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First and formost References. That would include contact info the council advancement committee and district advancement chairs. If you could invite any of them to drop by the class, it would be a big boost. Secondly, you want low tech and high tech solutions. So if you know how a troop handles each, two case studies would be good. If your council has best practices, you want to promote them. You might be the only training this person will attend, so your personal philosophy matters. If you believe (as I do) that advancement is best tracked first in a boys handbook, then he brings it from time to time to the Advancement chair to copy into the troop's record, say so sometime in the beginning, middle, and the end of your talk. If you think differently, open with "Unlike those whacky scouters in internet land ..."

Well, I never would have counted Scout Sunday as a troop activity, ever. It's doing what a reverent fella should routinely do, only with a different shirt and temporary change of venue. At the same time, if the boy took the time to write it down in his handbook, I wouldn't strike it. Requesting it for other boys? If they don't write it in their own handbook ... I probably wouldn't count it.

Details matter. If boys are already on a roster to do this stuff, and you have time to touch base to talk about it. Ask the PL assigned for this week, POLITELY, if he would be so kind as to add your one or two changes to the routine. Then after the meeting, ask the PL assigned to do it next week what he thought and let him know he's free to do it either way next week. If you don't have that roster, and your real agenda is establishing a boy led ethic, you need to slow down and add another step ... If you already delineated patrols, and the boys seem generally happy with them, start by having a talk with the SPL (in front of the boys) and giving him a roster (best if you draw it on the clipboard while talking) for which patrol will do opening and which will do closing for the next few weeks. Hand it to him and say "Thank you for adding this to tonight's agenda at the last minute. Forgive me for not talking to you about it earlier, I will try to do better next time. As you were ..." Then return to your seat at the back of the room. If the boys are unhappy with their patrols or think the patrol method stinks, then you have your work cut out for you. Don't touch the opening ceremony or any tradition until cracking that bigger nut! Start with some form of after action review "What do you like about our meetings? What don't you like? What's the one thing you think we should do differently?" Maybe put the "do differents" on separate cards and fave them vote on the most important one, gradually fold in how patrols might make accomplishing the "do differents" easier. My reasoning? People who are in the habit of someone putting their thumb down on them aren't trusting some new boss when he tells them "it's whatever they want to do." They need to experience someone treating them with dignity and respect. They need to see their ideas being worked into the grand scheme of things.

We don't pre-post, but our routine is post, pledge, oath and law. I guess if your boys have good pipes, each one could solo the national anthem on a different week! But seriously, one thing my SM did was have a "this week in American history" booklet, from which one of the boys would read a passage. That often led into his SM minute. Other troops have a pre-opening activity ... typically a 15 minute game. Then flags are a way to transition into something else. I think in that scenario, pre-posting may be a good idea. If you have several patrols, each one could take it in turn to set up the flags and perform the opening ceremony. Pick just one thing to fold in. Do it in a way that suits your style.

Oh, it was all related! I could almost quote Mamma on that. Her diatribes against promiscuity, abuse, and sodomy all wrapped into one big "I don't care how hot it is in the summer, put your shirt on when working the garden." (Or whatever I was doing ... or watching!) This wasn't just in the 80s. In the late 60's, my brother was yelled at by a German immigrant neighbor for immodesty when he was doing basically the same thing. It was the beginning of a larger culture clash, as the second wave of immigrants took a stand on what they saw as loosening "Anglo-Saxon" mores. (I also got a lot of "in the Old Country, they would have ..." speeches.)

In the church's "minute for mission", Son #2 gave his last report (as a boy scout) to the CO. This was a tradition that I started with the previous SM when we decided that we're the two adults who folks (the Almighty included) hear from aplenty. I'm looking forward to see which boy (or female venturer) will do it next year. My holy grail would be the cubs, scouts, and venturers pulling together some sort of skit for this "minute for mission" (or maybe a play for the sermon) , but that will take a special combination of youth. Regardless, our CO showed the boys a lot of love. Many of the older members took time to personally greet every scout. Oh, and venturers, happy anniversary!

