RememberSchiff

Stick with the common sense basics but also let scouts know when LNT does NOT apply. In a survival situation. You want to leave a trace, break branches if you need to, set a smoky signal fire, and make yourself highly visible. Some scouts get a little confused about that. IMO, LNT loses credence when it talks about "visual impact". Is there any environmental impact? I always wear patches of safety orange and safety blue. Its color contrast and my movement, makes me more visible. I want to be seen and I want to see others. Safety is job #1 particularly when it seems hunting season is wherever, whenever. I wear light colors (never white) in warm, ticky weather and I am a black ninja in cold, snowy weather. My $0.02,

With any communications, you have to know your sources and check your sources. I remember listening to a news broadcast on my scout crystal radio about an invasion from Mars. They landed in my home state New Jersey!... I think this elaborate spoof video interview was done by The Onion or Mad TV. That said, you can trust me

Found alive, well as reported by NH Union Leader. Here is story. http://tinyurl.com/c8k973 Check out the Google topo map link in middle of story. No mention of any hiking companions. Dangerous time of year to hike Whites. (This message has been edited by RememberSchiff)

and HOPEFULLY it will be Printed in the U.S.A.

So a cool Camporee patch is not enough. Neither I nor my unit want any part of it as it diminishes the merit badge experience and shortchanges the scout. We do not endorse the two weekend merit badge colleges either. Turning scouting into a cram-session school is not for us. But it seems most in our district believe you cannot get a scout to attend an activity, even a overnight gym lock-in, unless the activity coordinator sells merit badges or do I mean activity "belt loops". Patrol competition - fogetaboutit. I largely blame today's Cub Scout program with creating this belief that to get a scout to do anything he must be given a badge and the subsequent expectation of automatically receiving a badge by youth and parents. Do a good turn and you get a patch irks me the most. 'What 12 meetings to earn First Aid merit badge, shouldn't they be getting 12 merit badges in that time?' Should we take the "merit" out of "merit badge" and call it, I dunno, an "hour badge" as in "Camping in an hour badge", "Citizenship in an hour badge"...'Do as many of the following requirements as you can in an hour, but do not spend more than hour. It is okay, if you do not complete any requirements in the hour. Just do your best.' My $0.02

Eamon, I don't know if he "paid for" what he did, that's not our dept. We volunteer to teach scout values. Sounds like the CM has started that. I agree with you that Scout 1 probably wishes the adults would forget about this Also remember, there are two scouts involved here. I would be interested in hearing how Scout 2 is doing. John, We are not going agree on this. Neither I nor my scouts get a green light to ignore scouting values "outside of scouting". Will they break the rules? Daily. Parents and others handle these incidents, but occasionally scout leaders are asked to help as was done here. So we help, that's what scouts do. Peaceful Easter

