ScoutNut

If you feel you need the help, there is no reason not to ask another parent to be an Asst Den Leader. There is no limit on the number of leaders a den can have. If you don't want to talk to the CM and CC to have her removed, then give her things she can do at the meeting that don't require pre-planning on her part. Things like checking books for things signed off at home, collecting dues, passing out newsletters, passing out supplies, cleaning up after the meeting, etc. I would also have a talk to her about inappropriate conversations, swearing, and most importantly, the "fudging" of her sons accomplishments. Remind her of the purpose of Cub Scouting and that if she lies about what her son has done it will only hurt him in the long run and force you to not be able to trust her.

Our CO picks up the re-charter costs of both their units (Pack and Troop) each year. This includes National registration, Boy's Life, insurance, etc. Boys, & leaders, only have to pay their $10 registration fee once. After that, as long as they are registered with one of the CO's units, they do not have to pay for registration. Our CO also pays for the cost of the religious emblems and helps with major purchases (PWD Track for Pack, tents for Troop). A few years back they decided that the boys should not be the only ones to receive help. Since then they have paid the yearly registration fees for the Girl Scouts as well. Our CO is the Holy Name Society of our local Catholic parish. Scouting is considered a parish activity. The Scout groups (Cub, Boy, Girl) have the use of the School/Parish Hall and the "Scout" Room for meetings and storage space. For all of the day-to-day program expenses, we fundraise.

MyScouting is up and running, somewhat. All of the online trainings have been moved over, as have recharter and advancement (although I have not used them yet). About the only thing that does not seem to be there is the online Local Tour Permit.

Our Pack does not charge Pack dues either. New boys pay their first year registration/Boys Life, our Charter Org pays all recharter expenses, and all other program expenses come from the annual popcorn sale. Den dues are at the discression of the den leader, but are usually in the area of $20/yr.

OK, I'm a bit confused. Your Pack has never done a fundraiser, the only income it has is $40 for new Scouts and $2-3 for returning Scouts, and yet your Pack still manage to pay for expenses, awards, cooking equipment, and a trailer (not sure why a Pack needs a trailer or cooking equipment)?? Your Pack must have an extremely generous Charter Organization!

Boy, didn't they just update their site about a year ago? I wonder why they are re-doing it again so soon.

It is entirely up to you. However, if you really, really, want to go this summer, why not change the date of your first Pack meeting? There is plenty of time to advertise the change, and even to look for a new facility if needed.

"technically, the ACMs and DLs do not attend Pack committee meetings...because they are not members of the Committee. The CM attends as their representative, but technically he is not on the committee, either. The CM and CC both report to the COR, equally. At least that's the way it was last time I was trained. In my way of thinking the CM is analogous to the SPL and the DLs are the patrol leaders. Program should be planned by that group and presented to the committee for approval. Then the committee goes to work to finance it, recruit new members, monitor and process advancements, etc. That could be part of the problem...too many people at the Committee meetings mucking up the works." OK - First off we should get some things straight. Are you EKMiranda, CM, or are you EKMiranda's wife, CC? And, according to the other posts, the CM (EKMiranda?) loved the ACM, who HE picked! Next - It does not matter if, as a Scouter, you are technically a member of the Committee or not. It is, according to BSA, the "Cub Scout Leaders Book", and numerous other BSA sources, the monthly PACK LEADERS MEETING, where Pack decisions are made by ALL of the Pack's leaders. A Cub Scout Pack is NOT a Boy Scout Troop, and should NOT be run as if it were! EKMiranda (or whoever) - This is not YOUR Pack!! (Although this is an ongoing problem with husband/wife, CM/CC, pairs) you consistantly refer to it as YOURS) This Pack BELONGS to your Charter Org (weather they acknowledge this or not) Get over yourself and learn to work with other people!

In the mean time, you might also consider recruiting another Committee Member - a Secretary. Sending out a recap of what was talked about, and agreed to, at each Pack Leaders meeting would head off a lot of the ACM's he said/she said on what was finalized and what was not. Also, if the ACM steps up and makes an announcement that is incorrect or untrue, why in heavens name let it stand?! It is not professional to allow the Pack to be bullied and lied to either. Interrupt and correct his statement. Let the Pack families know that they will be receiving further, up to date, information in the near future. Then send out an email or snail mail with the correct info to all families ASAP.

