Scoutfish

We do not dole out physical punishment as a rule, but there could be exceptions that I think most would agree with: If scouts do not do a good job of policing the campsite, we make them walk the campsite again. Yeah, it's physical, but not close to pushups which as listed above was stricty a physical punishment. I'm not keen on the idea of causing physical exhaustion or pain as a punishment Sure the swim test is pretty demanding, but the scout has the option to not take iot and it wasn't used as discipline. At summercamp last week, one of the moms left a coller full of gatoraids and fruit drinks. This was a great big deal for the scouts since we only provide a 5 gallon water cooler of ice water. So after one full day of these drinks, the SM, AC, and myself started noticing empty or half empty bottles all over camp. Some where on the ground near tents, some were left on tables under the dining shelter, some were around the bath house.........wherever the scout was at when they finished the drink. SM warned them that if bottle were not picked up, they would have the coller taken away. He even let it slide one time when he shouldn't have after warning them. Next day, SM had SPL take coler and lock it in scout trailer. No pushups, no running laps, jogging or sit ups. Just lose of priveledge directly related to incident. When our campsit inspection was 99% due to a bottle on the ground, SM just made all scouts form a line and walk through camp again. And to be clear, that wsn't for inspection score since that was the highest score all week. That was because it ws one of the same bottles the scouts had been warned about - bought at trading post, taken back to campsite and tosed on ground when empty. Actually, I do not personally believe it was tossed. I think scout set it down when emptied while doing something and then : "out of sight, out of mnind" .. they just forgot about it. Still, no push ups, no running/jogging, no sit ups, etc..... I think excersise is grat and all scouts should do it - just never as a punishment! PERIOD!

Okay, if you didn't know already, I bought a GI style jungle hammock. Bottom is thick canvas like they use on military tents. Sides are very, very fine mesh for air flow. Top is typical nylon tent material. Good to keep a few drops of rain off, but will let you get wet in a downpour. Besides that, the rain lip is about 3 inches wide, so rain would get you through the mesh sides anyways. Okay, so I used it for a week of summer camp and here's how it went: Sunday night: Slept kinda okay, but nothing great! Would have enjoyed more sleep, but wasn't a zombie when I woke up. Using a small throw pillow from the couch wasn't a great idea. Little bit thicker than what I am used to. Temps did drop in loow 60's - so that was really nice! Also discover that due to an illusion in the landscape, my feet are actually about 8 inches higher than my head. Monday Night Adjusted heights of tree straps so that hammock is level. Tried sleeping without pillow, was worse than having pillow. Slept better than Sun night, but still not spectacular. Tuesday night : After 2 1/2 days of camp, I am really looking forward to a good nights sleep. Somebody flipped the humidity switch on, so it's ...well....humid! Woke up around 3:30am due to raccons shaking our water cooler. Guess they were thirsty too. Sucks that they woke me up, but the good news is that I realize I was sleeping. Wake up a little closer to the ground than when I went to bed. WEdnesday night : Parents night. Get to bed a little bit later than usual. Somebody turned the humidity up a notch or five. Did I mention I was using my Coleman 40 degre bag as a cuchion? Wake up at 3:30 again to sound of racoons enjoying chicken and other food from campsite trashcan. Again, they shook water cooler. Maybe the sound of ice against the insides of the coler are some sort of racoon discoteque dancebeat? Party on coons, party on. Woke up even closer to the ground. Thurday night : Tightened up the slack between hammock and tree straps. Adjusted the head a bit higher and removed the rope spreaders I made for the bottom side of hammock ( many, many people suggested this on the hammock forums website ). Now the bottom has more of a cradle shape. Slept better, but humidity was even higher. Thought a spider was crawling on my face and when I went to brush it off ( in a very unmanly panic) - discovered it was just sweat rolling off my head. Friday night: Hammock has finally loosened up and stretched as much as it is going to - for now. Except that the humidity was so high, I slept pretty good. Couch pillow is almost molded to my head thanks to all the sweat that it absorbed. Made note to throw away pillow....not sure washing machine will conquer that smell. Saturday morning Took me about 5 minutes to break down everything I had from taking down hammock, taking down rainfly, removing my ground tarp, rolling up hammock, sleeping bag, and removing my backpack of clothes. I did get to sit and relax while everybody else still broke down their tents, rainflys , and ground cloths. So..... It was my first time ever using a hammock aside from a 30 minute nap here orv there on a backyard rope hammock. I figure it is something that you have to adjust to. I also figure the average person doesn't sleep in one for a whole week the very first time they use one. I am guessing the hammock is doing what it is supposed to, and it's me that has to "break in" to a hammock. So, I definantly enjoyed it with all things considered. I am going to buy myself a new pillow for my bead and use the one I have now for camping. It's a posturepedic latex foam pillow, so I can wash it and that fact also probably had alot to do with my level of sleeping. Did I mention I bought this hammock at a military surplus store? BRand new in an unopened package for $35.00 Spent &5.00 on two 1,000lb rated 12'X 1 1/2 " lift straps that I used for tree straps, and $28.00 on 100 foot of 300lb rated 5/8" rope. Total cost of $68.00 I just reused my ground cloth as a floor and my rainfly tarp that I used over my tents rainfly as an oversized canopy. This covered my hammock, but also gave me a shady area where I sat in my camp chair, used another camp chair as a dresser ( holding my clothes pack) and an under sheltor clothesline for my shirts and shower towel. Here's a picture ....If I did the link right: http://www.facebook.com/home.php#!/photo.php?fbid=480140708680884&set=o.172739770499&type=1&theater

