Scouting Mom

Doesn't sound like you were an "assistant" to anyone. Where was the Cub Master all this time? Doesn't a new pack need a Cubmaster, a committee member and a den leader to start? Maybe this varies by council, but an Assistant Cub Master is always way down the list of require positions. You cannot be officially registered in two positions unless one of them is Charter Organization Rep. Now, acting in two or three different roles, especially in a new (or even an old) pack is not unheard of. In fact it happens quite often. Frankly, IMO starting a pack in June is about the stupidest thing that can be done... I know of a pack that started this past May and is already falling apart, so I know what I'm saying. BUT one or two dedicated parents/leaders can pull it off. School is starting up now. Go to every "back to school" function you can and set up a recruiting table (assuming the school will give permission) Send home flyers from school (again with permission) Try to get a table set up at sports sign ups. Put signs up in the library, signs on the street corners. NOW is the time to be recruiting strongly. Now is the time that parents and children are making their schedules for school and extracurricular activities. Now is the time to let everyone know that Scouts is out there as an option for the boys AND their parents to get involved in. Get them in, get applications on those adults who aren't already signed up, so that any background checks required by your Council or Chartered Organization can be done. Get them involved and get roles/responsibilities established. Titles can be changed on paper later if need be.

Centered above the left pocket. But there is no "project" involved in getting one.

Wow, I will forever count my blessings. Our school schedule is published two years in advance. Private schools arrange their schedule to correspond to the public schools. The county prohibits fall sports practices to begin before a certain date in August. A coach even got fired for trying to force players to start earlier. We are one of the earliest districts back to school in our state at a week and a half before Labor Day. Our mandatory standardized testing is in March too. I bet it has something to do with reporting it to the federal government. BUT Spring Break statewide must include Good Friday and Easter Monday, so testing must work around that. And our School Superintendent has declared public support for scouting and it's principles. But we have no houses left, so you all can't move here, sorry.

Sounds like our pack in the years shortly before we joined... Dictatorial CC, indifferent DLs and a CM who really wanted to do it right, but was not comfortable standing up to anyone. Our CO, for all intents and purposes, exists in name only and has nothing whatsoever to do with the pack, so we had no recourse there. CC had the attitude that it was going to be done his way, even if he had to do it himself. So, everyone let him do it all. He was burning out, by his own admission, but wouldn't step down without handpicking his successor. Along comes a new Tiger DL. This was the year my son was a Tiger. This guy walked in wanting to be DL and all the other Tiger parents were relieved that they didn't have to do it. He was a former scout and knew the basics already. He asked about round tables, since he knew of such things. The CC discouraged him, the CM drove him to the meeting. He asked about leader training. Again, the CC discouraged him, but since he was now attending round table, that information was readily available to him. CM and Tiger DL carpooled to Pow Wow and University of Scouting. The CC said he was looking for a replacement. Tiger DL stepped up. CC said no and asked someone else, who refused. CM started talking about stepping down and again the Tiger DL raised his hand. Again CC said no. CC continued to run the show. CM stayed put for the good of the boys. Tigers became Wolves. The now Wolf DL was encouraging all his parents, as well as anyone he talked to, to go to training. He told them, even if they weren't leaders, if they knew the way it was supposed to be, they could keep him (and by extension the other leaders) in check and overall make it a better experience for their boys. The CM liked the idea of training non-leader parents and jumped on the bandwagon. A couple of people took them up on it. The CC stopped talking to them except when absolutely necessary. Now, when the CC is planning stuff and expecting the CM to carry it out, but isn't really talking to the CM. Well you can imagine that's bound to come to no good. The CM had finally had it and resigned in a mass email to all the parents. Several parents panicked. Regardless of how complacent they were, they knew the CM was the glue for the pack. Since the CO wasn't a factor in pack operations, and the parents barely knew the CO existed, they started calling/emailing the DE. The DE got the scoop directly from the CM and CC. He asked the CC's chosen successor to step up, so that the existing CC would step down and the CM would stay. Now, the new CC didn't want to do it, but she did it for the good of the pack. The CM stayed and got to try all the new things he'd wanted to do all along. Training for all is still strongly encouraged. The old CC moved his kids to another pack, and his boys dropped out at the end of that scout year. The "new" CC stepped down at the end of the scout year and the Wolf (then Bear) DL took the position after all. My son is now a first year Webelos. It's not perfect, but parents have a lot of say about what is done. Training is strongly encouraged as is joining the pack committee in any possible capacity. We have a new CM, but the old one continues on as a DL and as mentor to the new CM. I won't fault you if you'd rather just move to a different pack. But the moral of my story is, if you want to fix the pack you are in, gather your allies and set out for round tables, trainings, and general networking with other packs. Encourage others to join you in these things. If they can see and hear how others are having success with "new" things, if they can see and hear what works and how much fun the boys are having elsewhere, they will be more willing to try new things for your pack.(This message has been edited by Scouting Mom)

