Peregrinator

Because what they want is the prestige of belonging to the BSA and the opportunity to earn the Eagle Scout award, which they believe will get them special privileges in society.

The BPSA advocates "traditional scouting" but is, as you say, co-ed (not very "traditional" there) and "inclusive." They also accept atheists (their national commissioner is an atheist). I have to say, I wondered whether the BSA policy change was aimed in part toward the BPSA, as it removes one of the things that distinguishes them from the BSA.

A system of belief can have logical implications just as a theoretical system can.

I understand what a theorem is; my B.S. is in mathematics. But thanks for the lesson! I was trying to explain what I meant by "logical implications." The Hawking-Penrose theorems do "check out mathematically" but they are derived from the mathematics of general relativity. An analogy might be the Pythagorean Theorem. PT is true in Euclidean geometry but not in non-Euclidean geometry (in fact, it can be shown to be equivalent to the Fifth Postulate, so where the Fifth Postulate does not hold, neither does the Pythagorean Theorem, and vice versa, but I digress). Likewise, the Hawking-Penrose theorems would not hold in a non-relativistic system.

For example, the Hawking-Penrose theorems are not hypotheses but are a result of general relativity theory. If general relativity is true then so are the Hawking-Penrose theorems.

Geocentrism, age of the earth, etc. But experiments are not the only critical examination that one might apply to hypotheses. For example, one might consider the logical implications of those hypotheses. And even in science one sees beliefs that get in the way of critical examinatoin, e.g., Eddington's rejection of black holes.

Why do you think they haven't?

You keep reading stuff into my responses that isn't there.

By paying attention to people who are experts in the language, but who don't have an axe to grind and so disagree with the experts to whom you pay attention.

At least they aspire to be scouting, however. Troops of St. George do not have that aspiration. (And again, I am not saying that to be insulting.)

Then how can you determine what the original meaning is?

So I can't use English to determine what an English translation of the 10 Commandments means? Since you're a Hebrew scholar would you mind giving a more literal translation of the 10 Commandments?

So a statement like the following implies that children are property? "Do not attack my children or my property." Or are you saying that if women weren't property, it would be OK to covet them?

Whatever one's fellow human beings believe at that point in time, as long as their beliefs also align with one's own.

What a weird statement.

Well, a scouting program starts with the Promise and the Law, right? And if either of those things is absent, we can tell right away that a particular program isn't scouting. Assuming they're both present, we can move on to things like the four aims, the patrol method, etc.

I explicitly said there was nothing wrong with a father-son camping program. I pointed out that it isn't scouting. It's not, as far as I know, an insult to say that something isn't scouting. The reason for pointing out the non-scouting nature of Troops of St. George is because this is a scouting forum. Sure, there are probably better things one could do with one's time than sit through a merit badge class. That's a reason to get rid of merit badge classes, not to get rid of scouting entirely in favor of family camping.

No, I don't think that calling an activity "scouting" makes it good, I think that scouting is good. And (if we're going to play the Catholic card) I can cite plenty of statements from multiple Popes to that effect.

Oh, there's no "could be" about it. They explicitly describe themselves as a father-son outdoors apostolate. Of course there is nothing wrong with that, but it isn't scouting. How can a boy learn to lead if dad is always around (and being Dad rather than being a scout leader)? And, of course, the model excludes sons of single women, whose need for male role models is probably greater than most, as well as men without sons who might otherwise be good mentors.

I think just about anyone could have seen that the proposal wouldn't work. What he proposed was establishing a separate association for Catholics that would license the program from the BSA.

Or the oral traditions passed down from generation to generation among the Hebrews were similar the the Code of Hammurabi. Abraham was born in Ur so he undoubtedly had knowledge of whatever legal code preceded the Code of Hammurabi. I don't find the documentary hypothesis convincing in the least so the notion that Leviticus was not written down until just a few centuries before Christ is silly.

It was one guy with a proposal, nothing more.

Code of Hammurabai - 1754 B.C. Leviticus - 1500 B.C. That's not a couple of thousand years let alone a couple of thousand centuries. Hope this helps

It's father-son camping, not scouting.

Apologies for the thread necromancy. I happened to check this web site today and it is now redirecting to the Trail Life homepage.