ScoutLass

I grew up in Campfire first, then later Girl Scouts, and I always found it odd that you had to wait until first grade to be a cub. I've been a around the cub block with a couple of dens, and the Tigers are a dream, it's the parent's behavior that can get a bit trying! I personally find Wolves to be the most challenging year behavior-wise. Even then, it's not that bad and just boys testing the boundaries. It's what kids do and it just takes a little bit of a firmer hand to keep them on task. Why does starting them early mean they'll get bored and quit before they get to Boy Scouts? I don't understand that logic at all. My personal observations have been the more active a pack the boys come from, the more likely they are to enter and stick with an active troop later on. A boring cub program, then the entrance into a boring troop, causes boys to drop out. Of course, I also think the BSA coddles and wraps boys in bubble wrap a bit, at least at the cub level. I think it's funny in a sad way when our boys are going to a 3-day day camp and their younger sisters are going to 2 week residence camps without their parents. I know our pack has lost boys because we show them these great videos at roundup where the boys are camping, shooting BB guns and doing all this great outdoor stuff. Then they only get to do half those things once a year at a council event. The rest of the outdoor stuff they have mom or dad hovering over them in near panic mode, because god forbid we give the boys some freedom to try and fail (or succeed) a little bit. Maybe if we get the boys and the parents in kindergarten before they are stretched in every direction, we'll get 'em hooked on scouting and we'll end up with a better program for the boys, which leads to boys sticking around much longer. I've found that when the parents are excited, the boys are too, at least when they are cub age.

Not everyone is of an Abrahamic religion -- in America or scouting. And not everyone with those religions feels the same way on the issue, either. There is nothing in Hindu religious texts that bans or even mentions homosexuality, so not sure why you mention Hinduism. Just like Christians, Buddhists, etc, some Hindus oppose it and others don't. But that's okay. If my moral roots, which go back 3,000 years, are shallow in your eyes, so be it.

Good for the UK! Now if only we could leave our puritan roots behind and do the right thing.

I've never been divorced, don't plan to, and am not a child of divorce, but I also don't have the ego to paint all divorce with the same broad brush. I've seen children hurt by divorce and I've seen damage caused when parents who shouldn't stay married do. I've heard the stories from women of my grandmother's generation, and the marriages they stuck with because that's just what you did back then. Abuse, cheating, disrespect -- you stuck it out. Fortunately, I don't have good values or morals because of a fear of being judged when I die. I have them because I want to make the best impression on this world while I am alive. We need to quit packaging morality as a Christian attribute and instead just package it as the right thing to do, irregardless of religion. You can be moral without being a Christian, or even subscribing to religion at all. My opinion is divorce is up mainly because kids are wrapped in bubble wrap. There is no longer an opportunity for a child to learn basic social problem solving and cooperation skills on the playground, only teachers and adults can solve even the smallest disagreement. This results in adults who never learned to compromise or talk out an issue as children. If you don't know what to do, of course it's just easier to quit. (This message has been edited by scoutlass)

This works well outside or inside, though you might not have the space in the sanctuary. You use marshmallows or some other theme-appropriate candy (we did this for Valentine's and used sweetheart candies) The boys hold a plastic spoon in their mouth, hands behind their back. The boy behind the first in line place a candy on the first boy's spoon. He races to the finish line, where there is a can, and has to drop the candy in the can without taking the spoon from his mouth, then races back to the line. Once he gets back, the next boy races forward and tried to drop his candy in the can. This goes on for a predetermined amount of time. The den with the most candy in the tin at the end wins. (We give out den flag streamers for the top ranking dens at pack games). Another one is a table game, but works well when you're trapped inside. Give each den a bag of mini-marshmallows and toothpicks. Set a time limit for the game. Once it starts, the boys race to build the tallest structure using only the toothpicks and marshmallows. Another option is to just have them build a structure (I've also seen it done as building a snowflake with the picks and mallows) and give awards for most creative, most funny, largest, etc. I have a ton of games. I'll try and post more when I have time!

