scoutingagain

"Is this Heaven?" "No, it's Iowa." My experience with that part of the country is the best part is the people that live there. They are among the friendliest, I've encountered while travelling throughout the US. SA

Good luck Dave and others trying to meet year end goals. I'll look forward to your wit and wisdom when you do have a chance to post. SA

I think over the last few elections standard strategy has been to initially appeal to those voters that will get you your party's nomination and then project a more moderate spin to appeal to the general electorate. Both Bush and Gore did this in the last election. I think you'll see Dean's message become more moderate as he becomes more confident of getting the nomination. In fact such spin is already comming out of his campaign with comments about appealing to less affluent whites and talk of how fiscally conservative he was as Governor of Vermont. His biggest liability as far as I can see in a general election is his lack of military service. Terrorism is still very much on everyone's mind and I don't think a candidate without some military credentials would get elected President. Signing the Civil Union law in Vermont is not likely to help him nationally either. I think Gephardt is too tied to the traditional Democratic Party, i.e. Big Labor, Big Government to get elected. Kerry...It has to be driving him nuts to be losing to Dean so much in NH. But ever since Dukakis, being a Democrat from Mass is like the kiss of death on the national stage. The real question is just how vulnerable is the current President? I agree, none of the Democratic Candidates is particularly strong, but as noted earlier, in recent polls almost anybody against Bush comes up with respectable numbers. That can't be too comforting to a sitting President. Time will tell, but again I agree, if the economy continues to gradually improve and the situation in Iraq seems to get better, Bush should win a second term, but that seems less certain than it did 6 months ago. In fact I fear elements in Iraq might go for a high impact terrorist event or attack just to try and influence the election. I hope I'm wrong on that one. SA

OT, Sounds like a fun trip. Lots of folks don't know how much fun NYC can be, but it's especially cool during the holidays. One thing I've always enjoyed is the "buzz" that seems to be in the air of NYC when I step out of the train station when I visit. The place is just charged with energy all the time. Good luck and have fun. SA

Hmmm. Is the sex thread being hijacked by the knot tyers, or does this mean knots and sex are related? (Joke) SA

Thank you Eamonn for expressing thoughts that I'm sure many of us share, even if it is difficult to discuss them. I confess I would probably take the same approach that OGE describes, as much due to my own lack of comfort discussing the issue with a scout as thinking it would be a more appropriate question for his parents or someone else. But, teenage sex is a significant issue, probably as much an issue as drugs, alchohol or other poor behaviors. Should we be doing more in scouting to help scouts make good choices? I confess, I'd much rather talk to scouts about a new knot, camp location, trip, service project or just about anything else and certainly don't have an answer. SA

With all due respect TwoCubDad, those sound like questions a parent might ask. I would hope questions a kid would ask would be more like, How many camping trips to you go on every year? Where does the troop go ? Do they do outings other than camping? Does the troop do High Adventure trips like Philmont? How are the trips paid for? Does the troop do fund raisers or do scouts(parents) pay out of pocket? How much do the trips cost? Where do they go for summer camp? Do they backpack or do mostly car camping? What kind of food do you cook on campouts? Can I bring my CD Player? Gameboy? DVD Player? Camper w/wide screen TV? How are patrol leaders chosen? SPL? How long has the Scoutmaster been with the troop? Associated with Scouting? Has he had any training? What kind? Ok, the last question is probably a parent question. I'm sure others will be able to add. Good Luck. SA

I certainly can't top Eamonn or OGE and won't try. Just thanks to all of you that participate, and a wish for a thankful holiday for all. SA

We have told one scout he is not welcome to attend summer camp with the Troop and would be on probation for the upcomming year. He is still a member, but has a history of behavior problems that constantly demand attention from adult leaders. This last summer the scout in question had a run in with the camp Director and was nearly sent home. The ASM at camp agreed to take responsibility for the scout for the rest of the week. The scout managed to stay out of trouble at the camp level, but continued to be disruptive within the Troop. The ASM basically said next year it would be either him or the Scout, he would not put up with another camp week with such behavior. The Troop Committee agreed, this scout's ongoing behavior issues were not secret and had gotten to the point where they potentially threatened the rest of the Troop's camp experience. I don't know if there are strict rules as to when a Scout should be removed from membership. I believe membership is a priviledge and the Scouts and adult leaders do not have a right to membership, and there are circumstances where they could lose the priviledge. But I think each case needs to be judged individually within each Troop for each individual. SA