Hotdesk is on track. "In helping boys develop character, Cub Scouting promotes the following 12 core values." Know, Commit, and Practice. Added related Cub Scout requirements. http://www.scouting.org/Media/FactSheets/02-502.aspx http://www.scoutingmagazine.org/issues/0303/a-cubs.html 1. Citizenship: Contributing service and showing responsibility to local, state, and national communities. (Related requirements: Tiger Cub: 2 - Where I Live, Bear: 3j - What Makes America Special, Webelos: Citizen Activity Badge) 2. Compassion: Being kind and considerate, and showing concern for the well-being of others. (Related requirement: Bear: 24f - Be a Leader) 3. Cooperation: Being helpful and working together with others toward a common goal. (Related requirement: Wolf: 10a - Family Fun) 4. Courage: Being brave and doing what is right regardless of our fears, the difficulties, or the consequences. (Related requirements: Wolf: 12a - Making Choices, Bear: 11g - Be Ready, Webelos: Readyman Activity Badge) 5. Faith: Having inner strength and confidence based on our trust in God. (Related requirements: Tiger Cub: 5 - Let's Go Outdoors, Wolf: 11a - Duty to God, Bear: 1a - Ways We Worship, Webelos: 8 - Faith) 6. Health and Fitness: Being personally committed to keeping our minds and bodies clean and fit. (Related requirements: Tiger Cub: 3 - Keeping Myself Healthy and Safe, Webelos: Health and Fitness Activity Badge) 7. Honesty: Telling the truth and being worthy of trust. (Related requirements: Bear: 18h - Jot it Down, Arrow of Light: 7) 8. Perseverance: Sticking with something and not giving up, even if it is difficult. (Related requirement: Webelos: Athlete Activity Badge) 9. Positive Attitude: Being cheerful and setting our minds to look for and find the best in all situations. (Related requirements: Wolf: 6a, Start a Collection, Webelos: Scholar Activity Badge) 10. Resourcefulness: Using human and other resources to their fullest. . (Related requirement: Bear: 21g - Build a Model) 11. Respect: Showing regard for the worth of something or someone. (Related requirements: Tiger Cub: 4 - How I Tell It, Wolf: 7a - Your Living World, Bear: 8g - The Past is Exciting and Important, Webelos: Naturalist Activity Badge) 12. Responsibility: Fulfilling our duty to God, country, other people, and ourselves. (Related requirements: Tiger Cub: 1 - Making My Family Special, Wolf: 9a Be Safe at Home and on the Street, Webelos: Handyman Activity Badge) Character building encompasses more than time spent at scouting activities. Occasionally, I get complaints from parents and the community regarding my scouts' actions outside of scouting - 'What are you teaching scouts...'. A few are funny, some are silly, and some are more serious. I address them all as best that I can. I review the incident; make it clear that we are always accountable for our actions (we make amends and maybe we lose privileges); we act like scouts all the time. Makes for gripping Character Connections discussions How many of the above Cub Scout character values are at issue here? The CM and DL have some work ahead. Another $0.02

We have a known bully threat in our unit (both scouts are in the same den!). Safety is Job One. As leaders and character role models, we don't take a 'wait and see if it happens again' position and if it does happen, hope it happens outside of scouting. We act to make our unit safe and stop any future bullying now. Scout 2 should feel safe, Scout 1 should be turned away from an unscout-like path, the other Scouts should see that bullying will not be tolerated, and the DL (Scout 2's Dad) needs to know that the pack cares about his son's safety. I think that pound of flesh comment was ill-considered; walk in the DL's shoes and its your son with the stitches. Refer to "Bullying: Prevention and Intervention Tips for Scout Leaders and Parents" http://www.scouting.org/filestore/ppt/BULLYINGPREVENTION.ppt Another $0.02

We are not scouts part-time. We expect the Scout Oath and Law to be followed always. A scout acts like a scout whether in uniform or not, whether at a scout activity or elsewhere. No scout is a bully. Assuming Scout 2 is an innocent in this, then Scout 1 did not follow the Scout Oath and Law and caused an injury to another. Scouts help others not hurt others. CM and DL has this talk with Scout 1 and his parents. Scout 1 sits out the next scout activity to reconsider his actions, so he misses award banquet. At next scout activity, he apologizes to Scout 2. A few years ago, I had a similar incident. Scout 1 sucker punched Scout 2 (my son) during a game of capture the flag. That was a rough month, now they play baseball together. There are consequences for our actions. My $0.02

No BSA rule for or against parent (non-leader) participation when child not present, that is left to the unit. It can get complicated. Overnighter without child present - I would say NO (common sense?) Pack Meeting without child present - I would say OK, probably there to talk to adults. I am seeing more local youth groups restricting parents from outings even with their children in attendance. How dare they? The reason is rule consistency and to protect the other children. Specifically, why should any parent member be automatically allowed to attend an outing while the teacher, coach, or youth group leader is required to have a criminal background check, etc. Don't want to follow the rule, then you and your child need not attend. And so it goes.