Then you are very lucky. Boys, especially the younger ones, get bored when they are not participating. Especially if they know they are completely out of it and will not be racing again. After all of the work the boys put into making their cars, we like them to be able to race them as many times as possible. We don't have separate races by den with winners going to a final race. We race the entire Pack together until we are all tired and ready to go home. Last year, with our 4 lane track and 35 boys, we ran 4 complete rounds. That means that every boy there raced 16 times. The final race of the night was with the top 3 cars to determine 1st, 2nd, and 3rd place. The kids all have a ball! Since we moved away from elimination racing the race is fun again. The focus has gone from winning races in order to stay racing, to the racing itself and having fun. The boys are kept interested and involved all night because they have to listen for their next race to be called. Yes, the boys still know who is winning, and they do care about that, but it is not as big a deal when they know that they will get lots of chances to race, and maybe win! This is what works for us. Other Packs do things differently and it works for them.

Please, Please, Please, Do NOT run a double elimination (or ANY kind of elimination) race!! They are NOT fun, and the boys go home early and disappointed after only 2 races! Do a Google on Perfect N or Partial Perfect N races. They run every boy on every lane, and if you have the time, against every other boy. If you are running a 3 lane track, each boy runs at LEAST 3 races, usually 6 or more. They have fun, don't get bored and everyone goes home happy. The program we use is the Sterns Method. http://www.wtrfrd.com/pack339/339stern.htm Have Fun!

Clothing malfunction??? Since you seem never to have attended any zoo/museum/cave/aquarium/battleship sleepover, or a lock-in in a gym/hall, and are paranoid that one of your families will sue you personally, why go? If someone is sue happy, they will sue you no matter what you do. Why subject yourself to even the possibility of a lawsuit? Scrap the overnight and take the families for a hike instead. Of course there is always the possibility of someone slipping and falling (where were the buddies!), not being able to keep up (hazing-everyone ran away!) or tearing their clothes and/or having a "clothing malfunction" (appropriate attire for the event was not worn!) on a hike too. On second thought, maybe you should all just stay home.

"I would really like to rely on a concrete definition of separate sleeping facilities. I appreciate people "making it work", but using the words "should" when it comes to this topic does not give me a comfy feeling." Merriam-Webster Dictionary gives this definition of 'separate" : set or kept apart - not shared with another - existing by itself For a definition of "separate facilities", the Guide to Safe Scouting describes what it means rather well. "Male and female leaders must have separate sleeping facilities." "Male and female youth participants will not share the same sleeping facility." "Single-room or dormitory-type accommodations for Scouting units: Adults and youth of the same gender may occupy dormitory or single-room accommodations, provided there is a minimum of two adults and four youth. A minimum of one of the adults is required to be youth-protection trained. Adults must establish separation barriers or privacy zones such as a temporary blanket or sheet walls in order to keep their sleeping area and dressing area separated from the youth area." So - If the facility can not provide different rooms (4 if you will have M & F adults & M & F youth - 3 for M & F adults & M youth) for sleeping in, then you will have to use rope and blankets to divide the room/bunks into 3 or 4 different sections. As I noted, since they cater to Scout Groups, the park/ship will have been asked to provide separate facilities for females before. Having done this before, they will be able to easily tell you what facilities they have and what Scout groups have done in the past to meet the BSA YP requirements in their facility. They know their ship, it's available facilities, and their own regulations. This is why you should contact the facility before your trip to see what they can do for you. Of course, if you don't wish to contact the ship because it is up to the Pack to "enforce and monitor" sleeping arrangements, you could just wait until you get there and then demand the ship rework their entire overnight and /or structure of their facility to fit your last minute specifications.

Contact the park and ask about separate sleeping quarters for females. The ship is quite large and they cater to Scout groups so I am sure they have had to deal with this in the past.

As has been said, the "ideal" size will vary for every Pack. A lot depends on size of meeting areas available and number of volunteers. Our Pack averages between 35-45. That seems to be a good size for us. We meet in the school of our CO Catholic church. We have the use of the school/parish hall and the multi-purpose "Scout Room". Many other school and parish groups also use the same facilities. If we grew to multiple dens at each level we would start to have problems with where/when they could meet. Many would be forced to meet in their homes, where space might not really be available.

We have considered purchasing a few Pack tents, but still have not reached any concrete decision on it. While waffling on that issue, we make sure that families know that tents can be found if the families need them. Our Troop has some older ones they would loan us. We also make sure to have one of our overnights at a place with cabins. This way we can get some of our non-camping, and our Tiger families out and give them a taste of camping. Some have then gone out and purchased their own family tent for the next time.

If you go with a deli it will most certainly be costly, especially if you have them make up platters. However, if you go to a discount, or warehouse grocery, you should be able to find sausage, cheese and crackers for significantly less. You might even be able to get the stores to donate them. Of course, then you must provide your own manpower to cut everything up and pack it in zip lock bags.