I was able to find an inexpensive closed cell pad at a discount store for only a few bucks that I use for backpacking. I'm primarily concerned about ground contact with my shoulders, back and hips so I cut the pad down to only about 3 1/2 feet in length, primarily to save space, they weight very little. I'll bet a twelve year old could get away with one only 2 1/2 feet long. I put the pad on a space blanket and have never had trouble with dampness when used in a tent. I have used this system to sleep on snow in midwinter in northern New England and have been warm enough. A polar fleece liner or polar fleece blanket inside a sleeping bag as suggested by BW drops a bag's temperature rating by 15 degrees or more based on my experience. Keeping a watchful eye out at our local discount store I was able to pick up a couple of polar fleece blankets for $5 or so and had she who must be obeyed sew them into the shape my bag for a liner. I'm just suggesting you don't need to spend big $$$$ to be comfortable. If your son ends up doing a lot of backpacking, then you can invest in some high end gear. SA

I tend to agree with Hunt. The Scout Oath and Law are goals that are set to guide our choices in life. This scout is certainly not the only person to fall short of fully achieving those goals. He made some poor choices and will have to deal with the consequences of those choices in his life outside of scouting. As far as the Troop actions are concerned, I think it should be dealt with no differently than other serious transgressions that some scouts may engage in such as being caught drinking at a teen house party, shoplifting or other behavior that clearly demonstrates a lapse in living the Scout Oath or Law. I don't think the scout should be told or asked to leave the Troop, but rather than removing him from a postion of responsibility, it might be more appropriate to ask him to resign from that position. It's a subtle difference I know, but asking him to resign goes further towards having the scout acknowledge the 4 issues identified in KoreaScouter's post. This is a difficult situation and I don't envy any of those involved. Frankly as the father of a 16 year old son with a steady girlfriend I can only think,"There but for the grace of God..." I have talked to my son about appropriate behavior and consequences, but I also remember what it was like to be a teenage boy and young women today seem to be far less inhibited than I remember 30 years ago, so yes I worry. I pray he makes the right choices and wish for the best for those involved in this situation. SA

Our troop usually does about 9 - 10 weekend camping trips per year plus a week a summer camp. Usually we do an indoor sleepover ski trip either January or Febuary. The other months we tent camp year round, including a snowshoe trip in the winter in northern New England where there is reliable snow. The last two were respectable, but liveable, temps at least stayed above zero. Three years ago we had the winter trip turn into a survival excercise with temperatures dipping to -30F overnight. Since then we have tried to avoid such extremes, but those that went on that trip still talk about it. We have also started doing a 3-5 day trip outside of summer camp in August. Last year we went to Gettysburg and did the Heritage Trails Medal. A great trip. This year we are going to northern Maine to do some whitewater rafting and climb Mt. Kahtahdin(highest point in Maine). These last two trips are something I have organized to try and get the troop out of their routine of camping in places they know and to explore a little bit. They have gone over very well and word has gotten back to the Cub Packs in town that we do these types of trips and it has helped recruiting. While not quite high adventure these trips expand the horizens of the troop. Some of the older scouts are talking about backpacking in the spring. SA

Gee, when I first typed the word "followership" I wasn't sure it was even a word. SA

Unfortunately Rooster I am aware of an organization that not only kept pedophiles as members, but harbored them and assigned them to roles where they would have access to children. Many of you may have seen the news this summer about the Catholic Church in Boston and the role of a prominent Cardinal that re-assigned several Priests that had been repeatedly accused of molesting children. This apparently went on for many years. I do not hold the Catholic Church responsible for this, but the individuals involved. I point it out, only because in another thread we have been discussing leadership and several have pointed out that good leaders serve those they lead. The situation in Boston is a result of when leaders put themselves above those they are supposed to lead or serve. SA

Last year a group of scouts in our troop pursued the Theater Merit Badge. One of the requirements is to write a one act play. To demonstrate a one act play the MBC came in a performed a one person play he had written titled, "Lead, Follow or Get out of the Way". I don't recall the specifics, but one of the points he made in the play was that it was OK to be a follower, and that just because one was a follower didn't mean that followers didn't make decisions or ask questions. In fact he made a good point in that one of the most important decisions a follower must make is who they choose as a leader. While we do teach leadership, I think it is also important that we teach good followership, which might be better said as good citizenship. SA

As I have mentioned in other threads, I am currently a Health and Safety Manager for a large engineering/construction co. I am a Certified Industrial Hygienist, and I note that the designation and profession have been addressed earlier in this thread. In previous work lives I worked in insurance, manufacturing and in laboratory analysis. I've had the opportunity in my work to travel throughout the US, Canada and have been to China, Columbia, Saudi Arabia and Europe. My current responsibilities keep me fairly close to home, which allows me to participate in scouting. My boss being an Eagle scout has been supportive. I am the troop advancement chair, but lately have taken a more active role in the outdoor activities, primarily because our Scoutmaster had been overseas. He is safe at home now and we're glad to have him back. Outdoor Thinker, it may interest you to know that when I worked in China, the office I worked for was run by a woman who had majored in Asian Studies and Chinese. Many US companies had women working in China in significant leadership roles, primarily due to their command of the local language, and their organizational skills. SA