So, as the title says, my pack was just delivered to my door . WEll, about 45 minutes ago actually! Been acting like a 5 year old. Tryin g it on, adjusting it, trying it agin...knowing I will still need to be adjusted once I pack it. It's a medium blue and gray Jansport Carson external frame, weighs 4 lbs, 13oz Capacity of 4,900 cu in. Bought it from Campmor. Ordered it Saturday afternoon, got it WEds afternoon. Not bad at all! Cant wait to get it sweaty and dusty!

There is also the generousity side of it too: Each generation of parents wants to provide a better life and future for their children: How many of you had your own bathroom growing up? How many had your own color tv witha video game conected to it? How many of you had your own pair of $50.00 sunglasses at age 10? How many of you had your own $100 rod/reel combo at age 12? Nah son, You don't need to do chores because we hire a housecleaning service, lawncare technition, we have a pool maintainance man, we hire out any odd things that need to be done around the house, etc....... JUst relax and don't stress out. Jump in our big backyard pool and swim or ride in your own personal golf cart to the club house pool/grill and hang out with your friends. Just make sure you wear your $300.00 watch and $150.00 shoes so you don't look out of place!

Is it worth it? WEll, if you ask them tommorrow, maybe, maybe not. But in 3 years til the rest of their lives - absolutely! This is something they will always remember. Plus it is when the Webelos were really boy scouts - even if only in their own minds. They did something they never did as lower ranking cub scouts, but really wanted to. WE just got back from summer camp where we had to ditch our campsite one night due to severe storms popping up. Tightened everything down and went to the dining hall. 30 minutes later, storm slides by us and we go back to buisness - only 30 minutes later. SCouts were kinda complaining and fussing about having to walk that hike...twice for nothing! 3 days later at troop meeting back at CO, they are laughing and talking about it like it ws the highlight of the camping trip. Boys are weird like that!

You could still do a Beaver award. It could be the "Bob Beaver Award" or "Jim Beaver Award" Just don't call it the Scouting Beaver Award or anything that could be implied that it's an offical award from BSA. Our SM will hand out spoecial awards from time to time to scouts and scouters. Usually it is stuff he made himself like a decorated necklace of leather, wood, beads and maybe a feather or something. Every award is unique and individual. Usually, he gives them out during "circle up" after an event.

"No medical? No camp, no refund." ABSOLUTELY! Been told and told and told. WE do tell them as long as they hand us the med form be fore we leave the CO and when we arrive at camp, we can give it to the health director, then it is fine. But if they say they have it and when it comes time to leave the CO - and they don't have it - then No medical? No camp, no refund! But we do tell them they can call the scout office and have the money transfered to a different session of summer camp, a camporee, council program and maybe / possibly for use at the scout shop. But once the money is turned in to council, there are no refunds. Who'se fault is it? Not ours! WE been telling them every meeting since January, and sent who knows how many e-mails out to them.

If the scouts themselves elect to use this policy, then so be it. And it should be reviewed and revoted on every two years to be sure that the new scouts also like this policy. But the committee should not be making this rule.

