ScoutmasterBradley

Our troop charges $0 per year and $0 per month for dues. Being a member of our troop is 100% FREE (the registration and charting fees are covered by an annual unit fundraiser along with left-over funds from campouts). We charge $15 per person per campout (to cover the cost of food and campsite fees, etc.) but we usually end up "making money" on the event (it's rare that we spend $15 per person on food and lodging, so an extra buck or two per person usually goes back into the troop funds for other expenses down the road). For a Scout that attends every campout (we don't do June or July because of summer camp and day-events are free), he'll need $150 for the year... and summer camp is another $300 per Scout (rate set by our council), so a year in our troop costs a family $450 (plus uniform parts, books, or other supplies from the Scout Shop here and there will probably add another $50). So we tell parents to budget $500 a year if they want their son be 100% active. Most Scouts raise more than $500 just by selling popcorn, so it's break-even for them. We do the annual popcorn sale and also hold an annual spaghetti dinner fundraiser (tickets are $10 for a Scout-cooked and Scout-served spaghetti and meatball dinner...we usually bring in $7,500+ a year with it).

I am a counselor for both Personal Management and Personal Fitness. The requirements for Personal Fitness specifically state: "#7.Outline a comprehensive 12-week physical fitness program using the results of your fitness tests. Be sure your program incorporates the endurance, intensity, and warm-up guidelines discussed in the Personal Fitness merit badge pamphlet. Before beginning your exercises, have the program approved by your counselor and parents." The Scout must meet with the counselor before starting their 90-day fitness program. The requirements specifically say "before beginning your exercises, have the program approved by your counselor." It is important that the Scout and the counselor discusses their plan, their goals, and their methods with the counselor before starting and then again once completed. The plan has to be meaningful, simply exercising for 3-months is not enough. Meeting with the councilor first ensures the plan is on the right track before the Scout starts. However, given your situation and depending on the quality of his effort, I wouldn't necessarily make the Scout start over and re-do 3-months of work entirely... but the discussion/reflection would be more in-depth and the plan my need to be extended a week or two to make up for any overlooked elements he may have missed. Now Personal Management does not specifically state that a Scout must meet with the counselor prior to beginning his budget and expense tracking. However I strongly encourage it -- there's nothing worse than a Scout going to meet with the counselor after working for 3 months only to find out that he did it all wrong and wasted 13 weeks and has to start all over on their plan (I've encountered it several times, where the Scout doesn't understand budgeting before starting and completely misses the mark with the requirement). But if the Scout did it, and did it well, I wouldn't penalize him because he hadn't talked with me first (that's not part of the requirement... but he is taking a gamble by starting without meeting with a counselor first and hoping he's doing it right).

So I had a few Scouts in my unit recently earn the Textile merit badge and in one of the boy's most recent Scoutmaster conference an interesting question came up. It was one I did not know the answer to, nor have I been able to successfully Google an answer to it either. The question is: where do the merit badge patches come from? I know where we buy them (the Scout , but where are they made? Where exactly do all the merit badge (and for that matter, the rank badges and other stock emblems) come from? Who makes them? I know they come from the BSA National Supply group (that's obviously who sells them), but does the Boy Scouts of America run it's own patch-making factory or is the production outsourced to some outside embroidery company? If so, who is this? Where are they made? I know there are many official licensees that make special and custom patches for special events and local BSA organizations and functions, but where do the national stock patches (like merit badges, ranks, position patches, unit numbers, etc.) come from? I'd love to be able to report back to my Scouts with some more information on where exactly their patches come from. Thanks!

I guess the whole flaw in the BSA policy/logic is that they say "the formation of peer-based, social relationships between adult and youth members is not permitted." However, what type of relationship should a 20-year-old and a 22-year-old-have besides a peer-based, social relationship? They are peers! Yes, the BSA draws a line at 21 for who can participate in the program, but being born 18-months apart does not change one's peer group. I would be more concerned (not only from a youth protection standpoint, but also from a social health and development standpoint) with a 20-year-old BSA youth member (but legal adult) hanging out with a bunch of 14-year-old BSA youths members (and legal minors) in the capacity of a "peer-based, social relationship" than I would with the 20-year-old "youth" having a peer-based, social relationship with a 22-year-old associate advisor.

Thanks for all the feedback, opinions, and facts here...however the more I've look into this issue, the more questions I have. I have two young men in my crew - one is a 19 year old youth member (and a vice president in the crew), the other is a 22 year old associate advisor (and one of the best adult leaders our crew has). While at Scouting events these two follow all the rules for youth protection and fulfill their roles wonderfully. However these two young men also attend the same college and are roommates (they share a house with 4 other guys). There is nothing romantic or sexual about their relationship; but they are friends. They hang out on Saturday nights, eat meals on campus together, and may occasionally go to the movies or other places. By the BSA definition of fraternization ("the formation of peer-based, social relationships between adult and youth members") they are breaking the rules. How do I address this? Do I have to ask one of them to leave the crew? Do I ask these two adults to stop being friends?

