qwazse

How else is the kid going to earn motor-boating? Whatever you do, don't let some hack like me get behind the wheel!

Since when did a sash chock full of little round patches, a stash of PoR patches (to one day hand down to nephews and great-nephews), cool event patches, religious awards, etc ... amount to "no credit"? Maybe I am a stuck-in-the-mud sentimental old fool. Perhaps it's because I remember my Palm BoR to be one of the most enjoyable conversations with my committee. I could look dad and all of the professors and the mom of the best scout I've ever met (she passed away last week BTW) in the eye and just talk about college plans, the big 50-miler I was planning, what I'd do for my last week of summer camp, considering the ministry, etc .... I enjoyed the brief time I was on the committee of my son's troop doing the same with another couple of fine young men coming up for their next Palm. I want boys to hustle up and make rank then knock off a few palms so that they could have what I had ... a chance to relax and really rub off on my guys without any paper-pushing ... maybe to look at some need and say "I know how to line that up" ... maybe to have some swagger around camp to hunt down guys from Jambo and say "didga get your bird."

Well, are they not viewed the same because they are open to different groups of youth? Or, are they not viewed the same because they have different requirements? If co-eds complete the same requirements, is it not the same award? On the other hand, if someone of the same sex, for an award of the same name, completes different requirements -- say, starting August 1st, did he earn the same award as the one earned by someone else by completing different requirements on July 31st?

I have no idea why this is necessary. In the current requirements how is it extra work for no recognition? Scout gets colorful patches to deck out a sash for his ECoH. Palms recognize that, above and beyond that, he worked intentionally with his troop or patrol to develop and practice more leadership. At least until August, that's what they recognize. It doesn't benefit scouts. It makes all past Eagles think less of them. I see this as being very divisive. The only thing that I would have changed in the existing requirements is instead of starting the "palm clock" at EBoR, start it at the ESMC.

Hard to say. "Any ship in a storm."

I learned it from the ARC, in grade school I suppose. Later instructors taught me that acclimation to water temperature and stretching were overriding factors. Of course, the county pool had a grill and vending machines, so we figured it not a big deal. That, or was worth it to them to have cramped up kids for the sake of making some coin. I figure it was a ploy to minimize having to evacuate the pool due to unwanted "deposits".

Yep we're all about unsolicited advice!That, and @@Stosh told us not to beat a dead horse after a topic was marked solved. Yours was the first after he spouted that tidbit. So I figured it was a good opportunity to tenderize those steaks in spite of him. Good scouting to you, and thanks in advance for all you do for the boys.

It may not sound like it, but I'm kind of a status quo guy. It's a lot easier to ask folks to do what most seem to be doing anyway. I think only OPs and mods have access to "solved" buttons. I've only seen them on threads that I started.

I like the general notion of +/- 1 for strongly liking/disliking a particular reply. Being limited to so many a day helps a reader focus on the best/worst posts. Especially you should use this if you are a bit rushed, or if among a lot of replies in a thread, one resonates especially true/false. no obligation, but if you have time, and can put it in words, explaining specifically what you liked/disliked. using "Report" to let a moderator know that you think a post violates the rules of the forum -- not when you disagree with someone's opinion, think there are factual errors, don't like their choice of nickname to your user name, etc... encouraging OPs to mark one reply to their topic as "solved", especially if they actually followed its advice and got a desirable outcome. I think the icons are pretty good as-is.

Sometimes,I think venturing youth should be called Advisormasters! Honestly I don't care as long as they don't call me late for dinner (especially considering what good cooks some of my officers have been). I think "scoutmaster" was not intended to mean "master of scouts" so much as it was intended to mean "master of scout skills." I suspect some people prefer the former definition, because if they accept the latter, they would have to bear the brunt of ridicule from guys like me when they fail to tie a timber hitch!

Thanks for the update. SM's who overstay their position miss out on all manner of opportunities. Hopefully there are other, wiser troops in your district.

The logo, at the time was Scouting USA. ... That 70's show.If it's the BSHB, trail to Eagle, patrol method, it's Boy scouting. No matter if it's 5%, 50%, 95% girls. But I don't even think we'll be at 1% based on what I've seen in my region. As long as we recruit girls who would proudly be Boy Scouts, we will be just that. If on top of that, thos girls recruit the types of boys who've drifted away from our program, we could even be more true to our charter than we have been for decades. If we try to girl-up a program, then yes, we should drop pretense of being in it for the boys.

We are scouters. I think that was nailed down when venturing started having contingents at Jambo. What's cool is some of our venturers, by virtue of being young adult staff or ASMs, etc ... are also scouters. We are indeed laid back. Which resolves some communication problems and causes others.

Oh, they need subgroups. Just not a one-size-fits-all chart. The venturers who I've seen attend camporees will probably form patrols if your program requires it. (E.g. Klondike derbies.) Really, the only way I can see you crack this nut is to talk to the advisors or presidents of those crews and find out how they operate.

Why? When doing so would further alienate the base and not impress the target membership? Like Mrs. @@Eagledad (if I may gather from the way he described her comment to him), some model of the same sex as her on the BSHB cover would not be enough to attract a disenfranchised Girl Scout to us. More importantly, take away the "Boy", and the girls who we might attract will no longer trust the brand. There is an established (all too rapid, IMHO) cycle for rotating in revised handbooks, etc. I don't see that accelerating because of this. More generally, this is not a merger of two organizations or programs. This is opening a gate for some special interests. That alone should give us reason for skepticism. The if-you-give-a-mouse-a-cookie arguments presuppose that we know how many mice want the cookie to be remixed. I think that's a very small number indeed.