Never seen it myself, except now via Youtube (thanks packsaddle). It's called the 'Magic Neckerchief Graduation Ceremony" brought to you by http://www.usscouts.org/clipart/ScoutDoc/PowWow/Books/99_02_YA.pdf and even mentioned here http://www.scouter.com/forums/viewThread.asp?threadID=145201 So it's been around, I doubt going to Council will help. Done indoors? Dripping acetone on the floor? Doesn't sound safe. I bet your town fire chief would be interested in hearing about this. My town fire chief would require that this ceremony be done outside in a fire pit with a hose or extinguisher handy, like the flag retirement ceremony. If he sees this Youtube video, he may now require a burn permit too! You have a teaching opportunity here. Redo the ceremony but safely - outside, firepit, fire extinguisher, etc. Explain the magic formula and why it is considered a safe controlled magic act or not, and that using rubbing alcohol or gasoline would definitely not be safe. There should be many firemen willing to help teach.(This message has been edited by RememberSchiff)

Postal worker, police, EMT, and military uniforms are still made in US. Here are some manufacturers that I am aware Aspen Mills Patriot Uniforms SEKRI (Southeastern Kentucky Rehabilitation Industries) Elbeco Augusta Mills? Melgamatic - I like a scout can do attitude I would be interested in what US manufacturers did the BSA look at? Did any US manufacturers (with US plants) bid? What happened with the US manufacturer(s) for our last US made uniform? No excuse for embroidered patches or American flags being made offshore. I still wear my old made in USA scout uniform. No Jamboree for me.

I can't recall these embellishments existing at my ECOH back in the days of yore. I wonder when and why they originated? I just recited the Scout Oath and Law slowly and purposefully. Worked for me. But whatever the scout and his family wants.

Well said DeanRx. In "teaching safety", we have to develop awareness -"Am I safe? Are my friends safe? Is the situation safe?" "Think Safety" is a very difficult skill to develop. Kids consider themselves immune to harm. And as for adults well the plethora of excuses is why there are for many accident investigation boards. Recognize the possible dangers. Should we be doing this? What can go wrong here? Where will the fire go? Where will the knife go if I slip? Is the pot hot? Safety is not just about rules and guidelines, it is about consequences. If the situation is not safe, STOP, SPEAK UP LOUD and CLEAR. Granted this can be hard, particularly if an older scout or adult is the culprit. If you cannot fix the safety issue don't become a victim, WALK AWAY to safety and COMMUNICATE to a responsible adult. Walking away is harder as our curiosity takes over, but our attendance implies consent and encourages the unsafe act - WALK AWAY and COMMUNICATE. Let your scouts know you will support them as I have done on unsafe occasions at summer camp. As scout leaders, I do not believe we should shield our scouts from all harm by taking away knives, matches, swimming...rather teach them (again and again) how to safely handle those situations and then keep an eye on each other - safety is everyone's responsibility. My $0.02

simple Neckerchief slides. Basswood is easy to work.