You're right, qwazse. This is a matter of "status". These two aren't worried about how this will affect them while they are at Scouting events. They don't mind having to show discretion or change their behavior at Scouting events (they are always appropriate for the program; and unless you knew them personally, you would not be able to tell they were a couple by the way the act at Scouting events). They aren't asking to tent together or for any special "couples" treatment. But I do know that they are both involved in (and very passionate about) their summer jobs at our local council's summer camp, and they don't want to jeopardize there standing with the BSA because of what they do with their personal life when they aren't in uniform. If it came out to the wrong people that an adult advisor and a youth member were spotted on a date together, that could cause issues for them and their reputation and standing with the council and the BSA. Would having them registered with different units solve the issue? (one would still be a BSA youth while the other a BSA adult, but they'd be on different charters). What if they both registered with a troop or pack (where the line for youth/adult is 18) but they still attend events with our crew as a "guest"? Is there a way these two can continue their relationship without breaching the BSA rules and without either of them having to leave Scouting (I'd hate to see either one have to take an 18+ month break from Scouting because of this).

Yes, the question isn't can they share a tent on a campout nor is it even can they share a kiss or hold hands while on a BSA outing (they currently don't do these things at Scouting events, and aren't expecting to be able to start doing it). The question is will it get them into trouble if he (an adult leader) goes out to the movies on a Saturday night with someone who is a "youth member" (even though she is over 18 and legally an adult). Does fraternizing of two adults outside of Scouting event violate youth protection if one of them is a youth in Scouting and another is an adult?

The rules of public displays of affection at Scouting functions and where they can bunk (whether they are adults or youth) is something that is easy for them to deal with. However in doing more research on this, I found that the Venturing Youth Protection training (http://www.scouting.org/filestore/ypt/pdf/25-026.pdf) states that: "The roles of volunteer adult leaders in the Venturing program require that clear boundaries be established between adult leaders and youth members. For this reason, fraternization the formation of peer-based, social relationships between adult and youth members is not permitted. This prohibition extends to Venturing crewmembers who register as adults after their twenty-first birthday." In reading that I seems that this loving, committed, and legal couple either needs to breakup or one of them will have to leave Scouting. Am I misinterpreting the rules on fraternization outside of Scouting here? Please advise.

I received the following question in an E-mail from one of my Scouts. Not sure on how to respond. Could someone more familiar with the rules and policies help: ==== As you know, I am 20 years old (and will be turning 21 next month). I plan on remaining active in the crew as an adult leader. As Im sure you also know, [Name withheld] and I have been dating for the past 3 years and are engaged to be married; however she is 19 (she wont be 21 for another 19 months). Both [my fianc] and I are heavily involved in the Venture crew and both of us work on the summer camp staff at [our local council camp]. What happens when I turn 21 next month and switch over to an adult in Venturing? While we are both legally adults, I will be an adult in the Scouting program while [my fianc] will still be deemed a youth? Will [my fianc] and I have to either (a) end our relationship or (b) have one of us leave Scouting for the next year-and-a-half? What are the youth protection rules on this kind of situation? What if we were married (as we are planning on tying the knot a few months before her 21st birthday)? Can a husband and wife be involved in Venturing if one is over 21 and one is under 21? ====

A young female member and vice president of the venturing crew I am affiliated with recently announced she is pregnant. While I was personally shocked by the news of this 16-year-old's pregnancy, I was even more shocked when several parents came forward and voiced their opinions on the situation at a committee meeting. These parents wanted to know if the crew could suspend or remove this young lady from the crew. They said her activity was un-Scout-like and she was setting a bad example for the other young men and women in the crew; and just as the BSA prohibits atheists, agnostics and avowed homosexual from membership, they felt her sexual activity and resulting out-of-marriage pregnancy was directly violating the fundamental principles and tenets of the BSA. Can we denied or revoked the membership or leadership status of youth (or even an adult) for such a thing? I would hate to see us lose her as a member and leader. How should I and the other adult leaders go about addressing the issue with these parents, this young woman, and the other members in our crew?(This message has been edited by scoutmasterBradley)

I've been told that once once you become an Eagle Scout, you are always an Eagle Scout (even when you're over 18 and even if you are no longer a registered Scout/Scouter). I am in my 40's (earned my Eagle long ago) but I will proudly say "I am an Eagle" (not "I was an Eagle"). However is this true for the other ranks? I was recently in a businees meeting and the topic of Scouting came up. One of my co-workers said "I was an Eagle". Now I did not jump in to correct him ("you mean, your ARE an Eagle, right?") because another co-worker chimed in and said "Oh, I was a Star Scout" and then another said "Oh I was only a Tenderfoot." Now would it have been right for these 40-year old men with no current ties to the organization to have said "I am a Star Scout" or "I am a Tenderfoot" in the same way would have been proper for the Eagle Scout to say "I am an Eagle"? Once a 1st Class Scout, always a 1st Class Scout?

