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If you follow here very often, you will see my phrase "the concept, not the patch." Usually that's in reference to a first class scout. But it also applies here. If one is upset about how one's SM does something, one is an usurper, not an assistant scoutmaster no matter how much badge magic was used to solder the patch on one's sleeve. So, how many do you really need? All of the helpful ones and none of the others! Who defines what's helpful? The SM. Period. (Hopefully he's listening to the boys while he does this, but that's the point of conferences.) The CC should back the SM on this. Independent patrol outings? Consider with weekends where different patrols have different hike plans, maybe being dropped off at different trail heads, but rendezvous at the same location. The SM/ASM's would shadow the least skilled patrol. Needless to say, this requires some readiness evaluations on the SM's part. The rendezvous should have ample space for patrols to set up camp at some distance from one another.

Depends on the troop. I prefer that ASM have no roles, but rather are available at different times to coach a variety of activities. The SM and one other dad are aces with guns. I'm all about land navigation (comes from getting lost a lot) and aquatics. Others are good mechanics. As boys get to know us and become leaders they learn who to call on to set up an activity. This may include, at times, helping a QM manage an influx of gear, but not being an uber-QM.

It really depends on your flexibility. 40 boys = 5 patrols. If there was a weekend where each patrol wanted to overnight in a different location, you would need two adult chaperons for each. 2 x 5 =10 adult leaders. Ten ASMs gives you that level of flexibility all the time. If you have dads who complete training (including IOLS) that's half that equation. The other half is the first word on the patch. If they are actually assisting you instead of running their own little fiefdom, it's great. If not, they need to find their own CO and start their own troop. Or ... if they really want a job, have them team up with a mom or two recruit some sisters and girlfriends and start a BSA4G troop next year.

Based on where they it appears on the list on Bryan's blog post, I take bottle rocket in that context to mean fireworks for which one would use a bottle as a launch "pad." I think we all can agree that large groups of scouts igniting such combustion propellants is fraught with risk. Not so cub-scout bottle rockets - as in rockets made of plastic soda bottles -- with the typical pressure relief that a home water system with duct-taped stays would have, and the correspondingly low mass of the returning lofted projectile. IMHO, stomp rockets are more fun for the boys. However, the challenge of building and launching model rockets (with the proper solid-fuel engines) is very rewarding. I did it when I was a cub, and made sure my kids gave it a try when they were Webelos age. As for as I know, these continue to be approved activities when following manufacturer guidlines and common sense as outlined on the oft-ignored page 1 of the Guide to Safe Scouting . Per my rule #1 (Never ask for a rule, or someone will fabricate one for you, and you'll eventually regret it.) I've never asked about more than what BSA has published under the G2SS pages, and although we may disagree about what should be in or out, this is one instance where they keep your hands from being tied.

Because the line would end with "... you could serve a troop, master those skills, and be awarded that next rank." I'm not picking on @Eagledad in particular. I'm just using a quote that he used to make to help us find a way forward for someone who feels "pushed to the side," so to speak. I've seen more scouts and scouters encouraged rather than discouraged by enthusiastic female youth. We don't want to spend so much time on negatives (be they hypothetical or real) from an emptied cup that we miss a deep drink from a well of positives!

If only I had a dollar for every time a man said to me "I only made it to (insert rank here). Now I wish I earned Eagle." No, scratch that. If only I were permitted to reply, "Hey, if you are are serious ... Have I got an opportunity for you! For the low low price of just one hour a week ..." As far as @Eagledad is concerned, we need one, just one, 11 year old in a BSA4G troop to run up to him and say, "I love this scouting stuff."

Important data point: when you visited each troop, in which one(s) did the SPL come and introduce himself to you the parent? Second important point: which troop are your son's friends interested in going to? Third inportant point: when you went camping with each troop, which one had boys who smiled the most, sang the loudest, and were the most cheerful and friendly? These rise to the top. I agree with @ItsBrian, distance matters. Well, commute time matters. In some parts, roads are straight, limits are high, folks think little of such drives. Post modern nomadism actually encourages life in metal rolling projectiles. I find health in bucking that trend. Making friends with such a troop, however - even if you don't join it, may provide a provisional summer camp opportunity with familiar scouts.