Never heard of earning one each for Wolf and Bear. It says right on the award application "Dates of Service used to earn this award cannot be used to earn another key or award." So yeah, one of the cub scout years technically counts toward the Cub Scouter award, but one doesn't and the Tiger year doesn't. How I understand them to work (though the combination for Cub Scouter can change): Tiger Leader: 1 year :Tiger Leader Knot Wolf Leader: 1 year :Cub Scout Leader Knot Webelos I Leader: 1 year: Webelos leader Knot Bear Leader: 1 year :1/2 Cub scouter knot earned Webelos II Leader: 1 year :other 1/2 Cub Scouter knot earned.

I'm RT commissioner for much the same reason -- was supposed to cover for a couple of months, now it's been a year. One thing we did was hand out a list of topic ideas to participants at the beginning of the meeting, and picked it up at the end. The leaders ranked topics by how interested they were, then had a line to fill in anything else they'd like to see. We used that to plan the year. Some things on the list that ranked high: Webelos cross over and cub ceremonies B&G planning the perennial behavior problems topics Winter activities for cubs Geocaching and letterboxing Summer programs Cub level first aid We used the list to make a calendar of topics for the year. We'll do it again this fall. Cubs have a RT guide, but it's really not very much. Introduces the character connection of the month, and gives a couple of ceremony and activity ideas for pack meetings.

Great ideas! We already do a couple of pack and den conservation projects each year. Unfortunately, this year a large number of our boys can't make summer day camp because of other obligations, so to make it up to them we are doing the nature day as sort of a one-day day camp. We aren't scheduling every minute, but want one game and one craft. I'm thinking of combining the game with the hike, and making it a scavenger hunt hike. Encourage the boys to actually stop and look around instead of racing each other back to the trail head! There will be unstructured time around a couple structured activities, much like a campout. I'm thinking of ending the day with a short campfire program and roasted marshmallows. I'll admit, I have an ulterior motive. We are finally getting a few more families to join us on our campouts, but we still have some holdouts. The common refrain seems to be "camping would be fun if it wasn't so boring. You can only look at so many trees!" I'm hoping a day trip in the woods will encourage a few more families to attend the overnight and two-night events.

I'm working on our summer program. We have June and August covered, with our year-end picnic and our August campout. For July, I was thinking of a "nature day" in a local park that has hiking trails, gardens and a picnic area. I'm thinking of a 4 or 5 hours day with both activities and hiking. Probably a bring your own brownbag lunch sort of thing. I need a couple of inexpensive crafts and activities that appeal to all the den ages. Anyone have any nature-themed craft or game ideas to share? Hoping to get about 15 to 20 boys and siblings to show up.