Thanks again, for all the great feedback here. I understand that Venturing crews can devise their own uniforms - they can use the official grey shorts, or they can simply use other grey slacks, or they could opt to do something completly different for their uniform pants - that's their right as a crew and is part of the Venturing program. Venturing crews have freedom with what they can wear, however do they have the freedom to use parts from other BSA uniforms however they want? What is the stance/policy on wearing BSA uniform parts in ways they weren't intended to be used? Can a Venture crew opt to use official BSA uniform parts (Cub Scout, Boy Scout, or Venturing) however they see fit? Is it appropriate for them to use Boy Scout shorts or socks outside a full Boy Scout uniform. I was always told that the uniform should be treated as a unit and worn in its entirety - you shouldn't misuse the uniform (I recall some BSA litature saying that you shouldn't even wear a uniform cap with other clothing or wear the uniform shirt with blue jeans). So in reguards to mixing Boy Scout and Venturing uniform parts, while it may be okay under the Venturing rules to wear any pants or socks you want, is it misusing (or just being disrespectful towards) the Boy Scout uniform and program to use parts of their uniform? I would think that wearing Boy Scout shorts and socks with a Venturing shirt (i.e. wearing Boy Scout shorts and socks, but not as part of a full Boy Scout uniform) would be wrong. Is this correct?

Thanks everyone for the feedback and insights. My feelings is that the old difficulties with merit badge management at camp will still exist switching from "blue cards" to a computer system just changes the tools but won't cure any of the problems with poor managers, sloppy instruction practices, or lazy record keepers (it may save a staff member's wrist from 500 signatures on Friday, but the computer won't track the process and do all the work for you). But I don't think it will make things any worse and maybe it will streamline things and at least make records neater. However my two major concerns with such a system (and I'm sure a frequently asked question the camp staff will have to deal with this summer) are the following (and maybe some one who has been to a camp that uses such a system can help here). 1) How do the instructors know the scout has the Scoutmaster's approval to work on a badge? Under the "blue card" system a scout had to present a signed "blue card" to the councilor before starting the badge. How does an instructor know the Scout has gotten approval from their Scoutmaster to start the badge without a "blue card" (which, in a way, serves as the "permission slip" to work on the badge)? 2) With a partially completed badge, a Scout would get their "blue card" back at the end of the week with the completed requirements signed off by the councilor. Under the new computerized system the scout would get a printout of what they have left to complete. How does that work when continuing work with another councilor (or returning to camp the following year)? Does the Scoutmaster (who may not be a councilor for the badge) fill out and initial the requirements on a partially completed "blue card" for the scout to hold on to and take to another councilor? Thanks.

I understand that venture crews can set their own uniform a crew has the right to devise their own uniform if they wish, whether they want to use the recommended "overpriced" pants, shorts, shirt, socks and hat to be their uniform, or some kind of crew t-shirt, or a polo shirt, or something else. They can devise their own uniform. So in a sense, the camp staff (which all belong to a single council-sponsored venture crew) could use the green shirt with the green shorts as their uniform. However, does a crew have complete freedom to do whatever they want with the official uniform parts? Could a crew elect to wear the blue Cub Scout shirts as their uniform? Could a crew's uniform be the official green venture shirt but with the patches sown in all kinds of crazy places (not following the insignia guide)? Could a venture crew (including the female members) elect to wear the tan Boy Scout shirt and green pants? If a crew opts to use the official uniform, do they have to follow the rules that go with it? The reason I asked these questions is that I am part of a group from the camp staff working to re-establish the staff "dress code" and uniform policy - in past few years the staff uniforming practices have been ignored and have slowly deteriorated into what ever the staff wanted (as long as it was official BSA clothing no one questioned, or was educated enough, to know if things were being worn properly). We want to set some rules and do things right this summer. We want to have a staff that is dressed appropriately, respectfully and is setting a proper example for the scouts and scouters that come to our camp. I also understand that "legally" our Scout Exec could clear almost anything, but is it really right to exploit or twist the uniform to whatever we want especially since many visitors to camp may not know we got this exception approved? So is mixing the uniforms properly respecting the uniforms and programs and is it setting a proper example for other scouts and crews?

This summer our council is thinking about removing "blue cards" (aka merit badge applications) from the merit badge earning process at their summer camp. They are looking at getting a computer program called BadgeTracker (http://badgetracker.com/) to handle the paperwork and record keeping of this new system. At the end of the week Scoutmasters would simply receive a print-out of what badges were earned by their Scouts rather than receiving a stack of "blue cards". The council says this will reduce the chance of loosing a card, save the staff from having to spend Friday signing a stack of hundreds of cards and it will help save trees (and thus make the camp more "green"). So I was wondering what people thought of this approach? I always thought the "blue cards" were a necessary document in the process. It shows the councilor that the Scout has permission from their Scoutmaster to work on the badge, and it provides the Scout and the unit with a record stub to prove the badge was completed. Plus if a scout earns a "partial" (only completing some of the requirements), they can take their card to finish off the remaining requirements with another councilor (or bring it back to camp the next year). So are the "blue cards" really needed? Or can a system like BadgeTracker be effective in the advancement documentation and record keeping?