On e list should be: Learn great ideas from other units. Invites on outings to fill every weekend. Take the spouse out on fundraiser dinners and B&Gs. No need to waste time figuring out what to do with that one hour a week.

Unless, we are adding grains that should have never been taken off!

@Pselb, membership decline isn't the problem, it's a symptom. It is the effect of policies and procedures, culture, and economy. As individual scouters, we can manage some of those things more than others. But, by reading about each other and sharing what we learn with others (at multiple levels of responsibility, from the troop librarian to the chief scout executive) we hope to help everyone. So, don't expect a consensus statement from these forums. Do expect what you have to say to be taken seriously. BTW, as a kid, I was all about bugs (and building a computer- 4 bit processor- manual switches). Sounds like your son's on he right track.

We do ask around about those "some nobodies" be they boyfriends, girlfriends, etc ... One divorced mom was especially grateful that we did. Another dad had to carefully explain to us how an ex who was not in the picture suddenly was. We also are painfully aware that sometimes a bio-parent can make a kid's scouting career impossible. So your bf may be singled out, but in the grand scheme of things he's not alone.

I dunno, I was able to improve a friend's opinion after a he reposted the first story on his FB page. As much as someone would like to believe that BSA is a heartless beurarcracy, they are more willing to believe ambulance chasers will make a media stink if they see themselves losing in civil court. Tell your friends "Utah Law Firm Preys on Downs Syndrome Scout and His Family"

If you're certain of that, then you should let the COR that you'll move on and will encourage your boys to do so. It's no hard feelings. You two have very different leadership styles and you'll only aggravate him if he's SM. This ain't congress. What to move to? Well, see if someone wants to have a crack at a linked BSA4G troop. When life throws you sass, sip sarsaparilla.

Yep, "bigoted" has a diluted meaning these days. In my part of town they will toss racial and sexist slurs willy-nilly, but if someone is doing you harm, they will stand by your side defending your piece of turf tooth and nail. The phrase "after all, we're North Side" is fairly common. Our minorities have heard sweeter and lost more to folks with astute tongues. The GS/USA definitely has biased expectations, but I wouldn't call their non-inclusive language bigoted. After all what's good for the goose ... makes a gander pretty happy.

My take: this is no snafu. The system worked surprisingly according to plan -- for the attorneys . By their own words the family's lawyers intentionally exaggerated the impact of rejection of the boy's project by using the phrase "effectively nullified" regarding already earned awards. The fact was: the project proposal was rejected. That's all. The attorneys knew darn well that they had no standing. So, their best strategy - in the interest of the firm - would be to make it sound like BSA rescinded awards. Then once the normal procedures transpired, it would make them look like they got them back for the boy. Media circus success. I hope the parents refuse to pay that firm one thin dime.

Oh, that sounds very new. Although it may have been there since Venturing. (However, flexible web surveys are so this century, that I doubt it.) To GS/USA's credit, they have made efforts to poll members and former members with fairly open-ended and timely surveys.

Good luck fixing stupid.

@Eagle1993, I'm afraid you are reading what I describe through rose-colored glasses, just like the scouts from Eastern-block whose parents saw their situation through mud-colored glasses! The reason the youth have to step up is because the adults, raised under communism, were beat down. Except for the oldest of SMs, they had no concept of volunteering time in youth programs. Secondly, most schools anywhere else could not afford the facilities to offer the panoply of sports and activities that ours do. Your 16 year-old counterpart in another country would not have the options (distractions?) you describe. Our crew's biggest hit? When the school installed a climbing wall! Suddenly, one didn't have to take the better part of a Saturday on a Cope course ... plus nobody was asking you to tie your own figure eight on a bight!

