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Welcome to the forums @Scout745! No it's not too late! But hurry up and apply! I can only speak for my contingent (NER4). There are just a few open slots left. http://wsj2019.us/apply/

This question is begged by @ianwilkins comment in Cub Scouts: Links to pictures are welcome ... as is speculation about when what started to appear where. Those who don't wear neckers? Well, I think we've heard your gripes elsewhere, but if you're feeling left out, please do type!

One more thought about Primus Classic (noticed while I was showing Mrs. Q how neatly it disassembled for cleaning -- the things we do to distract from Thanksgiving preparations): its stainless steel under-shield is reflective. I wouldn't necessarily pop the shield off its assembly for routine grooming, but it would make a great signal mirror in a pinch. On the other hand, taking a cue from @DuctTape's comment about fires from natural material, you may want to consider carrying a couple of spare signal mirrors to assemble into reflectors that channel air, focus heat, and support your pot.💡

Probably ... my reference is to Irving's "Rip Van-Winkle" ... the key feature being playing it in someplace carpeted with leaves with the valley wall as a backdrop.

Please, someone in the Hudson valley, send @ianwilkins an image of scouts playing a round of nine pins in the woods with the SM's sleeping on aging camp chairs in the background!

Of course, I review the weather two days before inserting into wilderness - especially with first-year scouts. There's a big difference, however, between making a no-go decision in the face maniacal gale-force winds and only "going out in the sunny days". The worst thing rain might do is inspire me to wrap my pack in a second tarp and change where I cross the creek. If I'm carrying a shelter any distance on a day certain to be sunny and night certain to be clear, it ain't gonna be a tent. I need to offset the weight of a backpacking telescope that would be perfect for clear nights on some meadow far from electric lights. I'm not even setting up the hammock unless there are two sawed off stumps at the right height. (Branches block stars.) A ground cloth and maybe mosquito netting beside the scope will do.

Now you're making me miss the Italian exchange student who was in our crew the year before last. She would say "I am not a Girl Scout. I am a scout!"

The SM is making that decision based on whatever is rattling around in his own head. ...The most the SM should do is say something like, "Boys, we got four patrols of 2-4 members. Have fun with that until you decide it would be more fun to temporarily reconfigure. Send someone to report to me any new way you decide to configure for the weekend." Nowadays, that's swimming against culture and bucking that attitude is tough (c.f. my other stories about Son #1's besties being assigned different patrols, or Son #2's fellow scouts outright bucking being divided). The only way I've come close to success is carving out my crew, pushing scouts to operate independently in that context, then in joint troop/crew maneuvers putting my foot down with the other adults and saying "Welcome to my house, now grab a coffee and read a book while your SPL behaves like one of my crew VPs." We are actually coming close to that with the troop's current PLC. Maybe it's because the crew's no longer there as a crutch, but I don't think so. I think we have a committee who "gets it" better than others have. Here are some examples of what makes PoR's different than jobs: In my troop growing up, the sole QM was a practical thing. The scout-house had one good place for storing canvas (i.e., the root cellar). So, PLs and APLs checked their gear in and out with him. If you turned in sloppy gear, he'd store it as long as it would fit according to whatever scheme he had, and he'd be sure you'd get the same gear next time. The nice QMs were the ones who'd chew your ear off and throw the gear back at you if it had one crease out of line. (That way you'd know what kind of gear you'd get next month.) Each patrol's room needed space for other important equipment (i.e., pool table, even larger air hockey table, ping-pong table, ...). The QM, by doing his job, made sure that our gear was safely stowed, thereby making room for us to have really fun round-robin tournaments. Same applied to the Librarian. For a while, I was "that guy" who yelled you up one side and down the other for turning in beat up pamphlets and old BL editions. But, the patrols knew exactly where to find those needed references to teach scout skills. (Remember: any teaching method that doesn't have "reference" as a key step is poppycock.) They were neatly tucked in shelves behind the air-hockey table ... alphabetical by year.

This is where we part ways. The troop's QM in this context is to get account for the troop gear used by 64 scouts. He may need one assistant, he doesn't need 8. Or rather, he already has 16 assistants: they are the PL's and APL's. The patrol QM is only ever responsible for the gear used by 8 boys, max. That's not a lot of responsibility, especially if the PL and APL are decent chaps and keep everyone well-ordered. Personally, I would only have a PL call his guy a QM if the mess kit is exceptionally shiny, all loose guy lines are in perfect chain knots, and the dining fly drains flawlessly. Even so, the scout is worthy of the title ... but not a patch. The real cost to over-delegating is a PL stuck with 7 boys who chant "that's not my job" when the correct answer is "Sir, you say jump, I say how high, sir!" The pinnacle scouting experience is hiking and camping independently with your mates. The best mates are cross-trained for the set of jobs that makes independent hiking and camping feasible.

