. There have been changes made. There CONTINUES to be changes made. The handbooks all get updated periodically. Changes are made to rank requirements. Changes are made to programs. Changes are made to uniforms. Changes are made to trainings. Merit Badges are updated, added & deleted on an ongoing basis. National DOES ask for input from it's members. There is a survey out there on the BS Handbook even now. Contrary to what you claim, even the language of Scouting has changed over the years. However, personally, I am glad that BSA has kept some of the traditional terminology (& so is my son who is a TEENAGE YOUTH member). We rather like Beaver Patrols, Turk's Head knots (one of son's favorites!), & Cracker Barrels! AS for me - What would I SPECIFICALLY change? I would make training mandatory. I would toss all of those wishy-washy "could's", "should's" & "may's" out and replace them with "must's". I would end ANY thought of a kindergarten Cub Scout. I would find some way of verifying that units are running good programs (other than the Quality Award). I would find some way for councils to be able to afford to offer more specialized programing to units (without taxing their already overtaxed volunteer base) to supplement their in-unit programing. I would do a better job of saturating high impact media areas with great ads (Super Bowl?). OK, now to come down from "pie in the sky" time. The everyday trappings have little to do with the long term health of the BSA programs. What is needed is for individual units to consistently provide GREAT programs for their boys & for us to let EVERYONE know that these GREAT programs are out there. I can sit on a 'puter & complain about National. I can loudly bemoan to everyone who will listen that National's membership numbers are dropping like a rock. Or, I can roll up my sleeves, and get to work on MY unit. I can do my best to make sure MY unit is delivering on the promise. I can make sure that MY BOYS are getting the best possible program. I can make sure that MY BOYS are LEARNING, GROWING & having as much FUN as possible along the way. If every unit does that, the rest will work itself out.

None of the Troops by us use them.

Instead of crying about the sky falling because of a decline in magazine subscriptions, consider some alternative explanations. Maybe more families don't have the money for magazines. Maybe less NON-SCOUTS subscribe. Maybe the BOYS share their copy with their BROTHERS. Maybe the BOYS just don't like the magazine! Unless you have interviewed a significant statistical percentage of the people who have dropped their subscriptions to find out WHY they have canceled them, you really should not ASSUME that because a subscription is canceled it automatically means that a corresponding BSA membership was also canceled. If we are going to make unsubstantiated assumptions, while I agree that BSA memberships have indeed declined, I prefer the assumption that says that the decline in magazine subscriptions is due more to the fact that the economy is going to heck in a hand-basket & more folks are cutting back on what they consider superfluous things - like magazines.

ROFL!! Surprised? Not me! I see this attitude WAY to often. I had someone at work tell me once that they never read past the 1st page of a memo & if it has a staple in it they will usually just toss it with only a cursory glance!

No, I would not limit my sale to one type of popcorn only. It's true, we do sell more of some kinds than others. However, we sell SOME of everything accross the board. If we did not offer it, we would not sell it at all and then we would be out that profit.

Contact your District Commissioner and find out what this UC is up to. If that does not help call your DE.

Taking a look at the Loops, both Physical Fitness & Math need 3-4 weeks to complete. Some of the Loops are definately over the head of a new 1 st grader too. Also, in order to have finished so many Loops (which are uaually done at home so the number of den meetings he has attended does not matter), he & his Partner would have to have been off & running to different events each & every night. It sounds to me more like the parents are confused, "fudgeing" things & possibly using activities the boy has been involved in over the past year or 2. Their Den Leader (does each den have it's own leader(s) or are you the leader for all 3?) should have a little talk with the boys folks ASAP & explain how the program works. Requirements should be followed & only those activities done AFTER the boy was a registered Tiger can count. They should be reminded that the boy will be a Cub Scout for 4.5 years & there is no need to do everything in the first 2 weeks! BTW - Elective Beads (or Arrow Points) CAN NOT be awarded until AFTER the Cub has earned his RANK AWARD. This means that at the same Pack meeting your boys receive their TIGER Rank Award they will also receive any Elective Beads they have earned to that point. Check out your Tiger Handbook.

Den meetings should be planned by the leadership TEAM of Den Leader, Asst Den Leader & Den Chief (if your den does not have one ask your local Troop's SM).