Our pack had adult volunteer issues for a number of years. The current CM, whom I taking over from this summer, managed to finally get enough volunteers to step up for next year that we finally have all the major bases covered. A few pointers, I'll try not to reiterate what others have said: 1) I'm going to guess the pack doesn't have a strong summer program. This will likely result in more boys dropping over the summer. The good thing--you get to start over in the fall with all new families and set the expectations for adult involvement right from roundup. The bad thing--you are fully dependent on roundup and fall recruiting to get the pack numbers up to a survivable level. 2)Never let them see you sweat. Very few adults are going to sign on to what they perceive as a sinking ship, since expect it will be more work than it's worth to try and bail it out. Do as much organizing for meeting and pack events as possible behind the scenes in the beginning so everything runs smoothly once it's in the "public eye." Parents are more willing to pitch in when they see things running well. 3) If you aren't already, get thee to roundtable. Become a familiar face and other volunteers and district scouters naturally become more interested in helping you succeed. 4) Always ask volunteers face-to-face and individually. My method, which works well for me, is to approach a prospect with two jobs. "Hey, I see how great you interact with the boys at pack meetings. The boys need a wolf den leader and we could use someone to help plan the Blue and Gold. Which one would you prefer helping out with?" I give two options, and one of the options is never "sorry, I can't." 5) Get thee some den chiefs. Request some den chiefs from a couple local troops. Cubs look up to and respect their den chiefs, and they provide much needed help to your leaders. They also take some of the effort of a great pack meeting off the back of the CM, since den chiefs usually love to sing and put on skits with the younger kids. 6) Start off small so you don't scare away potential volunteers. Don't recruit leaders just yet. Instead, recruit some helpers. Schedule pack-style den meetings where the cubs are divided into their rank groups but are working on similar requirements at meetings. Plan the meeting and provide supplies. Ask an adult from each group to help supervise the group. "It's just temporary until we get a leader." Do this for a couple meetings. If the meetings are organized and enjoyable for both the adults and boys, it's usually easier to then ask request the adult to become a leader. They've had a taste of what's expected of them, it wasn't that difficult, so sure! Don't cut 'em loose then, though, or you may lose them. Continue to provide some support as needed. 7) Set the expectation from the beginning that all families are expected to volunteer some time to help the pack go. This is once again taking away the option to say no. Have a variety of volunteer positions, including those that are one-on-one with the boys and more time intensive (like leaders), to those that are less time intensive or one-offs (B&G planning committee, newsletter typist). 8) Give perks to leader or volunteer families. I've seen this work successfully in a couple packs. For example, the pack covers registration for one boy in each leader's family, or provides handbooks for leader and volunteer kids. Set the rules as to who qualifies for these perks from the get-go to avoid hurt feelings later. 9) Finally, recognize the volunteers you have and those that you acquire. People are more likely to give their time when they feel appreciated. Award leader's knots as they are earned, give thank you cards and tokens, and say thank you often!

I've had a long day today. Cleaned out my office here at home. I have a small desk I actually work at, the rest had become a catch-all for pinewood derby cars, stomp rocket launchers, construction paper and glue, chunks of wood, leather working tools and all the other flotsam and jetsam that makes our pack go. I got everything organized and inventoried for next year, packed away in the basement storage room my husband sat aside just for the scouting things. On my desk sets two forms I must drop off at the scout office tomorrow. The first registers my youngest son in scouts as a brand new Tiger cub. The other form registers the same son for his first every trip to cub day camp and registers my oldest for his last day camp as a cub. One trail ends, another begins. Except I'm still climbing the same mountain and my eldest is moving on to higher peaks. I have at least another 5 years ahead of me in the cub program. My eldest held my hand as we took our first steps up the mountain, gradually pulling ahead and letting go, before finally leaving me behind so he could climb at his pace. It's gonna be different with the younger one. He's already chomping at the bit and ready to leave me in his dust. He can't remember a time when scouting wasn't part of this family. When the pack wasn't his family. He's been looking at the calendar each day, waiting for June 1st. Wakes up each morning and asks, "Is it the first yet? Am I a real Tiger yet?" I can't wait to see what path he etches on the mountain ahead of us. Man, I love this scouting stuff!

I don't know anything about this pack beyond what's stated in the article. If the article is factually correct, my guess is this is a one-off due to special circumstances. As for a Bear in a tan shirt, that could be finance thing. Why buy a blue shirt when the boy is moving up to the tan in a couple of months. Maybe he had already outgrown his blue so they just stuck him in the tan since they had one in his size. Maybe all they bought were tan shirts and got them last year when they were on sale at the scout shop for $7. Don't know, so not gonna judge. The kids depicted likely were not in a part of Africa with scouting, since they are from refugee areas. This alone could be the main reason both boys and girls are allowed, since splitting up siblings for even the short period of time it takes for a den meeting could be hard on kids that have survived what they likely have and who have probably already lost close family members. Personally, I refuse to judge them on the limited information available.

