scoutingagain

Maybe the stars should come with a diclaimer: "For entertainment purposes only." Hey at least I'm rated. I find the whole issue of the stars ironic given our recent discussion regarding the recognition or lack there of of academic performance and honor roles. I havn't seen all the ratings yet, but yes OGE seems to consistently score high. What's the secret? SA

"I'd like to see us spend more time figuring out why people in foreign countries hate Americans, and less time figuring out how to protect ourselves from them." In a previous professional life I had the opportunity to travel fairly extensively. I spent time working in Europe, Saudi Arabia, Bahrain, China, Taiwan, Columbia and Canada. I was usually the lone American working with local contacts. Everywhere I have ever traveled I have been well received as an American and have encountered very friendly people. I did encounter a rude waitress in Canada once, but she was French Canadian. Overall from my perspective I can't agree that people hate Americans. Sure, there are some foreign bigots that will hate someone just for being an American, but they are a very small, but sometimes vocal minority. However, there are many opinions on our government's foreign policies.

We expect another group of about 12 Webelos this year. We need to do better with retention though. Of the 12 Webelos that started with us in the fall we have about 5 or 6 that have remained active. We have made some changes at the troop guide position after some scouts/parents complained the guide we had initially assigned was a little too drill sargent like. He is now under closer supervision by an ASM. We expect to lose only one scout through high school graduation this year, so we expect a significant net gain. SA

Glad to see Dsteele is out there lurking and still providing good advice when he has the chance. SA

Pete Townsend was the member of the WHO, who was arrested for having records or images related to child pornography on his computer. Reports I've read indicate he stumbled on some sites while websurfing and was astounded at how easily this material was accessed. He was going to write a paper on the subject and was doing additional research. He was apparently busted after he used his credit card to access certain sites and somehow his credit records were reviewed by police I think, but I'm not certain. Charges were eventually dropped however, he did go through the public humiliation of being accused and his name will stay on a sex offender list. SA

The tone of your posts, and the tone of your silly story that started this thread is that of mocking those that wear the uniform correctly, and take pride in doing so. Why do you feel a need to lash out against correct uniforming, and defend improper uniforming practices? As someone who has followed this thread, I did not read the initial story as interpreted above at all. I read it as satire, poking a little fun at those that seem to enjoy finding fault in others that may not wear the uniform completely or correcly all the time. I did not interpret it as mocking those that do wear the full uniform correctly. I do wear a uniform as a committee member, but as I confessed earlier one of my knots is upside down. It's on my list of things to fix. SA

I hope this isn't a trend. It does seem resources could be put to better use to serve youth than litigation. If local governments or other organization wish deny the BSA special priviledges because of the BSA's discrimanatory position on gays and atheists they have a right to do so. However, they should be prepared to deny similar priviledges to any other private organization that limits it's membership including women's groups, religious organizations, private men's clubs, private ethnic based clubs, charitable organizations that limit services or benifits to specific groups, etc. If not, it seems to me the ACLU should be willing to take up BSA's case so the BSA can gain access to the same or similar priviledges enjoyed by other private organizations. It will be interesting to see how this plays out. It's just too bad there will be alot of resources expended that could have been put to better use in my opinion. SA

After the 1980 USA Hockey team won the Gold Medal game a fan gave Jim Craig a flag from the stands. He literally had no place to put it. He had a stick, helmet, and goalie gloves to deal with. He had the flag around his shoulders, but I don't believe he ever intended to wear it as a garment or piece of clothing. SA

This past weekend our Troop participated in the District's Klondike Derby. We had two sleds participate. Two years ago we had one sled drop out and its participants reprimanded by the Derby's organizers for disruptive behavior. This resulted in some disciplinary action by the Troop committee, but that's not the point of this note. Last year we had two sleds participate and both finished in the bottom 10% of the participants, but they both finished the Derby without incident. The adult leadership considered it a minor success. This year we had one sled finish second overall in the Derby out of 35 sleds and the other was in the top third. The second place sled was awarded trophies and the scouts were thrilled. Our troop has not had a finish this well in a Klondike as long as any of it's current members can remember and we have some adults that have been with the troop for 15 years. The best part about this, is both sleds were completely led by boys. I worked at one of the event stations and was somewhat suprised at the number of patrols/sleds that showed up with adult escorts. Our guys were completely on their own. The sled that finished second was led by a patrol leader that really wanted to do well and made a point of working with his patrol the weeks before the event to brush up on their skills. His efforts really paid off for him and his patrol. To some of you that are involved with troops that really have their act together this might not seem like a big deal. But to see where this troop has come from in the last two years has been really satisfying. I just had to share. SA