I've been on our committee for a year and a half now. Committee meetings are held in someone's kitchen and no one is in uniform. I don't have an official role at pack or den meetings. Most of my job as advancement chair is done by email. I got a uniform as a Christmas present for two reasons...I was scheduled to attend Univ. of Scouting in February (uniform required) and in June, I was slated to become Tiger DL. It came with interchangeable position patches on velcro. The only time I wore the uniform as a "committee member" was at a couple of trainings, the district banquet and when I went to a recruiting event for incoming Tigers, before actually becoming a DL. DLs, ADLs, CM, ACM and CC all wear uniforms at pack meetings. I think the rest would be confusing. Most of committee are paper pushers... the outings chair who makes reservations and keeps track of medical forms. The treasurer who collects receipts and writes checks (usually from the comfort of home w/o actually attending meetings), the advancement chair who makes sure the patches have been bought and the advancement reports turned in...etc. These people don't need to be visible to the boys or the parents. The only time they need to be visible is if for some reason they are representing the pack at outside functions.

I worked in a business setting where they hired a new salesman who was in his early 20's. It was a new type of position for him. He'd only done retail sales before. Now, I'm a very "mom" type of person. At that time, I was only about 7-8 years older than this man, but still I gave off a "mom" aura. I looked at him one day and said in a very even tempered way, "I know it's just a habit, but do you even realize that every other word you say is f***?" He and the others present were so shocked to hear the word coming from me that they all stopped and thought about it. He was much more conscience of it after that and the language eventually stopped. I don't suggest doing that to the boys, but the parents are a different story.

We invited the Girl Scouts to our Pinewood Derby. We ran it for the boys as usual, then for the girls, breaking them down by grade instead of "rank" so that it would be similar. Then ran the girl winners against the boys. The girls won.

Our council does this on a council-wide level. Last year's item was a matchbox car with the "Race to Scouting" logo and tickets to a local race track which hosts "Race to Scouting Night."

Like any group of people there are good and bad people. If someone earned Eagle and is now a leader what does that mean? Pros: They know that scouting is a positive influence on young people. They know that the boys can get a lot out of the program and have fun doing it. They may know that sticking with it and earning Eagle can give a sense of accomplishment and could possibly help you in the future by giving you skills that will help you get a good job. Hopefully they can be a role model of Scouting values. Cons: Scouting has changed a lot over the years. I assume from some of the things you mention about these Eagle leaders you are talking about people who are of an age where they have kids of their own in Scouts, but even if you are talking about an 18-yo, who just got out of a troop... Cub Scouts has changed a lot in the last 8-10 years. Like anyone, if they aren't open to change they won't be a good leader. Anyone who takes an attitude of, "I know it all and you can't tell me how to do things" is a bad leader regardless of their credentials. Also, earning Eagle is about leadership skill among your peers. It has nothing to do with relating to children.