Oldgain1 nailed it. When I was a scout (in a district of about 1/2 dozen units), the district leaders increasingly asked more of my opinion as I got older came back from Jambo, etc... Now with a district of maybe 5 times as many unites, there's this annual ritual where some seasoned scouter (who I respect for the effort he puts in) stands up and asks why there is such low enthusiasm for a camporee, I kinda feel sorry for him when I'm in the room because instead of the hemming and hawing about schedules and such, I ask, "How many SPLs did you ask to help you with advising you before you started planning this thing?"

Do you know any members of the socialist workers party? Sometimes a conversation with a person that really fits his profile will at least help him be more creative in his choice of derogatory comments.

Welcome to the forums. I feel your pain b/c we had a scout who had complete disdain for schoolwork and barely graduated last of his class. Nice guy, but is coming up through life in the school of hard knocks. His problem was a passion for cutting corners, doing the bare minimum, skirting boundaries. As a result, he was very involved in scouting but tried to shortchange requirements for Eagle Scout and did not achieve the one goal he admired as a youth. That failure was his first wake-up call. A few more such events, a wife, and a daughter was what it took for him to settle into a decent job. But he lost the trust of a lot of friends along the way. If your student is anything like that scout, backing off on one activity is not going to help his performance in another. However, if he has been managing time poorly -- regardless of if he is college material -- then he needs to straighten out. Another girl in my venturing crew is army bound, but almost lost that opportunity because of terrible grades. What she needed to do was stop social activities. Get MORE involved in venturing, girl scouts, and a job ... thus surrounding herself with people who did not find stupid to be cute. Bottom line: the diploma is money. And I think his scoutmaster would agree. To answer your questions ... There are no grade requirements to be in good standing in Boy Scouts; however, a scoutmaster can remove a boy from positions of responsibility, and excuse him from meetings if there's a problem at home. Taking a break for a couple of weeks from scouts to focus on academics would be a good idea. Scouts take breaks to focus on other things (sports, theater, church missions, family vacation) all the time. However, he can still be scouting. I refer you to the requirements for scholarship merit badge http://www.meritbadge.org/wiki/index.php/Scholarship. No trip is mandatory. Boys just love to go on them. Our scholar scouts sometimes bring homework to work on in the car and at campfires. Our athletes will wake before reveille and work out. Our thespians will practice their lines wile hiking. Obviously, if your student is overwhelmed, "fitting in" a couple of study hours will not be enough. I'll also add: From the scout law, a scout is ... courteous. He has no business back-talking his teachers. obedient. His teachers are boss, he should approach any assignment with gladness, because he is ... cheerful. This especially applies when life is tough. Any jackass will smile when there's no load to bear. [*]From the scout oath A boy is "on his honor" to "do his best" to keep himself "mentally awake." Note that I also have boys in school systems with chronic grade inflation, low expectations of students, etc ... never do we use that as an excuse a boy to shirk from gaining knowledge when it is offered c/o the taxpayer or his parents. My advice: When you talk to the parents, also ask them about video games, TV, and other distractions. If you can, talk to the scoutmaster about the situation. The boy's minister/youth pastor might be a good contact as well. Re-familiarize yourself with the scout oath and law (http://www.scouting.org/Home/BoyScouts.aspx). When he throws up attitude about teachers, etc ... Remind him of the relevant point, and say something like "I know you say this every week. It's time it actually meant something." Consider becoming a counselor for scholarship merit badge. It's not required for Eagle, so very few boys will ask your help with it, but a lot of boys should consider it. In fact some home-school scouts use the merit badge program as part of their curriculum, so it would serve your business to familiarize yourself with it. Good luck. Let us know how things work out!

Matt, you've just defined a venturing crew. Skiers led by the ski czar (a.k.a., activity chair for winter sport), rafters for the raft czar, college students by the spring-break czar, etc ... Participants team up with whoever's schedule they can synch with. Upside: flexibility. Downside: plenty of failure due to lack of unit cohesion.

Misread it at first and thought "Hmm knee jerkey ... next to the pickled pigs feet."

