scoutingagain

Can anyone living in Friday the 17th tell me who wins the NCAA brackets that day? I can make a killing in the office pool tomorrow. SA

"And to be practical, how could the dems be any worse than the Republicans on spending, government size or immigration? " At this point I would even add security and defense. I read a recent article where fomer military personnel are lining up to run for office under the Democratic Party. While we can never know what might have been, it's hard to believe we would be any worse off with Kerry as President than we are right now. Iraq war vets will have strong credibility with respect to defense and security issues, especially running against Republican incumbents that have spent the last 4 years in a comfy Washington office, or who have never served. Although I suppose I shouldn't underestimate the depth to which this party will sink to given the way they have treated veterans such as McCain, Murtha and Cleland. http://www.boston.com/news/politics/us_house/articles/2005/11/27/veterans_take_on_new_battle_run_for_office?mode=PF I've stated earlier I generally consider myself an independant, although if I tallied my votes, I usually vote Republican more often than Democrat. I agree with Gern, this rendition of the Republican Party that has abandoned Reagan's small, non-intrusive government mantra, needs to be sent a message. Although I will also say, given the general lack of satisfaction with the current administration, I find it somewhat amazing the Democrats have not been able to gain more ground politically. They, also need to reexamine their approach to Government. I would love to see a viable third party emerge. It seems when we had third party candidates for president the last several elections, it forced the other parties closer to the center. Now, both parties seem to cater to their extremes and those of us in the middle feel pretty left out, leaving us to vote for what we feel like are the lesser of two poor alternatives. SA

"If I were a resident of Berkeley, I'd vote to sell the marina rather than continue to support a government service catering to the small segment of the population who happen to be wealthy yachters. There's no reason this shouldn't be privatized. " Me too. Once privatized a berth could be offered to the scouts at a discount. Alternatively they could start an Exploring organization partnered with the Harbormaster or Harbor patrol. Some of you may have heard of Exploring. From the Learning for Life website," Exploring is based on a unique and dynamic relationship between youth and the organizations in their communities. Local community organizations initiate a specific Explorer post by matching their people and program resources to the interests of young people in the community. The result is a program of activities that helps youth pursue their special interests, grow, and develop." This is a national organization headquartered in Irving, TX and of course has nothing to do with the BSA. I mean the BSA is an organization that stands on principles and would never compromise their membship standards. SA

Like others I'm glad all turned out OK. While it is 20/20 hindsight, any instance like this can and should be examined for lessons learned. We can't put ourselves in the exact shoes of this leader at the time, but we can think about similar scenarios and ask ourselves what we would do. As for me, I would not be considering a winter nightime backpacking outing for the group of 11-13 year olds I serve, regardless of the weather forecast. Our older scouts, sure and I'm confident they would do fine. The younger scouts in my unit frankly are just not ready for that kind of outing yet and we camp year round in New England. We have a winter campout scheduled for this weekend for the whole unit, younger boys included. We'll be hiking about a half-mile into a group campsite near an abandoned ski area. We're watching the weather, and hoping for some snow! Right now there's hardly any in the mountains of NH. Current forecast is partly sunny, highs in the 30's lows in the teens, with possible snow showers. SA

"If Berkeley was a private organization, they'd be free to give their money to anyone they wanted to, and I wouldn't complain." Absolutely correct. The best potential source for discounted berthing for BSA ships would be at a private marina that would be willing to give the scouts a break. Because they are the government, it is perfectly understandable to me that the government would required those non-profits using public facilities allow access to all citizens. The BSA does not do that. The BSA's only case is if the city is allowing other non-profits that dicriminate access to the facilities and then they are only likely to succeed in getting another non-profits access denied. SA

"The free speech case challenged the legality of removing or withholding public subsidies from groups whose ideals run counter to the government." I assume the City of Berkely and it's citizens then support the recent decision of the Federal Government to withhold funding to schools that do not allow military recruiters on campus. Conversly I suppose the Boy Scouts would support those schools that want to deny access to military recruiters, yet still recieve federal funds. Ain't it a shame when the laws have to apply to everyone equally. Perhaps some should be more equal than others. SA

This is an honest question, because I don't know. From," The values of the nation as a nation are Christian values (as opposed to sectarian, Muslim, Hindu or Buddhist)." Just what Christian values that would be considered the values of the nation are not shared by other faiths. What values that would be considered American values are uniquely Christian? SA