gwd, I think your letter followed by a call is a good idea. A bulk mailing from the council is a bad idea because if their reasons for not joining were because they didn't like their Webelos experience or they visited one troop and didn't like it, a letter from the council will be ignored. The Webelos from our pack this past year almost didn't crossover. The DL was a last minute substitution when the old DL stepped down and he wasn't real gung-ho. He just muddled through because someone had to. The troop that we traditionally crossover to is struggling and made a poor impression on the boys and their parents during their visit with them. It never occurred to most of the boys that there was another option. The CC is a big-time supporter of scouts and strongly encouraged the boys to visit another troop, if they didn't like the first one. He told them several times how much different Boy Scouts was from Cubs. A week before our B&G, when we traditionally do crossover, when we had OA dancers scheduled months in advance to perform a crossover ceremony, when the agreed upon term of the temporary W2 DL would expire, we didn't know if there were any boys crossing over. In that week, the boys went to visit the other troop and everyone of them crossed over. I understand from the parents who are still around with younger boys that the boys are happy with the troop they choose. It was a near thing because they didn't know they had a choice. I imagine many boys still don't know they have choices. If you write a letter outlining their choices, I imagine many of them will be happy to check it out.

There's no such thing as recruiting being "too good" and you can't turn away boys who are likely choosing to transfer over dropping out altogether. You can't be blamed for doing such a good job that all others pale in comparison. Your CM can't be expected to do double duty. It's unreasonable to think that is an acceptable long-term solution. Let me take a moment to speak from the other side of it. At one time, about the time that our oldest son first joined, the pack was falling apart and many boys left for another pack. Our pack was recruiting half-heartedly from 4 schools and dropped to about 20 boys. The pack down the road was recruiting from 2 schools and was growing. It was our pack's own fault, no one disputes that. No one was going to help us dig out of a mess of our own making. A group of new parents (my husband and I included) took over and pulled the pack back together. We are now starting to find out what happened to the boys who would've been part of our pack. Some went to another pack and others never joined at all. Some of the "never joined" are joining now... They tell us that they looked into it a few years back, but didn't like what they saw, but they are back now. It makes me sad that they didn't get that experience they were looking for back then. Now, we don't have 4 schools to recruit from. We have two. The other two now have their own packs. Our leaders have gotten to know their leaders. Our CC is the UC for one pack and the other pack just borrowed a bunch of our camping gear for their first camping trip. One of the new CMs has told people that if they don't like the way things are going, before they leave scouting altogether, check out the pack on the other side of town. Another of the new packs has purposely scheduled their meetings for a different day than ours so they can serve scouts who have scheduling issues with our meetings. I don't personally go to roundtable because of babysitting issues, but my husband and several of the other leaders go. I know that the people there get to know one another and the exchange of ideas helps foster a good working relationship among different units. I know that when the nearby Troop received no Webelos crossovers two years in a row, everyone in the district started to rally to see what can be fixed in that unit, rather than blaming another troop for "stealing" all the boys. I can't say there aren't lots of issues with getting three packs going strong where there was only one before, but no one is pointing fingers. The recruiting drive of one of the new packs actually got 2 boys for our pack because they went to a meeting thinking that they would find their sons' friend, who raved about Cub Scouts, only to discover that the friend was not part of the new pack, but in our old pack. Families now have options. No one says, "you have to be part of our pack because we recruit or meet at your school." Instead they say, "oh, you can't make it one Wednesdays because of baseball practice? The pack down the road meets on Tuesdays" and "you don't like that that pack is affiliated with a church? The one over there is sponsored by the PTA." "Oh, you think that pack leadership is made up of dictatorial jerks?" Now when we tell them where to go it has a completely different meaning. LOL Where 25 or 30 boys were members, there are now 50 and September recruiting drives will easily draw another 20 or 30 among all three packs. Some boys will come to us from the other schools because their older brothers or older friends are already with us, and we will lose a few who would have been destined for our pack, but are now going to join the one that meets at their school, but it also allows us to concentrate more on our remaining two schools. We already have as many Tigers for next year as my oldest son had his entire Tiger year. Any pack that is losing members to another needs to look to themselves for the problem, not to the other pack. And if your DE is worrying about his job because his numbers are dropping, well maybe he should be, but you should be commended on keeping the overall number of scouts up. And instead of pulling your CM to be CM elsewhere, he should be asking your CM and other leaders to help mentor those in struggling packs. It is much more likely that parents will step up to a leadership position if they know that there is a support system of knowledgeable, successful scouters they can rely on for advice.