I have extensive experience working with those of the Islamic faith, just not in a scouting context. As said above, it all depends on the family and how strict they are. The traditional food restrictions, halal, are similar to the kosher restrictions in Jewish fare. Like those of the Jewish faith, Muslims follow the halal restrictions to varying degrees. Some just avoid pork products, though others only eat fully halal meat (raised and slaughtered in a specific way, then blessed in the name of Allah). In my experience, those that follow the strictest halal diet usually supply their own food. Before food events like a campout, I would ask about food restrictions ahead of time. The same with the five prayer times. Some do the whole prayer, bowed down flat, facing Mecca, long prayer. Others take a quiet moment of personal prayer, faced properly, but without chanting, bowing or prayer mats. It just depends. Ramadan is tricky. Depending on where it falls, it can happen in the middle of summer or the middle of winter. It's a time of fasting, and depending on the family, the boy's participation may drop during that time. The easiest way to find out what the family and pack expectations are is to ask and work them out ahead of time. Let them know that you don't know much about the faith, but are willing to meet with the family half way to make them comfortable. Chances are, it won't be a big deal. For example, if it isn't a pain to move the ultimate frisbee game 10 minutes later so it isn't at prayer time, do so. If it is a problem, let the boy join the game after it's in progress. Work out the details beforehand so there are no hard feelings. it' all about give and take.

I actually find it kind of shocking. I thought it was required knowledge from kindergarten on up. We had to learn and recite the info each year beginning in kindergarten. They still require it in the schools here. It's not just important if the child gets lost. My husband has seizures as a result of migraines. Usually his migraine medication handles the issue before he has one. They are very rare, in fact he has only had one as an adult. unfortunately, he had this one when my oldest son was only 4 years old and when I was not home. My son called 911, from a cell phone (our only phone at the time), and gave the operator our address, the phone number, his name, and my husband's name. Though chances are slim my husband would have died from this seizure, it would have been much more traumatic for my son to deal with if he hadn't known what to do. Kids don't need the info just to save themselves, but for the sake of their whole families. It may just be me and my experiences, but I find it kind of irresponsible not to teach this information to children as soon as they are able to remember it. At the very least, it should be hung in the home in a prominent area and children instructed what the info is and what it is for.

I'm personally not willing to go so far as to say they are adult run or a Webelos III troop. I just don't know. Our area of Spokane has a few troops, and there is one in another part of town he is also interested in. When it comes to HA, I think his main fear is joining a troop where they do the exact same thing every month and every year. We've tried to explain that it's up to the boys to come up with outing ideas and as he gains more responsibility in a troop he can start proposing and organizing things, but his fear is if the troop already does the minimum, it could be because adults or the other boys don't want to do more so he'd be up against a brick wall. I know we have some troops that plan at least one major outing a year, and those are the ones he is contacting. My son doesn't really need help coming out of his shell, he's one of the most outgoing kids I know. He's physically active, loves to hike, ride bikes and is into martial arts, just competition against others isn't his thing and he isn't into the traditional sports like football and soccer. Everything has to have a purpose with him, and he just doesn't see the purpose of competing with others or tossing a football, I guess.

Neil, those were my thoughts, too. We brought up with him the chance the DL could one day be SM. We think that is another thing making this a hard choice for him. He's torn between loyalty and his needs and wants.

Scoutnut, that's exactly why I advised a second troop visit to the DL's troop. He was mainly upset that it appeared they were doing MB work in a meeting. My thought is maybe several boys had decided to do the same MB and the boys in the troop had decided to dedicate the time in the meeting to letting the boys meet a requirement or some such. I think part of him expects chaos, because he has read so many things from scouters stating the hallmark of a boy-led troop is controlled chaos and not the orderly behavior of adults! Lisabob, yep, he's thinker and planner. It's a challenge, because he is already planning his high school and college years. We have given many lessons on the "best laid plans...." in our home! The school thing isn't an issue, as he hasn't gone to school with any of the boys in our pack. One troop we are checking out is based out of his new elementary school that he starts in fall. If it's a good fit, the younger 5th and 6th grade boys in the troop would likely be in the same school as him. On a bright note, I had an SM of a troop he called last night call me back this morning to verify the meeting info with me. The SM said he was at first taken aback to have a cub scout boy calling him, as it's usually the parent. Then he said he was impressed not just that he called, but how he handled himself on the phone.