I'm in a somewhat different position than a Scoutmaster, I'm the advancement chair, but I do sign off on advancement for boys. I have never signed off on anything my son has done, except when it has been part of a group instructional/test/or demonstration activity. And then he is required to do the same thing as the rest of the scouts in the group. Another thing I have done is deliberately not attend some outings so he has the experience of being outdoors with his patrol/friends without his dad around or if we are on an outing together and the Troop splits into different groups for various activities I will go with another group. There are other times I'm pleased to share the experience with him. On meeting nights it is usually my son who is telling me, "Common Dad, the Troop meeting's in 10 minutes we have to get going!" I too will be interested to see how other scouting dads handle things. Thanks for asking EagleinKY.

Thank you for sharing this site Hops. SA

"(One of the jokes about him is, Tom Seaver is the best player ever to play for the Mets in any position, and if you're not sure about that, just ask him and he'll tell you.) " To paraphrase an old TV line: It ain't braggin if its true. I saw an interview that Seaver gave several years ago. He said that when he was "on" he could put the ball in any just about any 3" by 3" square in the strike zone he wanted to at over 90 miles an hour. I believed him. The only other Met I can think of that might be able to make the claim of best Met player would be Nolan Ryan, but he did not play most of his career in a Met uniform. NJ I suppose you would prefer Roger Clemens? Actually a NY Yankee I wouldn't mind hearing from is Yogi Berra. I don't know what he'd say but I'm sure it would be entertaining. Like I said, your unlikely to please everyone all the time no matter who you choose. I'm sure someone would object to Mother Teresa if she were alive. SA

I think there are a wide range of individuals that could speak and not be controversial. Athletes, actors, entertainers, politicians, astronauts, and others could be good choices, or not depending on what they are known for. If they are known for success in their profession or personal lives and don't include partisan, or controversial polital statements many would be fine choices. I think certain individuals should be avoided if their notoriety is based on controversial positions or actions. I don't see how associating the BSA with controversial political personalities helps it's image as a non-political organization. Two speakers I have heard at college graduations that gave talks that would be appropriate for a scouting functions were Joe Paterno and Peter Uberoth. Polital figures such as Bob Dole or Jimmy Carter I think could give appropriate talks without being controverial. I'd love to hear a talk from Tom Brady. An athlete I've always respected that I think would be a good choice I would be Tom Seaver. Sure, it is likely that there will always be someone that objects to any individual speaker. You will not please everyone, everytime. However, I don't think Bill Clinton would be anymore appropriate than Oliver North as his notoriety as President is tainted by his actions in office. You asked Dan, those are just some of my thoughts. SA

While this event may be successful as a fundraiser I fail to see how having a controversial figure, from either end of the political spectrum, helps promote scouting as a non-politial organization. SA

We have a couple of boys that have moved to neighboring towns and have chosed to stay with our troup instead of transferring to troops in their own towns. They commute 10 miles or so each way. I think they stay because it is a way for them to stay connected to friends in the town they left and friends in the troop. Both continue to be very active. One is now our SPL and I wouldn't be suprised to see the other elected SPL next year. SA

I tend to agree with NJ. Certainly a misuse of the Flag, but I don't believe it was done with intent. As for tar and feathers? In my mind it was the worst halftime show we've been subjected to in 10 years or more. If tar and feathers are warranted it's due to the quality or lack thereof of the show. As for the Wardrobe malfunction, I was in a room with 20 people and no one caught it. The news this morning did confirm, I saw what I though I saw. As for the Game. I thought it was a great game, although the Pats made a number of mistakes that allowed Carolina to stay in the game. Had Vinitari made his earlier field goal attempts or Brady not thrown the one interception, the last minute heroics would not have been necessary. To Carolina's credit they made some bigs plays against the Pats defense and took advantage of mistakes to keep the game close. After the Parade tomorrow in Boston the local papers will be filled with the Red Sox. This is after all, really a baseball town. We just happen to have a football team that wins. Just my thoughts on yesterday. SA