Is our UC competent? Probably. Is he overworked? Definitely. I don't know him well. I haven't seen him at a pack meeting/function in about a year. I don't know how many units he is responsible for, but there is at least one other that is having issues that not only is he dealing with, but the DE has been called in to help keep the unit going. As a result, I'm not well versed in the Commissioner program and how it works. I do know that when a new pack was formed last October, they were left on their own to figure it out and they are only surviving through the dedication of the CM, who was a scout in his youth and is committed to making the experience good for his son. I suspect this pack shares our UC, but I'm not sure. On the flip side, when a new pack was formed a couple of weeks ago, our CC offered to mentor them. He has been officially made the UC of that pack and is trying to get them on their feet. That new pack wouldn't exist unless the parents knew that there was someone to support them in that capacity because none of them have much scout experience.

The Charter Organization can require membership as a condition of participation in the scouting unit that they own. Look at LDS. But I also know another church in our district which does it, a Methodist parish I think it is. They have a Cub unit and a Boy Scout unit. I think one has 60 boys and the other has about 80. If your CO is floundering for lack of membership, it would be in your unit's best interest to see if you can do something about it.

ASM, Yes, the VFW as well as the AFL-CIO scholarships are for members of those organizations. There is no stated restrictions on the applications besides membership, but given the limited number of awards, it would make sense for them to pick those people who will do their organizations the most good, (ie. for a VFW chartered unit) Also, the Catholic Church nationwide now requires leaders of their scout units to go through the Church's YP training and criminal background checks. And as Beavah said, the "big guy" (the archdiocese's office on scouting) understand the big picture, even if the local pastor doesn't. I was also recently told that the local parish isn't the actual CO. All the charters of all the Catholic units are owned by the Archdiocese, so the parish priest wouldn't have had anything to say about your money. That would come from above him.

If the troop committee really wants this person to go to Wood Badge and it's not going to happen without the troop's help, then it's something they have to consider funding. It may be possible to set up a "scholarship" program within the troop. Set up guidelines for what factors are considered in establishing eligibility. For example, require that a certain number of ticket items directly benefit the unit. Since one of the steps in writing a ticket is to get the cooperation/approval of those whose cooperation is needed, the committee will need to be consulted for anything affecting the troop anyway. You could put a term of service on the scholarship... a person must act in a leadership role for a certain amount of time and if they fail to do so, they have to pay the money (or a portion of it) back. Exceptions could be made for things like job transfers etc. Basically, you could draw up a contract saying whatever you want, but you really need to establish some written guidelines or else someone could ask you to pay their way later and if you need to say "no" you should have some ground rules to pave the way.

Our Council's Boy Scout Camp has a program for Webelos. W1's and W2's can both go for a week long program with activities geared toward earning activity badges. Maybe that's the kind of thing being offered and someone got their terminology mixed up.