DanK, I suspect I'm the only one who get's the TirNaNog reference! You'll find me over at the Plough & Stars. Doubt we'll run into Ollie at either one. SA Sorry guys can't help myself. The thread has reminded me of the words of Mr. Zimmerman: "Oh God said to abraham kill me a son Abe said man you must be puttin me on God said no, abe said what God say you can do what you wanna but The next time you see me comin you better run Well abe said where dyou want this killin done God said out on highway 61 Well georgia sam he had a bloody nose Welfare department wouldnt give him no clothes They asked poor howard where can I go Howard said theres only one place I know Sam said tell me quick man I got to run Oh howard just pointed with his gun And said that way down highway 61 Well mack the finger said to louie the king i got 40 red white and blue shoestrings And a thousand telephone that dont ring. Do you know where I can get rid of these things? And louie the king said let me think for a minute son Then he said yes I think it can be easily done Just take everything down to highway 61 Now the 5th daughter on the 12th night Told the first father that things werent right my complexion, she says, is much too white He said come here and step into the light He said hmm youre right let me tell the 2nd mother this has been done But the 2nd mother was with the 7th son And they were both out on highway 61 Now the roving gambler he was very bored Trying to create a next world war He found a promoter who nearly fell off the floor He said i never engaged in this kind of thing before But yes, i think it can be very easily done Well just put some bleachers out in the sun And have it on highway 61"

Welcome Eric, In a new unit, with all young scouts and adult leaders new to Boy Scouts I can see where it would be a real challenge for the adults. The concept of boy led is a tough nut to crack under most circumstances for new adult leaders. I could see where it might be even tougher to get a handle on it in a new unit with made up of first year scouts. I speak from experience. My son crossed over 5 years ago and I can admit I'm finally getting to the point where I think I can successfully implement the boy led concept, not just say what it is. Frankly the boys were ready before I was. I thought I understood what boy led was but time, training, experience, this forum and observation of other units has kept me learning. In addition to training I would suggest you visit some other veteran troops in the area. Don't go to just any unit. Ask your unit commissioner if he/she knows of a unit that really has this boy led thing done well and see how they operate. You've recieved a lot of unsolicited advice from me and others. Please do not take offense. Your dedication and commitment to the boys is admirable and I wish you the best of luck. Watching those boys grow into young men will be one of the most rewarding things you will do. I would not limit their choices, but guide them in their decision making. Good luck, SA

Nearly all our activities are non-advancement opportunities. Very few of our outings or activities are planned around a specific advancement requirement. However, many of the activities that the unit does, qualify for meeting an advancement requirement, like hiking or biking, camping, cooking, visiting a historic site etc. Or the preparation for those activities like planning a hike, a menu etc. SA

I'll stay out of the motto thing. But seems to me having Ollie North, Anne Coulter, Jane Fonda or Micheal Moore to speak at a Scout function is a sure fire way to potentially alienate half the population of the country in our currently polarized political environment. Now getting all four to show up and talking about all the good things scouting does, regardless of one's political affiliation would be neat trick, and worth paying $$ to hear. SA

We have a fall sign up and recruiting campaign every year. We send a note to each scout letting them know the can re-register with the troop any meeting in September. If we havn't seen them in the first two meetings, we usually give them a call, unless they have made it known they don't want to re-up for the year. If we don't hear from them one way or another by the time we re-charter in December, they're dropped. They are free to sign-up again at any time, but we don't carry dead wood on the charter. Same scenario goes for the adults. SA

Personally I'm in favor of a line item veto. Even for Bush. Anything that makes it more difficult for Congress to spend my money I regard as a good thing. Sure the $25 million identified for the Jambo may go, but so will the other few $ billion in pork spending. Protecting pork barrel spending just so we don't lose our little piece of bacon is shortsighted. As much as I'd like to see it, I agree with Lisa. This will never happen and is pure political gamesmanship. Since the mantle of fiscal responsibility has all but been blown away from the Republicans, the Dems are trying to set themselves up to make some claim to it, without actually having to do anything. SA

Foto's observations on politics in scouting I believe is correct. In our district, smack in the middle of "liberal" Massachusetts...with a long time openly gay congressman...membership is infact holding its own, maybe even up slightly and we had record response to last years FOS campaign. There's more to the membership decline than politics. I don't know what it is but I don't think it is entirely due to the loss of public CO's or BSA's position on values. SA

The idea that a significant number of high school athletes will get full college scholarships is laughable. These folks are delusional to say the least. For Div 1 and Div1A colleges, my observation is that there are only a handful of high school athletes per high school that can compete at this level, let alone qualify for a full scholarship. There may be more opportunity for Div II colleges, but they have less money per student available, and Div III colleges generally do not have athletic money available. The exception is women. With Title 9, there is literally more athletic money for high school female athletes than there are athletes available to use it. Have your daughter take up a sport, and tell your son to hit the books. There is now more $$ available for male scholars given boys relative poorer academic performance compared to girls. SA I'm reminded of the commercial for an investment company that shows a dad hitting tennis balls at his daughter and asking, "what's your retirement plan."