From one Tiger leader to another - Welcome Jeff! 20 Tigers - WOW! That's quite a big crowd (40 folks!) to have in one room at the same time. I can just picture the Living Circle! Have you given any consideration to splitting into 2 dens? I'm doing pretty good this year with 10 Tigers (possible 13, we have 3 Cub sibs whose families are a bit slow to get things moving). If you have not done your scrapbook yet, here is a great starter page: http://www.crayola.com/activitybook/print.cfm?id=625 You give one to each Tiger & his Partner. They are to draw themselves & what their hobbies are (what they like to do). Then you go around and have everyone introduce themselves & tell about their picture. A great ice breaker & the page can even be used as a gathering activity. This might be a bit time consuming with 40 people!

We do our Scouting for Food the second Saturday in May.

Brian, I am curious about your Wood Badge experience. You state that while you seem to dislike anything & everything about Wood Badge, & are basically being forced to attend by your CO, you are still working on your ticket(s). May I ask why? You do know that it is not necessary, don't you? You can complete your Wood Badge training without doing ticket items. You simply will not earn your beads. With your distain for for Wood Badge history & traditions, I can't see how receiving beads that were originally taken from an African Chief sometime in the early 1900's would have any meaning for either you or the boys you serve. I am also confused by your Ticket item. While it is admireable that you want to "promote growth in scouting via a webpage" with comments & contact info on it, I do not see how this ticket item is SMART in any way. BTW - Being forced to sing a song, "squirrel" or anything else, in order to retrieve an item, is considered hazing by many folks. You might consider working on that in your Troop as part of a diversity ticket item.

If they start now they will have plenty of time to vist all of the local Troops & then be able to concentrate on the ones they are really interested in next year.

If you go to your Scout Shop, & purchase a copy of the pamphlet #14-619A, "District Finance", I believe you will find it states that no direct solicitation of funds by units is permitted. Asking for Corporate Sponsorships is direct solicitation of funds. Regardless of what your DE is telling you, or what you feel your finance folks at your council are doing, I can pretty much GUARANTEE that your council is doing fundraising aimed at business (both big & small) in your area. Soliciting money from a business will get them a heck of a lot more $ than hitting up their members and councils need money to survive. Now, perhaps they have managed to overlook the one (or more) business that your Pack has approached, but that does not mean that the council is doing nothing in your area. As to your Pack's money needs - Why do you need over $200 to run your Pack's PWD? How much more are you talking here? $500 - $1000 - $3000? How many boys do you have? Do you have an annual budget? Every area in the country has to face multiple fundraiser from scouts, schools & sports. Especially at the beginning of the school year! This is not something unique to your area. Our Scouts attend a Catholic grade school. Much of their families income goes to pay for that schooling. On top of that the school has mandatory fundraisers & many of the boys are on multiple sports teams (some are traveling which are even MORE expensive). Many of our families also have girls in Scouting. The girls have candy/nut/magazine sales at the same time as our popcorn sale and then their cookie sale directly after. With all of that our Pack, with an average of 30-40 Cubs, makes between $3,000 - $4,000 each year from popcorn. We pay for books, scarfs, awards, patches, PWD cars, Cub admission to outings, Pack camping and much more. The only "Corporate Sponsorship" a unit should need is that of their Charter Organization. Our CO helped us to purchase a new 4-lane PWD track, so we named our race in their honor. If they could not have done that we would have continued to use (& repair) our old track & possibly looked into holding a few car washes to pay for a new one. What more do you need?

Yes, GSUSA is going from 313 to 109 "high capacity" councils. Some "early adapters" started the process earlier in the year. Others are starting in Oct, 2006 - Oct, 2008. I believe GSUSA is looking at a 3-5 year time frame for all councils to be realigned.

Per the Cub Scout Leader Book, dens are NOT allowed to do individual den money-earning projects. The PACK can do as many money-earning events as it wishes. However, if it is not a council sponsored event (like the popcorn sale), the Pack MUST have their council approve a Unit Money-Earning Application BEFORE the event. The BSA literature & training advocates having dues the boys pay to their den leader each week. The boys "pay their own way" by doing chores at home to EARN the money for their dues.