Our CO is so uninvolved that every 2 years we have to inform their newly elected president that we exist. We get no money from them at all, ever. We get banquet space for free in their building and we have a storage shed on their property. That is the extent of their support. Changing COs depends on the CO. They can make it as easy or hard as they want. AND any new CO you find isn't going to be thrilled to learn you want money from them from the start. You need to build that relationship first. It would probably be easier to build a relationship with the existing CO. Playing devil's advocate... If I were your COR, I'd want to know why do you want to send three leaders to wood badge? why not one at a time? What will the benefit of this be to the pack and to our organization? And by benefit, I want specifics. The idea of being better leaders is all well and good, but what kind of a ticket do they have in mind that is going to be a benefit to the pack and CO directly? As far as questioning the leaders' commitment... if the leaders are parents, who in 2-3 years, are going to follow their sons to a Boy Scout unit not affiliated with the CO, than the CO has a point that these leaders are not committed to the unit specifically, but rather to their son's scouting career and/or scouting in general, which isn't necessarily a long term benefit to the CO or to the pack. Have you looked into wood badge scholarships? The AFL-CIO and VFW each offer 3 scholarships annually per region.

I just went for my Tiger Leader Specific training. There were two of us there, so they lumped us in with the Cub Scout LST. I spent more time sharing my experiences with my older son's Wolf & Bear dens, to assist those Tiger DLs turning into Wolf DLs, than learning about being a Tiger Leader. They didn't return the favor, mostly because they seemed more lost and confused than I was. What I would have liked to discuss was shared leadership and how to make it happen. Go-see-its and the resources particular to my area for doing that. For example, we're a rural area, so a trip to a farm or historic site is easy, but a trip to a TV, Radio or Newspaper is almost impossible. City folks I imagine have the opposite problem. The trainers weren't operating off of much of a script/syllabus. They had the video & powerpoint you mentioned with the outdated Tiger uniform. The rest operated on answering questions from the group. The overall group consisted of about 20 people that broke down into smaller groups for Den leaders, Webelos DL, CMs, and Committee Chairs. So, most everyone had some experiences with their pack and could ask relevant questions. But the other Tiger DL there was kind of lost and I expect will have problems with the things I mentioned. One thing I thought was good that the trainer included was websites where there is planning information, program ideas, etc.

There is computer software out there just for PWD racing. I've been told you can do a search for it online, but I've never tried, because our pack already has a copy that they use. You can enter the number of racers and the number of lanes and the computer will tell you which lanes to race which cars. Each car will get the opportunity to race in each lane in order to rule out one lane being "faster" than another. The computer then will correct for any lane preferance issues and declare a winner.

I've always been curious why an atheist would choose to join an organization or to have their child join an organization that requires them to say an oath to do duty to God. How do you explain to the child the discrepency in swearing duty to something that they believe doesn't exist?

Congratulations on your new position and thank you, you are appreciated for stepping up, even if it takes a while for your pack to value your contribution. As for how a meeting should be run... You are the Chair, you set the agenda (with input from the committee, hopefully). Send out the agenda in advance, so that everyone knows what to be prepared for (ie. the treasurer actually needs to know that they are expected to report on something). And don't get discouraged. Remember, no one wanted the job, probably because no one set a good example of how it should be done. Set that example and get trained. You don't need to figure out how to do everything from scratch. That's what training is for, someone already figured it out and they want to share their knowledge with you.

Our district sometimes holds "upgrade" leader specific trainings. These are abbreviated trainings for leaders who have already attended one LST, but are changing positions. They just eliminate the overlap and focus on the differences.

Anyone ever heard the term "loyals" when referring to cub scouts? I saw a message floating around our district communication board(original source was a den leader) referring to "Webelos and Loyals" working on their activity badges. So, from this, I gather that the term "loyals" is being used to differentiate between Webelos I and II, but I'm not sure which is supposed to be which. Not that it matters, since they were working on the same badges. I know that officially a Webelos scout is a Webelos scout and that common usage refers to I & II, to distinguish between 4th graders and 5th graders. But I saw this and wondered if maybe this leader was coming from some other region of the country where they use a different term, I thought it was kind of strange that I'd never heard it before online or anywhere else.

Our pack meets in a school. The schools have banned them even after hours because of safety and because they mark up the floors. The church social hall where the local troop meets has also banned them.

I believe what makes the difference between something being labeled properly for individual sale is the nutrition information. By law, people have a right to that information. I think a copy machine could solve that problem.