Teach Safety. March 21, 2009 http://www.kval.com/news/local/41509887.html By Associated Press TOMS RIVER, N.J. (AP) - It was a hot July night at Boy Scout camp. Six boys, including Eagle Scout Brian Lenz, were clad in shorts and T-shirts, looking for something to do. One of them was going to die, in a case that would shine an uncomfortable spotlight on the Scouts' safety and supervision policies. Lenz, an 18-year-old camp counselor, decided to show the younger boys a trick: the "circle of fire," in which he would squirt rubbing alcohol in a pattern on a table and set it aflame. It would look cool. And it would quickly burn out. When Lenz tried to reignite what he thought was a dying flame, fire leapt from the table along the stream of liquid, back into the squeeze bottle he was holding. Instinctively, he shook his hand, flinging the burning bottle away and inadvertently spraying flaming alcohol onto the other Scouts at the Joseph A. Citta Reservation in Waretown, N.J., last year on July 6. In an instant, Sean Whitley, a 17-year-old nearing his own Eagle Scout rank, was horribly burned on his legs and abdomen. He died four days later at a Philadelphia hospital. Two other Scouts, including Whitley's twin brother and a 14-year-old Scout, were also burned but soon recovered. Lenz appeared in court Thursday to plead not guilty to aggravated assault and was admitted into a pretrial intervention program that will enable him to avoid jail time or even a criminal record. The case came nearly three years after the organization reached an out-of-court settlement with the family of a New Jersey Scout who was killed by lightning at a Pennsylvania camp. Boy Scout policies prohibit the use or possession of flammable liquids, and the leader of the local Scout council said two adults are supposed to be present "in all situations." "Even one incident like this is one too many," said Craig Shelley, Scout executive for the Jersey Shore Council. "We have redoubled our efforts to ensure the safety of every child in our care. Fire safety is something we are having increased discussions about." Whitley's family sued Lenz and the Boy Scouts about a month ago, seeking unspecified damages and alleging that negligence led to Whitley's wrongful death. "The loss of Sean has been a tragedy for all involved," the victim's family said in a statement provided to The Associated Press on Wednesday by its lawyer. They did not attend Lenz's court appearance and would not speak to reporters. "We hope this incident helps focus attention to the need for increased fire safety training and supervision of minor counselors," they said. "The love Sean had for the camp and his friends on staff demands that every effort be taken to ensure their absolute safety." Lenz, tall and pale with close-cropped brown hair, did not speak in court other than to answer, "Yes, sir" to a series of technical questions the judge asked. Outside the courtroom, Lenz and his parents, other relatives and lawyer all declined to comment. The Whitleys' lawyer, Joel Rosen, would not say how the family feels about Lenz being admitted to the intervention program. But a prosecutor said the family was consulted before the decision was made to offer it to Lenz. Pretrial intervention is designed for nonviolent, first-time offenders. It lets them avoid criminal prosecution in return for staying out of trouble for a year, performing community service, and paying fines or restitution. Whitley, who lived in Evesham in Burlington County, was attending the first day of the weeklong camp in Lenz's hometown. Whitley and his brother Kenneth were staff members at the camp, which they had both attended for years. A Web site by Whitley's family and friends described him as "a quiet, intelligent kid with a dry sense of humor. He and his twin brother Ken were inseparable and did nearly everything together. "Not overly athletic or academically driven, Scouting gave him the opportunity to shine and to display the maturity and responsible nature that seemed unusual for his age," they wrote on the site. "His enthusiasm for Scouting and for the friends he made through it were extraordinary." Lest we forget Sean P. Whitley, 17, of Marlton died July 10, 2008. He was a student at Cherokee High School in Marlton. He was a member of Evesham Boy Scout Troop 100, a brotherhood member of the Order of the Arrow, a member of Jersey Shore Council Venture Crew 85 and a staff member at Joseph A. Citta Scout Reservation. As I recall, his school held an observance in the fall where many classmates wore green - some were scout uniforms but most were civilian. Both Sean and his twin brother Kenneth were working towards Eagle that summer. The remaining scout who was burned was a 14 year old Eagle Scout. (This message has been edited by RememberSchiff)

Trying resending your Eagle Letters" to government officials who are Eagles, in particular, Robert Gates, Secretary of Defense. Here's a list for the 110th Congress. http://www.scouting.org/Media/FactSheets/02-571.aspx I hope your U.S. Senator, who did not respond appropriately, is not on the above list. Another tactic - contact your local MADD chapter www.madd.org about this situation. They may be able to help your Senator correct his response. Sorry to hear of your loss.

In my day... A scout, in order to broaden his scout experience, had more restrictions on elective merit badges. He had to "elect" six merit badges from certain Merit Badge Groups. I think there were 15 groups. 1 from Conservation group 3 from Citizenship group. 1 from Outdoor sports 1 from any of the following: Animal Husbandry, Plant Cultivation, Communication, Transportation, or Building With 10 required merit badges, that left just 5 truly elective merit badges for a scout to earn for Eagle. Seemed a good system then, exposed me to some tech trades and kept fellow scouts from seeking the 11 "easiest" merit badges to fulfill electives. Another point, merit badge requirements then were decided with little consideration towards summer camp marketing. Then, it was common that Canoeing, Rowing, Marksmanship (real scouts shoot offhand), Archery, Lifesaving, etc. would take more than a week or even season to complete. Then, go back to summer camp to complete partials of hard mb's. Now, go back to summer camp and get more easy mb's, in fact, we will even add classroom mb's at summer camp as a further draw. My $0.02

