qwazse

The Aussies definitely do it right! But that opinion was not new ... My SM would not give us anything less than what today would be called a "mini-rogain". Anything more straightforward was just "calibration" to him. That attitude seems to have sunk in more than once. My SPL's son was on camp staff a couple years ago, and one evening I had a moment to chat with the young man about his scouting career. He said Dad was SM for a while, and it generally worked out pretty well ... "but, we sure did a lot of orienteering." When I first started with the local orienteering club just a few years ago, the whole notion of advancing to controls in numerical order was new to me. That's where I met Europeans who grew up doing this stuff, and they basically had the equivalent of our cross-country teams which revolved around orienteering.

Just pull up to my neighbor's apt. and honk. Worked until Mrs. Q got sick of it and called the narcs. When I'm far enough into the wilderness that I find bear scat, I start to feel safe again.

Or, as the scoutmaster of my youth called it: a compass course.

Well ... we are all in this together. The only real Id is your word, "I know first aid." And obviously, that can be faked just as well as laminated pieces of paper, (or a neckerchief, to answer 'schiff's question). Unfortunately, BSA has not marketed "first class scout" as well as it has it more rare achievements, so there is no scouting credential that folks outside of the organization would recognize at face value as qualifying the scout to administer any form of first aid. Boys have been trained not just in first aid, but in youth protection. I'm sure that rattling around in their head is some fear of a stranger taking advantage of someone in a vulnerable situation. If a responder is acting sensibly, and everyone communicates to make sure all of the necessary tasks are being administered (securing the scene, contacting personnel, continuing assessment, preventing blood loss, treating for shock, immobilizing, etc ...), you have success.

Thumbs again! Somebody +1 Stosh for me.

I was irritated at the coddling of son #1, who I had to drive 1.5 miles down sidewalked streets to his best friend's. Payback was daughter who got into an exercise routine of midnight runs through the neighborhood ... I'd smirk, but Mrs. Q packs a punch.

In Mr. Q's warped world, incompletion = success. Nobody needs to know that they know what they already know. Everybody needs to know what it is that they don't already know. I've named my open field compass course "tortured soul". Each control has a deck of cards with headings to each of the other controls (including the entry/exit control). Read the top card, set your compass, put the card on the bottom of the deck, proceed to the drawn control. Repeat until you have visited all controls, then continue the course until you draw a card to the exit control. I'm not well loved for that one, but toward the end, each scout can quickly gauge a heading precisely before even setting the compass. If you have the staff, repeat the canoe course next year. I'm sure there will be one or two patrols who will want to take vengeance on that one. Besides, regarding your theme, zombies, I'm told, don't swim.

@@Faith, congratulations to your son! If the troop goes on lots of treks (the carry-your-own-gear kind) you will want to stick with the hand held LEDs or headlamps. Best if they all use the same batteries. I routinely pack a headlamp, a AA battery hand light, and spare batteries for them and/or my gps. (Plus I have some old foil wrappers in another pocket of my pack and steel wool in another pocket ... in case my matches fail me.) I do have one of those rechargeable headlamp/hand lights, (Nitecore), but it gets really hot. A young scout might not be comfortable working with it. Certain types of batteries for it are on the no-fly list. So, you have to be careful about what you purchase for replacements if you take an airline to the trail head. On the other hand, it is nice not to need spare batteries.

I use the -1 because my thumb slipped, mainly. When I do it on purpose, it's usually because I think an opinion is thoroughly unfounded. It may be downright mean. Maybe not. To me pushing the red button allows me to simply dissent without saying anything specific. That allows that person's statement to be the last one on the thread while still letting readers know there's notable dissent regarding it. There's a lot of stuff that you all do where maybe I'd do the opposite, but I don't -1 those posts. I might even +1 although I disagree with a post. If it's well written and worth thinking about, I'd like to draw attention to it. Obviously in those situations I'll reply if I think it will help clarify any part of the post that runs counter to my experience on the matter.

I'm having the opposite problem ... Teaching boys to put a fire dead out. Last week, I was last to leave the site because I was rigging the dog's pack as well as mine. I stopped to check the fire circle, and smoke was rising from one corner. I thought I 'd have to unrig my gear to put it out. Then lo and behold, on the edge of the ring was someone's ozark bottle and just enough water to put the remaining coals dead out. The boys were late to the extraction, so I saved the stern lecture about paying closer attention and how the dog carried more water because I had to carry an somebody's empty empty bottle. At least the ASPL owned up to it once we got home and sorted gear. I told him no worries, I needed to slow the dog down anyway, and am looking forward to the boy's song at the next meeting.

Just a follow-up. Because we had a fourth vehicle, driven by parents who had no specific plans except to hang out at a B&B in the area, I had volunteers who could drive my venturers to their trail head, then take my van back to the extraction point -- no scouts having to wait while we shuttled vehicles. Moreover, there was a sick kid emergency, and they both being nurses and close to the kids' parents, were able to help me handle it without disrupting the venturers' plans. Plus, the mom offered to chaperon crew activities should I need a female adult. Sometimes involving more parents on the weekend does help the program.

Specific to safety: I once called out a DE at round-table who said we should file a tour plan for every meeting outside our meeting place. The crew at that time was meeting someplace special every other week! At weekend camps, I would give the boys a map and have them devise a day hike plan. My SM thought that meant one of us had to go with them on the hike. I showed him the appropriate pages of G2SS. He promptly grabbed his chain saw and chaps and went off cutting some deadfall that the boys happily split on their return. Since then, he and I have enjoyed quite a few pleasurable hikes in the opposite direction of the boys -- sometimes arranging rendezvous with them at some scenic location.