We don't need no stinking official sub-group terms! We're subversive enough as it is. Generally, we appoint activity chairs according to the things they want to do. Then groups form around their preferred activity. (So, for example, for a while we had a Philmont Contingent, a Seabase Contingent, and a general interest group.) Lately, it's been rare that we've had membership large enough to subdivide.

You should adopt the policy my hand-held seems to want my thumbs to do: "neg rep" unto others before they "neg rep" unto you. I guess a neg-rep for being of opposite opinion (e.g. the co-ed issue) isn't very cool. That's because in general, we're all trying to iron out our reasons for thinking the way we do, and would rather hear why someone disagrees with us. That prepares us for when some other scout or scouter gets in our face about the same issue. We can actually talk about how some people think without guessing from inside our own echo chamber. But, if I say something that is truly unhelpful. Or maybe too polarizing for someone to kindly write a reply to. I'd like to see the -1. I'd also like to think that I'd be smart enough to tune out somebody with tons of -1s without the help of software.

Facts not in evidence. Are you saying that, by renaming unisex, Cub- and Boy- scouts will not waste millions revamping logo and literature? How's that worked out over the past couple of decades? I would suggest that the boy scouts should not change a stitch of logo if they open to girls, and I'm not just basing this on one Italian exchange student who proudly wore her uniform with its "Boy Scouts Italy". The girls who joined my crew over the years were proud to be members of the BSA. The girls who want to join us want to do so because of who we are and what we offer. Changing logo and literature would represent a level of pandering that would undermine recruitment efforts.

I didn't realize the software would automatically censor someone. I don't mind getting down votes. If it's because someone simply disagrees, that's good to know. If they don't have time to write an opposite opinion, I'd rather see the down vote.

@@ScoutTN, welcome to the forum! I'm pretty picky about uniforming, but I got nothing! I'd go with Stosh's suggestion about the boys in the den picking what works best for them (and their parents who might be teaching them to sew patches -- hint hint ). I am strongly opinionated against badge magic. It can ruin a good shirt for the scout to whom it would be handed down. So there's that, if it helps.

The collapse of GS/USA camps in Western PA leaves us with thousands of girls in search of camps to spend summers in. Someone's gonna be building bathrooms for them. I can see some underutilized BSA camps rotating in a Girl Scout week or two. Some GS troops and districts already use our council's facilities for training weekends. Since we already are collecting coin from folks, seems only fair that we build facilities that work for them. We have hired camp staff who got their start in GS camps. So, there's nothing magic about that transition. Basically, I would advise a council to not lift a finger toward revamped facilities until payments from girls are in hand. Same for the handbook and other literature. No point rewriting unless there is proof that girls aren't buying them. There are plenty more pictures of young women in the new venturing handbook ... Hasn't helped me recruit a one of them. Ultimately at is where the "show me the numbers" comes into play. Membership numbers need to be made on real demand, not political posturing. Thousands of girls buying the handbook regardless of their eligibility for the program would speak volumes to me.

Follow-up ... I wanted to note that the 2013 BSA Lifeguard manual toned down the derogatory rhetoric toward "shiny brass whistles." This year's aquatic staff guide (courtesy of https://www.ncsbsa.org/resources/general_files/Home)says: WHISTLE USE Whistles should be used sparingly ---only when absolutely necessary. The whistle is a communication tool. Discuss with your director the protocols for the use of whistles. So, at least we're saving ink (pixels?) and leaving it to aquatics directors to practice social engineering as they see fit. But, what made me remember this thread? An editor of a prominent journal informed us: It has recently been noted that the phrase "blinded" may not be especially sensitive to individuals with vision difficulties (i.e., "coders were blinded"). Please consider an alternate phrase (e.g., "masked"), if appropriate. Well that's okay. Those double-blind placebo-controlled trials were a pain to run anyway. It will be so much fun if we just hand out masks!

Mash, glad you are still around to talk about it, We can count on racking up some numbers this month thanks to Jambo. Every accident is important and worth noting. Frankly, I wish BSA's annual report would have something about the risks of scouting. We could do better in informing on risks. On the other hand, lacking comparisons to risks of not scouting (e.g., kids fall out of trees often, sometimes far from rescue), it's hard to tell if we're doing much better.

Thanks for introducing this program. I had never heard of it until now. Can it be a song? For a while, our troop had some good singers who practiced all week and at campfire got everyone doing a round of "Buttercup!" All you need is a couple of boys in choir or drama who are natural leaders and a troop who is willing to practice every evening. P.S. - Your a first class scout! Of course you can swim those 100 yards! The question is: will the folks at the aquatics area give you the time an instruction so that you can master the mile swim by the end of the week?

Most SM's aren't going to let any DC push them around. A DC; however, can blacklist MB colleges. It's not hard. "Next Month's Roundtable Topic: MBU's that have failed our scouts." He can certainly talk to the district advancement committee about counselors who've not lived up to their training. On the positive side: he can throw in camporees and events with MB themes like First Aid meets or orienteering races.