Knowledge of First Aid, like knots and just about any other skill/proficiency you can name, will fade for BOTH adults and youth if not used, practiced, or re-learned frequently. That is why the Red Cross First Aid certification is only good for 3 years and CPR is good for only 1 year. I would have the older Scouts do the teaching of the younger Scouts for this. It will help keep their skills sharp. Make sure any adults monitoring the teaching are up to date on their first aid skills too. My council has a First Aid Meet once every year or so. The meet is for the Boy Scouts with Webelos, in full moulage, acting as victims. The Boy Scouts get to sharpen their skills and the Webelos get to learn by having their "injuries" patched up. Half the fun for the Webelos is wearing all of the fake blood and gore!

manuelsmum - Since you are BALOO trained, I will assume that you know the rules for Cub Scout camping, and are not attempting to take your Tiger den on a den Campout. You asked about attending a District camping event without the rest of your Pack - this should not be a problem. Even though Districts will sometimes say to register as a Pack, they will take a registration from your Tiger AND his Tiger Partner by yourselves. You also asked about attending special cub scout days at different places. I am assuming you are talking about District Cub Fun Days, Scout discount days at sports events, or even Scout overnights at zoos, ball fields, etc. As long as the event is open to all Cub Scouts (including Tigers), and you and your Tiger register and attend together, again, there should be no problem. When you and your Tiger do attend one of these events, make sure you take LOTS of pictures and purchase a patch if possible. Then, at the next Pack meeting put up a little display showing the fun things your son did at the event. Hopefully this will spark interest in some of the other boys and their families, and when the next event comes up there will be a bigger representation by Pack families! And remember, if your family has the equipment, you can go camping as a family outside of Scouts too! Include picture of these trips as well in a display and maybe you can get your Pack families interested in going on some Pack family camping trips! HAVE FUN!

As long as the event is a district/council one, and does not specify that you can only register as a Pack, there should be no problem with individual registrations. My council will, depending on the size of the site and the number registering, group each pack together on it's own site. The rest will get put into mixed groups. It is a great way to meet new folks from around the district/council. Even if it states on your forms to register as a Pack, talk to the event Chair. They will usually take your registration anyway as no one likes to turn away boys!

How about I will help you with your taxes when you give back fathers and mothers to all of the kids left with out because of your current president. Somehow I think loosing a son, daughter, father or mother trumps you having to go back to work or paying a bit more in taxes. Good grief get some perspective!

There has been some rough going with this in it's first year. Many councils are letting units set their goals at the same time they are supposed to be seeing if their goals have been met. This makes the award basically a gimme this year. Ideally, at the beginning of the year (the award is a CALENDAR year 01/01-12/31) the unit leader, CC, and UC meet and set goals to be met over the course of the year. This goal sheet is given to the UC, and then the council. Then in November/December, at the end of the year, the units meet with their Unit Commissioner to see how well the unit has met the goals they set at the beginning of the year. There is no sorta/kinda thing. Either the goals were met, or they were not. If ALL of the goals were met, the unit earns the Centennial Unit Award for that year. If ALL of the goals were NOT met, the award is not earned.

Gee, my son got bronchitis after sleeping in the rain with shotgun shells digging into his back at his Ordeal. It's been a few years, maybe I can still sue! I need "compensatory damages for mental anguish" after listening to him cough and hack and complain for a week! At least she was inside, warm and dry. What kind of service did she preform? Other than suing BSA that is. And it sure sounds like she was anything but "Cheerful" about it. You know, I am really curious as to why her nomination to OA was even approved. Adult membership is not an award. It is based on what you can do for the OA. It really sounds like she was approved only to be PC and it blew up in their faces, in part because she has no concept of what OA, much less the Ordeal, is all about.

When it happens, I would first speak to the father and find out what is appropriate within their religion and family. The may not wake the body or have a regular funeral home visitation. Once you have the information from the family, make sure everyone in your den and also the Pack knows. If the family agrees, it might be nice to coordinate some kind of Scouts Own with the rest of the Pack for whatever visitation they have. It will be up to the families if they wish to participate. At the very least the boys can send their friend and his family a card. A nice big blank note card with each boy putting in a note and signing it would be nice.

Wow! 3 Pack overnighters in Fall (Sept - Nov?), 1 in Winter, another 3 in Spring (Mar - May?) and 2 in June!! That's almost 1 per month! How the heck do you find the time for all of those? Do you have enough BALOO trained leaders that the overnights can be split up between them, or do you have 1 or 2 doing them all? Is your Pack doing other monthly Pack activities besides camping too? What is your average percentage of participation at your overnighters?