This article seems relevant to the subject of the thread. In Georgia the title of this thread may need to be changed. http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&cid=519&ncid=519&e=1&u=/ap/20040130/ap_on_re_us/striking_evolution_3 Will we end up with half the nation's schools teaching science and half teaching religion ? SA

". I remeber hearing that by the end of this year it may drop below 100,000 if everything goes well." I remember hearing: Iraq had or was close to having weapons of mass destruction. The Iraqi's would greet our forces with open arms as liberators. Iraq oil revenues would pay for the reconstruction of Iraq. It would take less than 60,000 troops to occupy Iraq. While I don't have quotes, V.P. Dick Cheney expressed essentially all these opinions on Meet the Press the weekend befor the war started. And I remember the one General that expressed his opinion to Congress that US troops would be in Iraq for several years and it would take over a 100,000 troops to occupy Iraq was removed from his position the following week, i.e. Fired. Although now that we have invaded a country, removed its government(as bad as it was, and that is a good thing), destroyed much of it's infrastructure I believe we have moral obligation to stay in Iraq as long as it takes to establish a stable government,(not necessarily democratic) so the country does not disintegrate into civil war and the Iraqi's can defend themselves from neighboring countries that would like to influence events in Iraq. In the end I wouldn't be suprised if the Iraqis end up with a Moslem government, trading with the French, Germans and Russians. SA

Dave, if your lurking, congradulations and good luck. Hope things work our for the best for you. SA

"We've never attacked Taiwan or have we? " No, at least I don't think so. Not yet. The only reason I can think of that we would attack Taiwan would be if they were to declare themselves an independant democracy. As long as they agree to stay sort of associated the a communist dictatorship they'll be our allies. SA

Any country of 30,000,000 people and 10,000,000 square kilometers that can defend it's citizens for $7.5 billion(US) and produces better beer than Budweiser or Miller is OK with me. Of course they don't have the luxury of being able to unilaterally fight a war against other countries thousands of miles away that do not pose an immiediate threat to their citizenry. But don't eat the meat.... it's spoiled. SA

I found the article quite interesting, but tend to agree with NJ and OGE. I'll also point out that I've known many men, and I'm sure we all know examples, that were less than ideal examples of character in their youth that have grown into fine adults and good examples of men. How many of your male contemporaries, or yourselves, at ages 13, 14, 15 or so acted like fools from time to time? Some men outgrow their wimpishness or barbarianism, if they have such tendancies, by the time they get to college, others may not outgrow it or mature until their in their 30's or even later. Some never do. I can only comment on what I've experienced and am familiar with, men under 50 or so, and if there is a trend to have more barbarians and wimps, I don't see it. I can believe that some generational experiences create the need for youth to grow up faster than others. I can understand the WWII generation, growing up during the depression where many boys had to work to help support families and comming of age during the war required young men to grow up quickly. Most males of the WWII generation never had the opportunity to experience post-adolescent youth the way their son's and grandson's did. Neither do most combat verterans, but it is not like the WWII generation, where almost all males participated in the war effort in some way. I do agree that character traits of barbarianism and wimpishness as described in the article are undesirable and we, as scouters, should help scouts grow, mature, and become men of character. SA

I think women should be able to serve (and they do) in any leadership capacity within the BSA that they are capable of. I've seen excellent female leadership in many positions and I've seen ...well, less than excellent female leadership. I can say the exact same thing about male leadership within the BSA. I think that the idea all women mother the boys or don't like to camp is just wrong. Our troop comittee is chaired by a woman and she camps with the troop at least once or twice a year. The scoutmaster's mom camps with us at least as often and is one of the troops strongest hikers. Having women on some of the camping trips tends to civilize both the boys and the men that are along. Having stated support for the participation of women as scouters, I would like to also say, I think scouting offers a unique environment for boys and young men to interact with adults, especially male adults. I see nothing wrong with promoting the idea that boys have strong male role models and mentors to work with. I think women can, and do, make a tremendous contribution to scouting. But I think a troop that had mostly female leadership in adult positions would deny boys the opportunity to work with male mentors and strong male role models. SA

Sad to say I've seen this issue crop up in some surrounding towns here in Mass as well. For some reason though, no one seems to want to get rid of the Football or Basketball team because some kids don't make the starting lineup. SA

I view this forum as a place to share suggestions and ideas to be considered. In no way shape or form should any statement in these forums, regardless of who presents it, be confused with official postions, policies or requirements of the BSA. I assumed we all understood that. SA