I've run into a few parents, sometimes moms, sometimes dads, that did everything for the boys. It's hard weaning the boys off that kind of support, but it can be done! Once I identify a perfectionist parent, I always have a job for them during the meeting. My favorite is to put them at a separate table to man the hot glue gun. By the time the boys get to the gluing stage, the project is nearly done in most cases. They bring it to the parent to glue. The parent is positioned away from the other craft materials and is dealing with a line of cubs -- no way for them to run over to the materials and start rebuilding the project for the boy. I usually need to clue in the Den Chief so he can offer a little more support to the boy who has never completed anything on his own in his life. By the end of the project, the little cubbie is telling the den chief "Wait, let me do it!" instead of begging for help. And you're right, that look of accomplishment on his face is worth at least a million of mom's perfectly constructed picture frames! It's almost as good when a year later you see a more relaxed parent that is having fun without being a perfectionist. Hey, sometimes cub scouts help improve the character of the adults, too! It's devious, but it works!

You are my Rock Star, 83Eagle! That is exactly what I was looking for. Previously we handed out the BSA parent guide, but it basically just says what's in the front of every single handbook. We need something pack specific. I made up leader books last year when I saw our "old guard" was starting to move on, and they ended up being a hit with the new leaders. I think they are what lead to the parent guide idea.

Forgive me if I ramble.... My Webelos son takes scouting seriously, sometimes maybe a bit too much. He took every cub scout patch he earned seriously, no fudging on requirements and being disappointed when he felt his leader short changed him and gave him a patch he hadn't quite earned yet. He decided a couple years ago which troop he was going to, mainly because that is where his friends are going and because his den leader is also an ASM in the troop. Lately, though, he's been doubtful. My son is smaller than the other boys and just not that interested in sports stuff. He's athletic, but he's not into competition with others, only with himself. Naturally, he's running into the challenge that most 9 and 10 year old boys are more competitive. His den played football and soccer, and he was hurt when his leader told him he wasn't even trying. He felt he was trying, He just wasn't that good and upset no one took the time to tell him what he was doing wrong. This isn't the first time he's felt that way. He feels his DL singles him out for criticism. It isn't about whether this DL is right or wrong, it's more about how my son is perceiving it. The DL is a great guy, but doesn't understand how to work with a type A personality kid. A personality clash has arisen between the two and a recent troop visit has just made it worse. I'm not sure the leader is even aware it exists. My son is very sure of what he wants from a Scouting troop. He wants to camp, but not just at the same two or three locations. He wants high adventure once he has learned the skills. He has dreams of whitewater rafting and hiking in the Cascades. He has spent hours online reading about what to expect from scouting and reading the blogs of various troops around the country. I wasn't able to accompany him on his troop visit, so I can give him advice on what he saw. We have scheduled a second troop visit at his request with me there. His impression was the troop goes to the same two or three camping spots each month, participates in the same events each year, and doesn't do high adventure type trips. He said the meeting didn't follow the meeting plans he read online, that instead everyone stood up and gave boring speeches about what they were working on (he thought, but wasn't sure, that it was for a MB), then they all left. He was upset that there was no scoutcraft or games going on, which is what he had found online to expect from a troop meeting. He was also upset the boys just sat in a group and never split into patrols. I tried explaining that troop meetings aren't like cub meetings, but all I got was the eyeroll and the "I know Mom, but this was like a PTA meeting!" To make matters worse, no one from the troop greeted him. He and the other boys that came in the den were set in the back and told to be quiet. He wasn't introduced to the SPL or SM. He had no SM conference, so he doesn't feel it satisfied the AOL requirement. He had painstakingly assembled a list of questions about the troop he wanted to ask the SM and SPL, but was never given the opportunity. We talked about it and decided to go back for a second meeting. That maybe as a single scout checking out the troop he'll be treated differently than as a member of a den crashing a meeting. He has also decided to check out a few other troops. In the end, the decision is his, but he is very torn and upset. There have been some tears. He gets upset before his cub meetings, afraid he'll be asked if he's still going to the troop in the fall with everyone else and he doesn't know what to say. At home, he's been assembling a list of troops and calling to request to attend a meeting. The decision is his. He knows what he wants, he knows what to ask, what to look for. My husband and I offer him advice, but bite our tongues and don't force a decision on him. This is the hardest decision he has ever had to make in his near 11 years. He asked us if we would force him to go to a better troop. When we told him no, he got upset and mumbled "It'd be easier if you did." We have some troop visits planned. Part me hopes the next visit at the DL's troop goes better. Another part of me hopes one of the other troops blows him away so excitement can carry him through joining a troop of boys he doesn't know. I guess what I need are words of wisdom to share with him. There ain't no magic words to make a difficult decision easier, but I'll take what I can get. Watching my little guy become a young man is painful, even as it makes me swell with pride.