Pushback from the peanut gallery ... I certainly didn't have "a job" in my patrol. Each of us had lots of jobs. The guy who signed out the mess kit and tents from the troop QM never got labeled "patrol QM". With 8 guys, you knew who was absent or present and who said what, so we didn't need a scribe. Anyone could carve the victories on the patrol flag pole, and when they did, we didn't call them "historian." If you were the first in the patrol room and swept out any spiders, nobody called you "webmaster." We had a bunch of jobs: check out gear from the QM, make sure your flag reflected your victories, pay attention to the plan, clean your patrol room, touch base with the guys who couldn't make it to a meeting, raid mom's cupboard for the food you needed, make captions for the Polaroids on the poster boards ... There's lots of jobs to do. And most have to be done every camp out. So, somebody has to commit to doing those jobs. The PL could commit each scout to doing the same job for a few months, or each month, the PL could ask who's doing what each time. Now, if he has a kid who is really good at doing one of those jobs, he might make him the patrol cook, QM, pole-carver, photo-journalist, pyro-technician, or whatever ... and brag about him so that the SPL will know that he's capable of filling a troop PoR. Or not. His patrol, his call. The more responsibility given to the PL, the better.

I must point out that Ferry Electric Service advertised in the article is no longer in business. However, at that address is now a very fine coffee shop, which has been under two proprietorships. The first proprietor was a GS leader, and I had the privilege of being at the town council meeting where she explained her request for a zoning adjustment. Also at that meeting was a former scout who was considering running for town council as he was soon to turn 18. She opened her shop on election day, and he won his seat. The second -- and current -- owner, Son #2 impertinently nicknamed "My boy, Andy". {Note to moderators: see, I am staying on topic.} I aggressively tried to recruit one of his daughters into my crew, but didn't stand a chance because her troop's leader was outstanding in giving the girls as much adventure as their moms could tolerate. That, and the shop is a really well run family business which demanded many of her weekends. Anyway, if you are passing through, PM me, and I can give you the specifics and send you Andy's way.

Scout BSA does not equal Scouts BSA, although it may set precedent that the BSA has been using trade names without "Boy" for decades. However, as we found with "Scouting/USA"; while you guys were each proudly a Scout BSA, there were probably behind-the-scenes protests (possibly even threats of law suit?) by GS/USA.

The reverse happened to Son #1. His buddies were in different patrols, and they convinced him to join the Volleyball team one year and the Football team the next. The only way this problem is solved is if adults believe in tight personal relationships and encourage boys to form gangs along those lines. The cultural reality: parents dread such gangs.

One of my better memories with my crew was of a couple of the girl scouts cross-legged around the campfire at a freshwater beach singing all of they camp songs they ever knew. The first thought in my head was, "They make a tight patrol." Why did BSA take the "emotion work" out of their patrol description? I think it's because postmodern nomadic youth who try to stick together on the basis of sheer friendship face the turbulence of diverse activities and interests that leave only very narrow windows of time for just the 8 of them. I call it the "stadium light effect". My high school football field did not have lights. Football games started at 2 and ended by 5 or 6. (Yes, the band, cheerleaders, and the football team left class early, promising to make up homework on Monday.) That meant you could stash your stuff and be at the back of Rick or Dave's farm by 8pm for a two night camp out. The trade-off was missing the occasional school dance. (A sacrifice my parents were relieved to see me make ... after years of my older siblings' shenanigans. ) Or, muster bright and early Saturday morning at 7 or 8 to caravan to camp. Five years later, the lights got installed ... and there went that patrol's extra day/night during the week. Football (and sometimes soccer) games might end at 10 PM, and getting scout to a gathering point before 9AM the next day is a hardship. So, instead, we are asked to train youth to be administrative units. Either they are parts of the Friday Night Lights menagerie or they are convenient ways to be divided and conquered by adults. The vision of hiking and camping independently with your mates is summarily suppressed. I would love to hear if any of you succeed in having your scouts take up the challenge of stowing their packs in their locker/band room, grabbing them after the game and night-hiking a mile or two into some back-nine camp spot for the evening, so that they are on-site and ready to go the next day. That is how patrols become best buddies.

I guess, I would never expect any of that money to reach the family itself. I would expect the council to use the gift to do some good in the girls' honor. Around here, if want to support the family, we take our gift straight to them in cash or food or whatever. Or, we would call the funeral home and ask where donations could be made to defray burial costs. Or, we talk to the deacons of the family's church.

When our troop dealt with a tragedy like this ... In the days following, we locked out the media. The family directed the newspaper reporter to me -- and I made no mention of finances, and the pastor ran interference at the funeral. We did not want our youth to have to face cameras at such a vulnerable time. 1. We quickly identified a way to donate to the council on behalf of the family for camperships in the deceased name. We made that pathway known to scouters. I believe it was also in the obituary. 2. Funds for funeral expenses and other memorials went directly to the family. Around here, we have shared enough sorrow that we all know to do this without "big brother" catching wind of it. 3. Later, the family developed a scholarship fund to honor the deceased, and all of our social media efforts directed folks to that fund. Needless to say, I am not a big fan of GoFundMe pages. I certainly would not want to put the troop in the position of collecting money for this sort of thing. If one doesn't form a unified front in a hurry, this kind of drama distracts from properly honoring the scouts who were lost.