Try this website: http://sne.tripod.com/gtc.htm or here is the contact info available from the site above: Great Trails Council #243, BSA 88 Old Windsor Road (Off Rte 9), Dalton, MA 01226 TEL: 413-684-3542 FAX: 413-684-3565 I don't know how current it is. SA

SPL T15, I don't know your area well but I did want to encourage you to keep trying to keep the troop together. It sounds like you may need a new scoutmaster or at least a new ASM that can be more active with the troop. You might consider talking to your scoutmaster about recruiting someone and getting help from your district or council. As far as planning trips go. I agree with the others. Plan an outing you want to do and go do it. Even if there are only a few of you. When you come back and tell the others how much fun you had, I'm sure you'll get more to go the next time. I give you a lot of credit for the effort. My old Troop was a Troop 15, and it is no longer around. I'd hate to see another one go down. Good luck, SA

Just got back from a good trip to Mt. Monadnock in southern NH. One of our classic trips. We camp in the state park and climb the mountain on Saturday. It's a little more than 2 miles to the summit at about 3100ft. Small by even New England standards, but the vegetation at the top was burned off many years ago and you get above tree line for the last 300 ft or so. We break camp and head home Sunday am. It's a popular spot and there were at least four other Troops camping there this past weekend. Some comments from the younger kids were nice to hear. "I've never been this high before." "Wow, look at the view." Views from the top were spectacular. You could see all the way to Boston. 70 miles. But with an air temp of 22 degrees and a 30 - 40 mile per hour wind, we didn't stay on top long. Showed the kids how to make an apple crisp in a dutch oven. I had borrowed one for the weekend. It came out really good and went fast after a days hike. The Troop doesn't own one and they had not seen this before. All in all a good weekend. Spent two days outdoors with some good people. Didn't see or hear any news for nearly 48 hours and got home to watch the Pats win. SA

I usually respond to the age question with a line from "Hill Street Blues" , a "40 something white guy, just tryin' to get by". I'm actually 48. I'll have to change that line soon. Now that some of the ages have been posted, I'll admit I'm impressed with some of the wisdom posted by some of the younger folks that participate. SA

We don't ban electronic devices, but I a share some of the concerns regarding their use on campouts. For the most part the kids use them during travel, which as far as I'm concerned is OK. The electronics sometimes will come out late in the evening or as posted earlier on days when there is really bad weather for long periods. So do the cards, cribbage and other games. I can't say the devices have been abused in out Troop. When I drive I will listen to C & W, Folk or Classic Rock. We do have some scouts who have developed a taste for alternative country and blue grass who I'm happy to have ride with me and share CD's. On the ride back this weekend, we listened to Sunday Morning Country Oldies. Hank Williams, Patsy Cline, Earl Scruggs, Johnny Cash, Jim Reeves, Jerry Reed, great tunes. There is one scout I constantly need to remind to turn down the volume on his personal CD player because he doesn't like the music we play in my vehicle. That's my son. He tends to listen to pre-adolescent rock, which I find difficult tolerate for long periods. Speaking of British bands doing Country & Western. Ringo Starr did a version of "Act Naturally", an old country classic. Rod Stewart did a version of "What Made Milwaulkee Famous, Has Mad a Loser Out of Me", and Tom Jones I believe has done a couple, although don't know the titles. SA

Most of the Eagle projects our scouts have performed recently benefit the Town. The Town was recently awarded a former Coast Guard property and the scouts have: Built a picnic area, a walking trail, repaired and upgraded a canoe launch area. Our current Eagle candidate is building and placing doggie clean up bag holders along the town beaches. There is a significant bias towards building or constructing something in our area. At one point I was told, I don't know if it was true, one scout was told his project had to be built out of wood or it didn't count. That is no longer true, but the bias towards a structure or physical thing remains. My project was to clean up a vacant lot in our town in NJ. I'm sure it could not be done today. We removed tires, refridgerators, construction debris etc. The construction debris probably contained lead paint and asbestos. It's a wonder we're still alive. Others in my troop did project that benefitted the Church we were Chartered by. The bridge example caught my attention. Another volunteer project in town (not an Eagle Project) was to build a bridge across a creek(15 feet across) to connect a hiking trail on town conservation land. The bridge was built, however it was not handicap accessible. A law suit was filed and now the bridge is blocked/fenced off so no one can use it. Go figure. SA

I would be interested in the ceremony. This looks like a good Troop service project for our Troop Historian, to research former members that have gone on to military service. SA

I caught the feature on CNBC last night. Good presentation. Scout Ray Banks was featured in uniform. As an old trumpet player and one that earned the bugling merit badge this has me thinking about breaking out the old horn. It's in the attic somewhere...? SA

FloridaScout Congratulations. I've only sat in on one Eagle BOR but I do have these suggestions. Be confident but not arrogant. Speak up and directly to the Board. Show that you are the kind of Scout that will be a good representative of the Eagle rank. One of the questions in the BOR I sat in on was, " Why do you believe you deserve to be an Eagle?". Best of luck. SA