I guess I should clarify. We won't be handing them out at roundup, but at the first parent meeting when we welcome the new families to the pack. We will know how many are needed since these are registered boys. Email and a website are excellent, we have both. But only about half our current families are online. Some of our families don't even have reliable phone numbers. We email out the newsletter to everyone that has one and handout paper copies to those that prefer communications that way. An online-only packet just doesn't serve our pack well. I wish it did, as I prefer online communication. Communication has become a real limiting factor in our neck of the woods, and even if a few packets end up lost or in the trash, it can't hurt. Thankfully, cost isn't an issue in our case as we have access to free printing. Fred, thank you for the link provided! It gives me a few ideas and mirrors what I would put in the online version. The paper version we are envisioning is more of a starter packet. It won't reiterate info found in the boy's handbook. Our set up seems simpler than yours as well. For example, all our dens meet at the same time in the same building, just different rooms, and we don't have dues. We also won't be including leader training info in the book, as that info is already in our leader books. This is just a simple list of the basics to help new parents get adjusted.

I'm taking over as CM in a couple of weeks. From talking with the other parents and leaders, one of the greatest complaints was how lost they felt for the first few months after their boys joined. We also have a group of fully dedicated parents willing to put in the time and effort to make the pack successful and fun for the boys. It's been decided that a family guide, handed out at the first parent meeting after fall recruitment then to each family that joins thereafter, would help make adjustment to the pack easier. I'm not trying to reinvent the wheel here. I've perused some similar guides other packs have up online for ideas. Each is different. We want to keep ours between 5 and 10 pages long. The plan is to put each guide in a folder with the current year's activity calendar and volunteer contact list. Families only receive the folder and guide once, but we issue updated calendars and contact lists each fall. My question is, what do you thing is vital to include in a family guide? If your pack uses one, what do you include? Any pro's con's or common pitfalls you've encountered doing a guide like this?

Very few people can write well, it's not a new problem. It doesn't matter if they are 12 or 52, it's a skill that only a few are truly proficient at. The writing I see from both kids and adults drives me mad, but I bite my tongue because I'm in a fairly unique situation. I am a professional writer, it's how my family earns its bread and butter. Yet, even I need an editor to write well enough for publishing. Add on all the styles to choose from for proper writing -- from MLA, AP, Chicago, AMA and Turabian, to name a few -- it's a miracle any adult can put together a sentence. One thing I run into as a writer is everyone seems to think I have an easy job, and they always ask how they can get into it. People rarely seem to realize that good writing is a combination of innate skill and hard work, primarily hard work. If everyone could write well, I'd be out of business!

I'll be first to admit I know very little about the Jehovah's Witnesses, but I was close friends with a girl that was one throughout elementary school. When we had school birthday parties, she would share in the cake, etc, but wouldn't sing the birthday song. For herself, she wouldn't bring in cake on her birthday like the other kids did. I would say keep doing things as you have done them. If you do a cake with the boys' names on it, ask if she'd prefer you left her son's name off. Other than that, it's up to her to decide how to handle the singing, etc. She may prefer to take her son out of the room during the song, or she may prefer to just sit silently by.

I don't think the gender of the WDL/SM as any bearing. It's about the quality of the individual, not the gender. There are excellent female SMs out there.