You might also ask your CO. They get a copy of every adult member application, and may have a file of them in their archives.

You're the one who asked "Why not?" My point: there is an overall institutional cost to the profusion of awards. We have boy scouts' attention for one hour a week ... venturers, less. They can only focus on so much. I invest that time in telling them who to contact for EMT certification, the local VFD, JROTC, BSA or RC lifeguard, or the Law Enforcement or Medical Exploring ... or whatever organization will help them find their specific path. I then encourage them to do their best to draw their buddies in. The E-prep award is just more noise unless we become convinced that first responders are looking for anything more than the helping hands that stosh describes.

@@RichardB, what does the "award" do that being a first class scout does not? And if it does that, is there something wrong with 1st class rank requirements? Maybe, just maybe, if BSA and it's trained adult lackeys would stop saying things like: "Track your service hours." "There's a patch for that." "Log on the website." "Here's the paperwork." "Make sure it's a troop campout." ... the boys would spend less time filtering the noise and be able to hear "Keep your uni (or at least your necker) at the ready, folks will count on you if they see you're a scout."

Non sequitur... scout doesn't have to wear uniform during campouts to count them. Why should he have to wear it for service hours.But, then again, why should he have to count service hours at all? Maybe we have a nation of boys who want to serve out of their free will, and don't want BSA hogging their work for bragging rights.

Got flack from my oldest venturer coming on the next outing: "Why can't we go on the shorter hike with the rest of the troop? And, why do you add an orienteering course to it?" Not one of my better moments, said in surly, ill-tempered advisor voice ... "Because, you are in a Crew meeting. This is what we do." I shouldn't get on his case too bad. The three youth who were really asking for this event can't attend. The other youth who was involved in the planning couldn't attend last night. So, I'm the "middle man" trying to pass along a certain vision. I could see where, in his case, one might balk between a choice of an hour orienteering course followed by six miles backpacking and 4 miles backpacking with the last part bushwhacking "up and over" a wooded ridge. I'm sure we sound the same way as we cringe at MB universities, etc ... folks don't see their "process streamlining" as shooting for the lowest common denominator.

I have a funny feeling that even that set-up is lighter than our trailer fully over-loaded!

I don't scour the 'net for feel-good stores about troops/crews showing up for disaster relief, so I can't counter your observations. But I'll speculate that your odds of seeing what you're looking for have slimmed over the years for two reasons: The uniform is now too precious to wear while serving. The notion of wearing just your neckerchief when you risk mussing your uni has not caught on. The notion that being in uniform might identify you as one ready to serve is completely lost on scouts. (Tangent: some scouts asked if they should wear their uniform backpacking this weekend. I said, "Nobody's going to make you, but I reserve patches from my collection for boys who do.") Membership declines actually do mean something. The odds have titled against running into a card-carrying BSA member, youth or adult, especially in the southeast. You are more likely to find a boy or girl in the civil air patrol these days. Seriously, @@Stosh, you are the first person who ever told me about that organization first-hand. Since then I've met a couple young men who joined and enjoy it (advantage of this forum: you actually learn stuff that helps you talk to youth). We can also speculate that the "free market" design of troop selection has conspired against this sort of thing. If your troop meets on the opposite side of town, and your neighbors are in the gulch across the street, mobilizing the troop might by on the bottom of your E-prep strategies. If instead, BSA somehow encouraged boys to bolster the troop nearest their home and all boys were within walking distance of the scout house... that could make rallying your mates easier.

This weekend: 13 scouts, 3 venturers, 4 drivers, and my dog. No trailers. 2 minivans, 1 pickup, 1 explorer. With the trailer, we might have taken one less vehicle.

Now, if they were detained by a police officer, arraigned by a grand jury, and defended by a lawyer ... that might make for an interesting weekend. Different scouts could be assigned as witnesses, bailiffs, assist the prosecution, the jury pool, etc ... Mock trial camporee ... that could be fun.

Every specific phobia is unusual. (If one were usual, not being afraid would be given a disorder name in pop. Psych.) And, they can be culturally based. (E.g., We had a Korean scout who was terrified of spiders because, growing up he was taught to avoid them because most of the species there were dangerously poisonous to humans.) Scouting is a form of exposure therapy. Youth are presented with a panoply of revulsions in a context where they have to deal with them, while supported.by their pears. We have scouts afraid of heights that stare at that climbing wall until they are ready to belay on, afraid of guns until the day they load their first round. Bugs, snakes, big hairy scoutmasters who don't cater to your fears .., we have it all. My latest scout from southern Italy, brimming with enthusiasm, stopped us while we were planning campouts through November and December and said "Guys, I'm really afraid of the winter, l never experienced this kind of cold." The best you can do is tell a kid with a specific phobia "Yes, you may have to face that stuff. But, we'll be right here with you when we do." For the Italian kid, I told her that this time of year, when I start to load my backpack with winter gear, I feel my body screaming: aren't you too old for this yet? Then I step out into the woods hike the hills, and take in the beauty. And those screaming fears subside.

I think the dinner would be fun. I think if, at the next CoH, the SM or SPL announces that you will be getting your beads at a council dinner, then you stand, they applaud, and you throw down a challenge like "Who will be the next adult to work their ticket?" ... that will get you the recognition you want without all the hoopla you don't want. Suggestion for anyone who does want to have the beading at a troop function, dismiss the youth for cookies/campfire/whatever before giving your WB buddies the floor. That way, they can have the fun and fellowship they like to have while the adults have the "fun" and fellowship they like to have.

i guess they'd have to lash you to a mast to keep you from counseling them!