"The solution is to properly select and monitor the counselors that will do a proper job." So, how do you monitor the counselors? How do you know if they arw doing what tey are supposed to be doing? You can't sit in on every MB session or class. Maybe testing isn't the correct terminology. maybe we call it polling the scout to see that the counselor did his part correctly. And I say did his part because we don't want to punish a counselor when the issue is on the part of a scout.

>>"The AC can compare the listed requirements on the BC that the counselor signed off and compare them to the book. During the BOR, the AC can ask questions that are not testing that can still let the AC know if the scout actually went over this stuff during the MB process."

Well, I found out from talking to our AC guy - who was also at camp with us all week long - that he has his own full MB library . Pretty much, he does his checking up on MB's that come from camps or MB fairs. His position isn't so much one of " Lets see if we can catch a scout who doesn't know his stuff". but rather "Lets make sure the scouts are getting what they are asking for". Sometimes he will ask a question like: What was your favorite MB? Which part of that MB was the best part or hardest? How long did it take? Turns out last year a scout signed up for Citizenship ( in community) MB and somehow earned it completely in one day at camp. IMAGINE THAT! Didn't meet/complete requirements 3a, 3b, or 8 AC found out because the scout said it was his favorite badge at camp because it only took one day.

Overall, the MB counselors and camp staff were great! They did their jobs well. A couple had a rough start on the first day, but we can also chalk that up to being the first sesion of summer camp and that the MB counselors may be doing their first stint as an instructor/ counselor. But really, overall, the staff were full of enthusiasm and every scout in our troop really liked all the staff and counselors they worked with. On Parents night, the scouts invited around 15 counselors and staff to eat at our campsite. Really, it was just this one MB counselor and I am really surprised at how blunt he was on the fist day. Makes you wonder if he took this job because he was coerced or put in a situation where he had to.

We immediately went to the CXamp Director and Program director about this MB counselor. The AC can compare the listed requirements on the BC that the counselor signed off and compare them to the book. During the BOR, the AC can ask questions that are not testing that can still let the AC know if the scout actually went over this stuff during the MB process. And yeah, I know testing isn't allowed. But that' my whole point, maybe it shgould be. Our scout was indeed trustworthy, honest and full of integrety. But like I mentioned, 3 or 4 other scouts weren't. They were ready to make that deal with the MB counselor. So yeah, a scout i supposed to be trustworthy and honest, but apparently, not all scouts are. The instructor provd it, and a handfull of MB participants proved it. Kinda a slap in the face to those who are honest and actually do the work to earn a MB. SIDE NOTE I am very proud to say we only had the one scout in that class. All the other scouts were from another unit/units. And it makes me feel good that out of 25 scouts - only 3 or 4 were willing to make such a deal.

Just got back from an awesome week of sumer camp. Had a blast watching the NSP develope a closer bond and learn to work together as a patrol. So anyways, after the first full day of camp, one of the second year scouts comes up to me to ask if he could switch one of his merit badge classes. I ask why and he says because they didn't do anything. The scout shoed up for robotics MB class about 5 minutes early. Then all the participating scouts sit around until the MB counselor shows up - 20 minutes late! At this point, the counselor goes into the storage room and fumbles around for another 10 minutes. Then he comes out and announces to the class: " Okay, let's make a deal I can sign off your blue card and you can leave, or you can just hang out while I go play ultimate frisbee." And this was the first day of a week long MB class! Sadly, 3 or 4 scouts were ready to get their blue cards signed right then and there. So, I have read many times that once a blue card is signed off by a MB counselor, then it is signed off and that's the end of it. So maybe you can't test the scout to see if he really knows it, but I do believe the AC should be able to do a review with the scout to make sure all rtequirements were covered and that the scout actuallu understands what he learned ( or "supposedly" learned ) . NOw, I can say I am pround of this scout. He has always shown great scout spirit and proven himself to be full of integrety.(This message has been edited by scoutfish)