FWIW, back in ancient times, when crew photos were taken in B&W, knee socks and garters were worn with the summer uniform, and Richard Nixon was still around to kick around...I used a 30 degree bag and was quite comfortable. I will confess though our trek did not take us to some of the highest elevations within the reservation. I don't know if there have been any significant climactic changes since then that would effect Philmont. However, it is a definate you will need more than a summer weight sleeping bag. As noted, much will depend on how well you tolerate temperature changes and altitude. I note your from Downingtown, PA. A sleeping bag that would serve you in March in your area would probably be OK. Good luck and have the time of your life. SA

"What is the lesson being learned here? " There are all kinds of people in this world, big ones, small ones, smart ones, dumb ones, rich ones & poor ones....and we are but humble scout leaders who's main focus should be on providing a quality program for the youth members and don't sweat the small stuff. $1500 turned in late is small stuff. $1500 not turned in is bigger stuff. How an adult choses to spend his money is very small stuff. SA

I won't get into a discussion on the cost of the uniform. But for those that are looking to outfit themselves or their unit for backpacking should check out http://www.scoutdirect.com/. This site had been mentioned in the forums before. We checked it out and for our High Knoll trip last year purchased 5 backpacking tents and 6 backpacks. The tents and backpacks ran about $70 each. They were of excellent quality, held up well and they are still in use. In short, we found the testimonials on their website to be true. Wish I could find such an outlet for uniforms. SA

I don't know if it is the Scoutmaster's job specifically, but the explanation I got from our district is that the charter represents who is active in the unit, and it is up to the unit to determine who is on the charter. So, if a scout is on a unit charter, as far as anyone outside the unit is concerned, the scout is considered active. SA

On a recent visit to one of our European offices I was offered the use of a "Beamer". I'm thinking, sweet!, a BMW! only to find out they meant an LCD projector! In Boston the Subway is the "T" as in MTA. Soda/Pop is..get this "Tonic". And a Milkshake is a "Frappe". A drinking water fountain is a "Bubbler". In the USA we belong to a scouting organzation..in the UK scouts belong to an organisation. And as Pint has informed us, in the UK some scout camps apparently have a PUB! We here in the New World still suffer from the lack of such civilized (or is it civilised?) benefits at our camps. SA

"Also be fully award that if you have kids drinking Mountain Dew or Big Red. They have more caffeine in them that about two large cups of coffee. " Not to mention the plethora of so called "Energy" drinks like Boost, Red Bull etc. We had one scout show up to a meeting after one of these and he was literally bouncing off the walls. I have not heard of any such pronouncement from national. SA

The best show currently on TV and the only one I acutally try and watch is "24 Hours". Just how many terrorist threats can one man thwart in a day? SA

For those looking for quotes, I've posted this before from the Iraq Survey Group,(appointed by the President) report that can be found on the CIA website. I'm sure it's the unclassified version. " The Iraq Survey Group (ISG) has uncovered no evidence Iraq retained Scud-variant missiles, and debriefingsof Iraqi offi cials in addition to some documentation suggest that Iraq did not retain such missiles after 1991. Saddam Husayn ended the nuclear program in 1991 following the Gulf war. ISG found no evidence to suggest concerted efforts to restart the program. While a small number of old, abandoned chemical munitions have been discovered, ISG judges that Iraq unilaterally destroyed its undeclared chemical weapons stockpile in 1991. There are no credible indications that Baghdad resumed production of chemical munitions thereafter, a policy ISG attributes to Baghdads desire to see sanctions lifted, or rendered ineffectual, or its fear of force against it should WMD be discovered. In practical terms, with the destruction of the Al Hakam facility, Iraq abandoned its ambition to obtain advanced BW weapons quickly. ISG found no direct evidence that Iraq, after 1996, had plans for a new BW program or was conducting BW-specifi c work for military purposes. Indeed, from the mid-1990s, despite evidence of continuing interest in nuclear and chemical weapons, there appears to be a complete absence of discussion or even interest in BW at the Presidential(Saddam) level." THERE WERE NO WMD in Iraq at the time we chose to go to war that represented a threat to the US, it's allies, or Iraq's neighbors. Period. That is a fact as verifiable as can be had. Confirmed by both UN and US Weapons inspectors, as well as 3 years of occupation by hundreds of thousand of US troops. The main reason we went to war, or at least the one that most folks agreed upon, was simply not true. We screwed up big time. How did we screw up such an intelligence blunder? I don't know. OGE is correct that many people believed Saddam had WMD, George Bush was not the only one, but they were all reading the same intelligence reports. The fact that many people got it wrong doesn't change the fact the they weren't there. Those that still believe there are WMD in Iraq apparently don't believe those that work for the President anymore than the members of Congress or the Democratic Party or the rest of us that have lost faith in yet another Presidency. SA

"Whos to say what might be buried in the desert?" The President's own inspection team. I mean if you can't trust folks appointed by the President of the United States to do a job right, who can you trust. SA

"However, in regards to this thread, his big mistake was not keeping the Congress informed on a transaction that his handlers had to know was going to be a hot potato once it went public." PS, Have to disagree with this. At this point I think Rove, et al, have woefully underestimated the degree to which this administration has lost credibility with the American people, and not just with those that have historically opposed him, but with moderate and conservative Republicans as well. About the only folks I see left that fully support the President is the religious wing of the Republican party. Outside of a handful of candidates in the Bible Belt, I don't expect many Republicans up for re-election to be asking of alot of support from the Bush administration. Look at the reaction to this administration by the Republican Governors this week. SA