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It's much easier to maneuver fishing tackle and snorkling/scuba gear (and divers) from a rowboat! (Most oarlocks can double as a stand for the divers' flag.) Kayak's and canoes are definitely stealthier. Nowadays, I just use my kayak paddle when canoeing. Kayaking is much more of a challenge to fish from. More fun once you have a fish on, though. Never tried snorkeling from one. But the 90-pound dog seems to love swimming out to me and climbing aboard!

No surprise. Not one comment that I read had the stones to put forward an alternative youth organization ... makes them no different than the permissive sexual ethic activists that these flamers despise. There is, however, a leeriness towards BSA. Some parents at church want to host a pack, and the elders have asked me to help respond to various concerns. Among them: the public profile of a CO who may be selective about who among its volunteers takes leadership roles. For parents, it's still a brand that they trust. For beleaguered organizations, it's a liability.

I think we're experiencing similar challenges. Cyberchip is a bit of a square peg and we mostly are round holes! However, I don't think we're having any problem with retention. Our formula is to get them camping and hiking. Encourage them by having them demonstrate whatever skills they master and getting those signatures. Teach them that they can build the bridge from either pylon. I have always encouraged 1st years to have a MB in their sights just for fun. @@Zaphod, the good news is that you heard a boy working with him!

That's not exactly how this works. Unlike geocaches, the locations (a.k.a. "stops") tend not to be isolated. In fact, players can "boost" stops that they like. (One former scout did so with a veteran's memorial that another scout had refurbished for his Eagle project.) Once a player is at a stop, any "chasing" is done by rapidly tapping a control on their screen. The "map" provided by the game is your typical driving gps map. Going off trail seems to get you further away from targets. So, I don't see that happening. At least with this version.

My kids and several former scouts are having a good time with it. Advantage: son #2 discovered a couple parks that he and his siblings had never been to before.

When I was a scout, canoeing trips were completely foreign. We never even thought to ask! But, the MB still was fun and the pamphlet was interesting, and there were enough state parks with small lakes and day-rentals nearby for us to go paddling on our own. Still, learning by doing, I guess. But not nearly as fun as the actual float trips my boys took on the Allegheny.

For the record, the stuff I got out of IOLS were the "extras" ... Experiences from a youth aquatics director. (Prepared me for subsequent years of BSA guard training.) Details of the sport from an avid backpacker. Stuff I'd never do, but can tell the scouts "There's this guy in the district who ..." Vindication that there is indeed more than one way to taught line hitch. At the tag-end of the orienteering session, "Oh, there's this thing called geocaching. ..." Friends.

I guess the question boils down to: What does an adult need to know that a boy doesn't? And, does an adult need to learn it in a different way?

Of course! Heck, when we went to national jamboree local corporations would load us up with swag ... Heinz pickle pins were an especially favorite tradable.

I guess training and compensating a hundred young men and women to travel around the country teaching leadership wherever they would be welcome to hang their hats for a couple of years is too expensive of a proposition.

There's a balance. You can see it in the scout law. E.g., friendly, helpful, courteous ... imply some social interaction. Thrifty, brave, clean, reverent, are mor individual challenges. Boys learn to fill in where they are lacking.Really, a board of review should be more about what the boy has learned in terms of the Oath and Law than about skills and PORs ... all of which are just a mechanism to help the boy live up to the words he says every week.

Oh ... That sounds like a good idea ... Mom comes to demanding we bling out Snowflake in the parlor ... Pull a bell out of your pocket and hand it to her.Mom: "What's this?" SM "Just a little icing for your cupcake. Sew it on his sleeve, so hear it on him from a little ways off." Mom: "why?" SM "It'll save him having to shout 'Unclean' all day."

Hmmm maybe the notion of weekend classroom style setting is completely flawed ...... Perhaps if there an award for having read a concise but accurate set of reading material and demonstrated specific skills, e.g. One for Camping another for First Aid, Hiking, Swimming, etc ... Something like a little round medallion for each ... Maybe an oval one for a certain cluster of skills ... Maybe a certain oval would represent qualification to take your boys hiking and camping independently. ... Maybe if youth could earn that same award as adults. Sure he district could still put on weekend instruction, but maybe certification should come from senior boys (if a new troop ... Perhaps from senior boys in a neighboring troop).

The one his garrrghlfriend wrote him!

Thanks for letting us know TT! I personally am uplifted by the good news.