n our pack, we lost a handfull of kids due to the economy.Lots of jobs dissappeard overnight. Unemployment is as high as I have ever seen it right now. My company went from 30 full time employees to having about 17. 2 are part time at that. I myself have seen my pay drop by 30% - which is better than watching it drop by 100% 7 years ago, the ads section of the paper was 8 pages long, 4 pages of which were help wanted ads. Those same help wanted ads are now limited to 2 pages. Almost 75 % of the ads require degress or higher requirements. Great if you happen to have that degree, but worthless if you do not. In our pack, we lost ane scout because mom needs a kidney and dad lost his job due to "restructuring". Two more dad's jobs were eliminated due to loss of customer demand. Sure, all they have to do is get another job right? Thing is, how many construction workers have a degree in a specific field as a safety net. So let's see....Dad looses job due to economy, mom's hours are cut back. They are barely scraping by without figuring not only uniforms, but gas to and from meetings, and any and all other expenses associated with scouting. And it's peoples choice? At the same time, you require them to wear a uniform, but it doesn't matter if a Tiger cub wear a CM award knot or Eagle patch as long as he's having fun? Adults can wear OA Lodge patches or "trained" strips even if they do not have the right" WOW!

Well, I will always bring extra footwear. My boots definantly need to be air out by the end of the day during a normal day, and if I have been hiking, they really, really , need to air out. As far as just two pair of clothes, well, I'l have to make an old fashioned washing machine: 5 gallon bucket with 2" hole in lid, and a toilet ( that isnew, clean) plunger. I don't think having 4 or 5 shirts is necessarily a bad idea, but I also have 5 extra pair of shorts. If I was hiking with this...man oh man ... it would be a long backbreaking hike. Granted, this is basically a week of "plop" camping at summer camp, but I still brought alot of stuff to camp. I need to learn to pack lighter.

Yesterday afternoon, we met up at our scout building to load up our trailer for summer camp . I'll call it a learning experience! Up til now, all the packing I did for camping was always for a 3 day/ 2night duration. Set out with what you were wearing and 2 changes of clothes. So going to summer camp, I geared up for setting out in my class A and bringing a change of clothes for each day of summer camp after arrival. two extra pairs of footwear ( sneakers and a pair of shower shoes ) to go along with my hiking boots. Brought one towel for showers and one for swimming. Shaving kit and toiletries. First aid kit and "old people" kit ( TUMS, Tylenol, muscle rub,etc...). Bought a brand new mini mag flashlight and taking one lantern style battery operated campsite light. T Got my hammcok, ground tarp, extra rainfly tarp and an extra bag of rope, tree straps, etc..... Guess who had the 5,000 backpack? So please advise me here if what I plan to do NEXT TIME will be better: Wear class A going in, take 2 changes of clothes only to rotate out during the week. Take enough socks and underwear to have a clean pair each day. Take one or two towels? Again, I have no doubts I overpacked. Not even gonna argue that. Guess I'll chalk that up to " getting experience" and keep that in the mental file!

"Scoutfish the answer is quite simple, a boy scout should already be fully trained on the proper use of a knife and axe by the time he receives his Tenderfoot rank, there is no need for a card as his rank should be the symbol." I agree! being a Boy Scout of the Tenderfot rank should be qualification enough...but that's not how iot really works. Scout has to have the Tot'n Chip.

Baden, I didn't propose anything...so I'm not sure where anything would be a step backwards. But here is the reality: My son earned his whittlin chip a good while back. He uses his knife around the house constantly. He carves, he whittles, he sharopens his pencils with it. He actually has 4 different trypes of piocket knives that he handles very well BUT.... According to Rules, he cannot use that knife until he gets his Tot'n Chip - wich also includes using a saw ( which he knows how to do) and a hatchet ( never had one, but knows how to use full size axe well). SO, what we have here is pretty much akin to saying: You earned a drivers license to drive a car, and you are pretty experienced with it ....but until you get your tractor trailer license AND pilots license also...you aren't allowed to drive your car anymore. See what I am saying? Why is is it that - until her can earn the use of all three items, he cannot use the one item that he already showed prficeincy in? And I am not proposing anything in boy scouts, but simply wondering why he couldn't show that he did earn the whittlin chip as a scout as to show he is not starting from scratch as a totally inexperienced knife user. So why not say that Cub Scout Leader who is trained in CPR or SSA or SA, etc...is suddenly not trained anymore as soon as he becomes a Boy Scout leader? (This message has been edited by scoutfish)

Just saying, It could be the scouts fault completely. He could be like some of the scouts we have had: will argue with a wall and not give up. You say go left, he will go right . Tell them they have 5 minutes to get ready, and he will wait 10 before even starting and then explain why it's everybody else's fault. Could be the case here.. COULD BE his fault too. Miybe one scout decided he was good enough to dive elsewhere and second scout was trying to bring him back. Maybe second scout only followd first scout because of the buddy system and that first scout is just hardheaded and would not follow direction. In any way, it's a shame that this happened. I truely feel for the parents, but I have a hard time believing that the dive instructors were that nagligent in all those areas.