Don't know but I'll state an opinion or two. Robotics would be cool, some of scouts get involved in FIRST and NASA robot competitions. Could replace Electronics mb which is a joke. Personally, I think GPS should go in Backpacking or some yet to be created Treking mb. Wilderness Survival needs rework too, maybe GPS and wilderness first aid could be added to that. SCUBA certification would be my preference. My $0.02

Yes. His award, his call. Respect his wishes.

Here's a thread on that subject from last fall http://www.scouter.com/Forums/viewThread.asp?threadID=209105 hope it helps

The Great Depression started 1929 and lasted until mid 1930's or until the ramp-up for WW2 During this time, the BSA expanded the program and membership. Scouts were highly visible doing community service - clothes collecting, scrap drives (called recycling today). Health and Safety programs were developed and received national recognitions. Catholic Churches start chartering scout units. 1930: Cub Scout started, opening scouting to younger boys 1932: Schiff Scout Reservation at Mendham, N.J. opened. National Council adopted 10 year growth plan. 1938: Waite Phillips donates Philmont Membership went up: 1929: 833,897 1930: 847,051 1932: 878,461 1933: 904,240 1935: 25th Anniversary. Membership over a million 1,027,833 online reference from Post 369: http://post369.columbus.oh.us/scouting.d/fact.sheets.d/history.d/ Lessons for success, in my opinion: 1. Scouting was in sync with current American values and needs. 2. Keep the bar high, stick to BP basics. 3. Scouts were highly visible in the community helping others. You actually saw firsthand, scouts in uniform around town performing community service. 4. On the radio and in other public speeches, the President of the United States asked Scouts for their help, while our own BSA president was more in the background. 5. Scout run, scout-centric program. Far, far fewer adults involved. More adventure. 6. Thrifty. As mentioned, make your own gear and re-use uniforms. Plan. Camp locally. I don't want to give the impression that the program was perfect back then. It was mostly a white, upper middle-class youth group. Also, I would suggest there may have been more competition to scouting back then than now, namely JOBS. My dad would make the rounds on his bike after school to see who needed help sweeping, loading, gopher,...odd jobs. More time and energy was expended in the search than the actual work; he had no time left for scouting. At age 16, he tried to join another "youth group" - the U.S. Navy In time, he was allowed to enlist.

Mr. Peabody: Sherman set the Wayback Machine for Sept, 1972. Sherman: Where are we going Mr. Peabody? Mr. Peabody: To the Improved Scouting Program Sherman: Ah, can't we go to the Titanic maiden voyage instead? Say let's have an Improved Scouting Program to attract a certain demographic... And drop Camping merit badge as Eagle required as after all it is 'not necessarily a big thing' to some people. Been through this stupidity (I am greatly sugar-coating my opinion here) before. 'Green Bar' Bill Hillcourt came back, but even he could not repair all the damage and restore membership levels. I think by the time Green Bar Bill wrote a new handbook, "scout" membership had dropped more than 2 million - more than the current "scout" membership now.

Good excuse to be irrational today.

Be prepared. Teaching first aid, emergency preparedness, and safety are cornerstones of our troop scouting program. So far, no complaints from our parents. My previous response was about troop first aid kits, but count me in the "few" that want scouts to make and carry their own personal first aid kits as well. It is also Second Class requirement 6b. Each of our scouts carries his own "personal" first aid kit whose contents are mostly those on p289 of the Scout handbook "Personal First Aid Kit". Some kits are store bought, but most scouts make their own very lightweight (5 to 8oz), inexpensive, quart size ziploc or equivalent bag. "Personal" as in stuff the scout will likely need himself - their own correct-size gloves (one size does not fit all in this age group), bandaids, MOLESKIN (blisters happen), scissors, sterile dressing, small tape roll,... My $0.02