I think I remember you telling us about this one. This might be just me after dealing with too many adults who disrespect boys on account of their leaders, but ... If the board is upset at an SM, then they should take it out on the SM. They can apologize to the scout, have him leave the room, then tell the SM that they will have a hard time believing future Eagle applications from his troop if he white-washes his recommendation of them. Then they bring the scout back in, admit that they weren't prepared to discuss this very important aspect of his character with him, and ask his permission to reconvene in a week or two. Be plainspoken. Admit that this is the first time you all recall a BoR dealing with something like this, so it's better to have them think seriously, get advise from other senior scouters, and come back prepared to have a constructive review. I have no idea how much clout a district rep. has to suspend an EBoR on the spot. But this is might be the right time to do so.

I'm speaking from the school of hard knocks: Discuss with your committee chair ... possibly even the committee if other scouts have been harmed or put at risk as a result of the scout's deception. Determine if a suspension is in order, and for how long. (It could be a week, it could be 20 weeks.) Meet with the scout and his parent, and make clear that the troop cannot function if any scout cannot be trusted. Let the scout know that he is suspended for whatever time was recommended by the committee. Have the SPL give his position of responsibility (if he holds one) to another scout. Tell the scout to use that time to determine if he is willing to be trustworthy. If so, he may give you a call and ask to rejoin the troop after he's "done his time." Welcome him back and let him know that when he thinks he's demonstrated scout-like behavior for a few weeks he may ask the SPL for a new PoR. Act quickly and courteously to keep the troop rolling along.

@DanTheMan, welcome! We love the younger voices on this forum. If your leaders are doing anything well, tell us about it either by replying to a relevant topic or creating a topic of your own. We take our inspiration from anyone, anywhere! Pro tip: life is not all internet, so pull yourself away from that screen and knock out some badge work. Then you'll have some real stories to tell!

That's basically my role as a more seasoned ASM. In fact sometimes I bring along an extra hammock so that the SM/SPL can be properly couched!

It's a big country. The guy who moves in as dad-in-residence without rushing through a ceremony ... In some parts, he's a hero. In other parts, he's a fool. (Or, maybe she is.) It's not so much the CO's affiliation that matters, but the scout's. If the scout discussed his options with his religious leaders and his and her family, and they all agreed that this was the best course of action, then props to the scout. If the scout said that he was disregarding his religion and what the families have asked, then maybe he's not Eagle material. Even then, this is a "time will tell" situation. But, because of that ageist 18-year-old deadline, folks are short-changed of the time they need for a good decision. The better move might have been to say, "Spend a couple years to sort out the right thing to do in this situation, then come back for your BoR. If you need some support, we have an SM who has helped other guys navigate these choppy waters, and could use some help at meetings."

To be clear, I wasn't talking about HA (although the backpacking example for 11-13 year olds might be considered such). An amusing example was when we had a crew officer's meeting and concluded that it would be fun to have a self-defense trainer come in. I gave the VP of Program the contact info for a guy who volunteered with us a few years previously and suggested that she invite him to the next meeting. She was expecting it to be another planning session. Instead he showed up with all of his gear and had the youth practicing kicks, throws, and escapes within the hour! Multiply this by every activity, including how supper gets cooked, etc ... and you can see little differences in leadership style that fell along the lines of which organization the venturer had spent his/her junior high years with. There were positives in both, and it was fun watching the scouts learn from each other. The youth who did not have time in either organization had it the toughest ... mainly because they didn't recognize when they were actually leading. For example, you might lose in making a decision and feel like you were wasting everyone's time while rain started coming down, but the evening before, you did take time to have tea with the new kid ... and have no idea how important that was at the time. The trained scouts had a sense that both of those activities were just part of the leadership process (and that getting full experience of hiking and camping with loved-by-weather-me was inevitable). Oh it matters. The young engineers were around table this weekend and they already have pretty well-formed critiques of their employers' (and potential employers') leadership styles. From what I gathered, superficial attempts at interpersonal style are already red flags to them.

@Treflienne I agree that it's not a very tight thesis. And, as we know, her conclusion is not universally accepted among progressive women. There are some who prefer to develop more directive leadership as a path to equality as opposed to more interpersonal leadership (my terms, not the author's). They see GS/USA's "progress" as more akin to "deviation." So, rather than BSA aligning to GS/USA, they wished that GS/USA would be more like BSA, have been asking for that for many years, and are now voting with their feet. As to the handbooks promoting different leadership styles, I have seen this play out on several occasions. Venturers coming from the GS/USA are invested in "emotion work", and they are sometimes surprised at how quickly good things can get done when they are more directive. Those coming from BSA or elsewhere, sometimes could stand to do a little "emotion work." Certainly, as I train boys in backpacking, the natural leaders need a lot of work learning how to pay attention to the needs of the patrol (e.g., load balancing, making sure everyone's had breakfast before moving out, etc ...).

@PACAN, they are backpedaling. They are re-writing the minutes to say the board suspended and reconvened, closing its discussion on a different date. I would not be surprised if the District Advancement Chair does apologize in person. Hopefully the scouter who raised a ruckus does too. Make sure the members of the board get invited to the court of honor! Let this water run over the dam!