WEll, not in an official capacity, but back in the day, if a child acuused anybody of molestation, abuse, sexual assault, etc...the family would tell the child to keep it to themselves lest they bring shame on the family name. And heavin forbid you say something about the guy/gal if they were a public figure! I mean, you do not want to embarass your parents in public while the neighbor piddles with your diddle! Come early 80's I think along with the "it's about me and how much money I have" attitude, it was probably worse as the child was somehow guilty and had the full burdon of proving the case, while testifying in front of teh abuser. Come the 90's people started realizing this stuff was happening, wasn't the fault of teh child and that something had to be done. Unfortunatly during the late 90's Every other psychologist/psychiatrist would let you know about you hidden past for $$$. Suddenly , everybody found out they had suppressed memories of abuse..even if the were orphaned on a deserted island and raised by tap dancing penguins. This socially hurt the credibility and seriousness of all the real cases out there. Come the turn of the cnetry: All you have to do is mention that somebodies third cousin's best friend' dagwalker's next door neighbor had a picture they found of a younger sister taking a bath...and then CNN, C-SPAN, FOX, Fox * "The Ocho" , and Nancy Grace would be broadcasting 24/7 about the outrage of the abuse that has happened and then poll listeners about how guilty the accused should be. Then even if you are proven not guilty, you are still guilty in the court of public opinion. It didn't help anywhere along the line that social services would take your child away for having grape jelly in their hair, but ignore a apartment full of starving kids who's mother was a crack head and who's father was not only not around, but who's identity was unknown. Today, we take it seriously. SOmetimes it might even be a bit too much at times and prosecutors will try so hard to convict somebody, they now routinely ignore evidence that can prove innocence. Just convict somebody/ anybody as long as it get written down and the DA gets credit for it! But we are making progress...even though it is slow coming about. Maybe in another 60 years, we will get it right.

Without using a scale, I'd guess around 4 or 5 pounds . Top cover is tent nylon/supplex type material, sides are a micro mesh and bottom is old school military canvas - kinda like the tents were in MASH.

It's like trhis: I want to comment, but I have absolutely no knowledge of what happened because I was not there. But this begs me to ask: Of all the allegation the parnts made, how do they know themselves? Where they also not there when it happened? "The lawsuit alleges that the defendants failed to ensure the boy was properly equipped, dressed and weighted. It states that they provided defective equipment and did not manage, monitor or supervise the boys air supply. When the emergency situation arose, the parties failed to aid and properly rescue Tuvell, the lawsuit alleges. "Defendant Corbett Douglas and other defendants failed to prepare and implement an adequate dive plan," the lawsuit states. The parents claim all the defendants were negligent, strictly liable and failed to warn of the dangers posed by being part of the diving program. " Do the parents really know this or do they just believe this in their hearts? I mean, I'm not throwing blame at anybody, but as a parent, I do know that boys do not always do what they are told to do, and that during instruction, tend to think they "got it" already and don't need adults to tell them how to do things. Again, Not throwing blam at either party, just asking a question. And this is why G2SS has alot of over regulation and stupid rules. Also why a cub scout can't pull a radio flyer wagon at a service project!

Yeah, The first one doesn't even seem like it was intended for the scout uniform, but rather an American Legion uniform that would also identify you as a boy scout. The second one probably was intended for wearing on the boy scout uniform, but somebody at the American Legion probably did not realize you just can put whatever you want on the scout uniform. As far as a non uniform jacket? Sure, why not? Maybe on a patch sach ( not MB sash) or any other non uniform scouting jacket/ shirt/hat/ etc..... Thing is, there is no reason for a CO patch as any other CO does not put it's own patch on the uniform. Just unit number and council patch, and patrol identity patch. Now, I suppose you could put in on the necker as each unit has the option to design it's own neckerchief. There's always putting it on the right pocket as a temp patch. But I agree with Basement...it would look bad. That is usually where you put a camp patch, event patch or some kind of training class/event kinda patch.

I don't know about that sewing thing...... I can sew on a patch and I can sew on a button. I can even fix minor places where seams come unraveled, but sewing an entire sleeve for a drawstring? WEll, not saying i can't sew it, but issues of durability come to mind!