Stosh, same for my siblings. There was a time when I was post-bommer. Then Clinton started including '64 in that demographic. What a slam.

Sorry, didn't mean to harp on just that. I just wanted to say that the confidence to step forward as a unit leader is found in folks who are routinely volunteering in a way that they have practiced people skills, can see the need for what you are proposing, and are willing to step away from their current charity to take up this new mantle. Church was my example of the kind of charity that generates these sorts of leaders. Fire halls, veterans' posts, and service fraternities are another example. Rick has a point. The economy drives 30-somethings away from all of that. But the standard of living (and sometimes a negative view of organizations in general) also has these folks investing a lot of time in non-essentials.

One thing we try to do (partly because of duties elsewhere, partly to share the load) is rotate who goes to RT, with a couple going on any given evening. The advantage of this is that different ears pick up on different activities (of wheich there are many council-wide), so sometimes one attendee catches something that another one will miss.

Depends on the unit, I guess. Our district used to be a council before decades of mergers ... something to think about.

Nine boys, two adult leaders ... already double the average load for a wilderness area site. Use three sites. Split the patrol, four at one site, five at the other, adults at the next. Works for me. But how would the forest service even know that that's an "organized group"? More to the OP, when you talk your young adults about starting a unit, what is the picture in their head? Smiles on a half dozen kids faces? Or hours locked horns with adults (like maybe during their last board of review)? How many former SPL/JASM's actually had a seat on the troop committee to even know what one would be like? How many of them did you allow to hang with the adults after lights-out around the evening campfire while the old fogies pulled out their evening cigars? Meanwhile at church, capable teens are on the deacon's board. Collecting the offering. Counting change with the treasurer. Raising support for their mission(s). Taking the pulpit twice a year. One young fellow (former scout) ran for councilman at age 18. He told me that his political career has been the highlight of the past six years (over college, the work world, etc ...). He might have gained a sense of rights and responsibilities from those couple of years in his troop, but he learned to work the crowd, hand out leaflets, and canvass a neighborhood from many years ushering on Sunday mornings. Not saying every churchman is cub-master material. Just saying that the room full of Eagles is not the first place to look.

Yes, because most of our boys' projects are major contracts, and a little personal coaching from folks who do subcontracting work helps them to choose and plan effectively. Sometimes, they just need someone to help them schedule their next couple of moves. Son #1 and DiL just did this for Son #2. Well, not every boy has that older brother to help with that sort of thing. And the paperwork is ridiculous! Not every boy works well with it. So, if you've got a scouter who can help a boy see the forest for the trees -- especially if there are more than 1/2 dozen Life scouts clamoring to complete their projects in a year -- it's good that the boys know he's their go-to guy.

The pack was from the area. The "pack master" said he and his family went there regularly. Sounds like a lot of folks thought it would be no problem. They were were making the plans and didn't think that they should make that clear to the parents and boys. It's the CO's problem. Not the council's. We've all dealt with clueless parents. I remember once: "I'll help the boys make model rockets." DL:"Fine here's your budget." I get decent models under budget. Discuss assembly, A or B engines. Go over safety. 3, 2, 1, Launch. DL: "They're going so high, so fast!" "Um, didn't hear the part about launching rockets? And needing this big field?"

You all had your heart in the right place, but ... If this is about medical records for adults, it's always a negotiation. The "rules are rules" stump speech just isn't gonna fly. For weekend campouts, give the SM/ASM some blank forms, with a list of who (to your knowledge) hasn't updated them since summer camp. It's on him to hand them to the adults to fill out during coffee break, and on the adults to let the designated leader now where they'll be kept (with the troop, or with their personal gear). Literally, the adults with concerns can make their own "where to find" roster and turn that piece of paper to the SM when they bring him his coffee. If an updated form never makes it back to you, that person stays on your list and it's on him to fill it out all over again (or let the SM's know where they can find it in an emergency). Don't make this your month-to-month problem. You don't have to phone every new adult who pops up on a weekend's roster. Rechartering is enough of a nightmare, I would not add med form's to the task. Only go over everyone's forms before summer camp and/or high adventures.