From my notes talking with scouts from multiple WOSM organizations: older scouts don't leave because they have to deal with 11 y/o's and younger. It's quite the opposite. They stay because the younger scouts need someone to run the program, and adults are not stepping up there to get in their way. Note that for some scout associations, there are nowhere near enough adults. (I bet in some countries that's even worse given the refugee crises around the globe.) The scoutmaster is one for hundreds of youth from the ages we call cubs through venturing. So, giving older youth responsibility over a den of cubs is essential. A teen boy and girl team up to lead the youngest grade for several consecutive years, and they are mentored by their SM in the process. In the summer half of older part of the troop is the advance team setting up summer camp, half is the clean-up team taking it down, and they have a week overlap where they run the cub's resident program. Think about it. Need a scoutmaster conference? You'd better be tending some young ones some way. To replicate that here in the USA would require breaking a bunch of cultural norms! Like I said before, I've only been able to talk to rotary exchanges, college students, and professionals who were scouts in their respective countries ... I'm not sure what it's like for the scout with less ambitious career goals. Anyone who wants to me to explore this subject in detail is welcome to underwrite an expedition for me to visit units in other countries.

I find this hard to believe. In my mind, an exciting Pack program is as easy as a cheer, a skit, a song, and as few announcements as possible. But perhaps there's more to it. So what's the "this" in do this and it will be fun?

@FireStone, I've seen so many takes on stars and compass logos that I don't know what's modern, post-modern, or steampunk! What your side-by-side comparison shows is that 1) the star symbol was removed and replaced with a compass rose and 2) instead of the slanted, advancing feel of the compass ellipse, we have the more traditional circle. To me it feels like the difference between running an orienteering course and sifting through historic maps. So I see a "space age" type icon on the left and a "old cartographic" icon on the right, and read the dissonance a marketing guy trying to apply "dated" and "fresh" opposite of my brain. This may be a case of toe-may-toe v. toe-mah-toe. But it seems like a top-down decision. @fred johnson, thanks for explaining the state motto. I had no clue! If they would have named the council L'Etoile du Nord, I might have made the association. But then I guess that's what makes me an outsider!

When I hear Northern Star, I always think Alaska. So, there is no level of branding that I think will clean up that mess. Headwater, Whooping Crane, Thousand Lakes, Bread-Basket-When-Thawed, would have captured the location. Clearly, their board wants the Minnesotan-on-the-street to think of something else. I think Laurel Highlands Council really nailed it after Greater Pittsburgh and Penn's Woods councils merged by soliciting names from its membership then having a vote on the favorites, followed by an art contest and another vote for the council patch. Our logo is the BSA's with the council name beneath it. Even when Potomac council had to merge with us, the name fit. (The only change: "Pennsylvania" was dropped from the council patch.) So, you all might not know where we come from by looking at our shoulder, but we do. Yesterday, guests from upstate New York were talking about how they were wowed by the rhododendron at Falling Water. I encouraged them to come back in June. (Note to self: have council patches ready to give the next time they visit!) If mergers can't be pretty, they should at least be fun.

My guess is that this is a bit of "tail trying to wag the dog." The last scentence of the introduction uses marketing mind tricks like "bit dated" and "fresh look" without identifying who disliked the old logo and who was calling for a new one. Then the justification for dropping "BSA" from their url and not adding "scouting" to it is convoluted. There is no suggestion that they worked with a focus group of anyone except the folks in their boardroom. To be fair, my use of BSA4G is definitely a case of tail wagging dog. But, it's one that can be justified in one scentence.

I think you made yourself clear. Going off going off topic is par for the course with this lot. Bottom line: this is definitely one of those things I'd ask another parent to help you attend to in exchange for helping attend to her daughter's pet foible. In the long run, that's the best part of scouting: when you can call on other adults to serve as your second voice / sounding board. Hope you find a friend who can ride you where you need. Fords are the brunt of many cruel jokes from half my scouts. (The other half defend their Fords' honor fiercely.)

The SE would also like to be informed if any council employees are treating costomers badly.