The question is mostly intended to be rhetorical, more of a statement of admiration, considering that I've seen MCs try to teach skills like fire-starting ... chilling results at best.It's not challenging his knowledge. It's asking the boy what he's retain. There's a difference.

Missed opportunities on the adults' part. The biggest: if at all possible, we have SMCs at camp. That said, these administrative delays are minor. Your boy has a chaotic schedule that simply doesn't flex with his troop. It wasn't working AT ALL with his other troop.

Let's put it this way. If it is a re-test, are you having the BoR in a swimming pool? May the scout light a fire in your meeting place? Is he first blindfolded, dropped off five miles away with map and compass, and required to hike to the BoR location? Assuming that your BoR location doesn't have the facilities to randomly test any of the skills accorded to a 1st class scout, what makes you so sure your "re-test" will provide an unbiased evaluation of the metal of the man? The best way to find out if a scout has the skills: ASK HIM, "CAN YOU ACTUALLY DO THE STUFF LISTED ON THIS PAGE?"

@@Stosh, let's not be baited by relativism. It's a pointless exercise. (Except to note, regarding the first item on your list in reply #74, that Steeler fans keep their beauties in the stands with them, not in cheer-leading squads. ) Just because a boundary is in your "book" and not mine does not mean that I should disregard the boundary. It is healthier for all involved to accept the premise that certain persons' occupations may be found to be morally lacking. Start from there, and you can respect a mothers' disdain while proudly recognizing someone being a good neighbor and challenging others to step up their game to "go and do likewise."

This is what makes the badge interesting. Let the boy use his judgement. That's part of the exercise. He might have to just note Mostly E, or Mostly D. Then discuss with his counselor.

@@Stosh, we're talking about anatomical parts here ... Let's not elevate these particular waitresses above women who do not use their breasts in the service of someone's fertility goddess. I have friends who are actresses and models who constantly pass on gigs that they could rightfully own because their bodies would be used to fashion a dishonorable image. So, I'll give respect to those who would regard such workers as base. Likewise, I'll always give due regard to those who would never cross the threshold of our family's beer distributor. (We just dropped the cases at the back door, accepting a tip for delivery.) What I would not countenance, were I the SE, is the high-and-mighty appropriating the BSA as the "stone" that should be thrown at businesses who volunteer their time and talent. A Samaritan is disreputable on a good day, but the Good Book makes quite clear that Almighty honors them by their name when they do His good work. We don't have to like it. We do have to say "thank you" and imitate their good behavior when they outshine us.

As long as they are doing something practical (besides making $ for their CEO).

From scouting.org ... 7. Do the following: a. Take part in an emergency service project, either a real one or a practice drill, with a Scouting unit or a community agency. b. Prepare a written plan for mobilizing your troop when needed to do emergency service. If there is already a plan, explain it. Tell your part in making it work. So, now troop mobilization is not required, unless you want to do it to fulfill 7a.

I'm not splitting hairs when the neck is already sliced. When an eating establishment's claim to fame offends feminists and traditionalists, it's owners are preying on moral sensibilities for profit. The employees are willing participants in that. So, playing innocent relativist is not an option. Better to say "Welcome to America. Now lets thanks these ladies for taking time out of their week to help our boys." This attitude is why my mom resented the business. Dad went to extremes making sure his merchandise did not wind up in the hands of the under-aged (not easy to do in a college town). But her holy-roller friends wouldn't want him sponsoring their little league ... even though his kids were the most sober lot in town. He was more than happy, however, to make private donations to make sure there were enough bats and gloves on the playground. His real passion was sponsoring the Voice of America essay contest through the VFW. That did make it into the papers, but if anyone dared complain about a link to the booze, they'd be contending with the guys they saw carrying rifles in the every parade since the Whiskey Rebellion.

It would be very naive to put an issue like this on a political spectrum. I had a strident liberal relative take umbrage at a strident conservative relative who was employed as a principle in an objectifying industry for a time. Certain known family values were not worth upholding if the prodigal would have to come home to years of being dependent on family for debt relief. From that personal experience, I would say David's stance is correct. These workers choose their employment while hundreds of noble women take less rewarding work -- hazarding poverty and dependence -- out of a desire to be more consistent with certain higher standards. That's not to say I'm much different. It's to make clear that there are stones that could be thrown, according to some, but not by any. But, like I've told my boys when scouters blustered: "Regard who does the work. Honor them." The self-righteous will get their turn, as soon as they pick up the hammer and anchor those tent stakes.