packsaddle

I too have never considered tipping at a scout camp and I personally would discourage it. I have, however, anonymously left considerably good food items for the general staff from time to time. Much appreciated too! Food is GOOD, you know. Perhaps I've mentioned that before.

Just a general comment - after all, you know your son better than any of us. Don't forget about the fun. If he has fun doing the advancement stuff, that's great. If he loves the merit badges, that's great. At age 10 there's plenty of time for everything, don't worry, be happy. Enjoy watching your son explore and learn. Take a moment to record for your memory the twinkle in his eyes, the smudges on his face, his laughter and his frustrations. You'll be glad you did.

Both ideas sound great. The first one seems to provide a greater general benefit to the patrons, though. The periscope design will involve optical surfaces precisely mounted in a weatherproof housing. This apparatus must then be mounted to existing hardware. I assume the zoo has been approached with both the designs for their approval? Personally, I see more troop (boy) involvement with the first idea.

nldscout, I think your message is confusing. On one hand you advise for him to butt out. Then you concede that it is OK to proceed if he can establish wrongdoing. I submit that in order for him to establish anything, he will have to risk 'stirring up bad feelings'. Do you see the bind here? In his original post, he said clearly that the boy violated council procedure. That alone justifies a conversation with the DAC. And it is clear that final approvals have not yet been signed on the forms - there is plenty of time to address all this. I would agree with you that apparently Mark has already approached the boy about this issue and may not likely improve the situation with a repeat. However, I believe that Mark is within his responsibilities to confirm a few things with the DAC. Then the DAC can take the matter from there. Mark, As for the parents, I make sure my parents know, from Tenderfoot on, that progress and advancement is primarily the responsiblity of the boy. Parents can be interested and can help as much as needed but the boy must do the work and request such things as conferences, approvals for MBs, etc. Parents can provide all the encouragement they want but the boy is finally responsible. Especially for Eagle. It has worked well so far, actually most parents seem relieved. Some of the boys, too.

Laura, I think my fascination with sewing began while watching my mother use her treadle-powered Singer. It wasn't so much the sewing as it was..how did that thing work? And the button-hole attachment just about sent me over the edge (I wish we still had that machine). Now one just touches an icon on an LCD screen and a robot does it all for you...not much difference at all, I still don't know how it works. In the future I look forward to the spare time to finely hone my modest skills. Embroidery anyone?

Yeah, the nature stuff. Before I refresh my memory on those requirements, I'll mention that this badge can always be livened by including non-required information on stuff that is 'gross', having to do with eating (who eats whom), reproduction (have to be a bit careful), and elimination of waste (a perennial favorite of the scouts). Dissection of an owl pellet instructs on many levels, for example. Also mating behaviors, what's really poisonous (please mention that daddy-longlegs are not spiders, not poisonous, have no fangs, etc.). Try not to forget that plants are also organisms and some are really interesting (like the ones that produce animal smell chemicals and attract pollinators just so). This one is really fun. Later

OK, either try manually typing in the URL...or...start just with www.meritbadge.com and then work your way to the proper location. The system we're in right now sometimes gimps the links, or seems to.

Well-l-l-l, 40 years ago the program I experienced WAS closer to what you just described. I wonder if that council still has it. I agree with you about the limitations of group badges as well.

OK, who has proprietorship over BSA? Where can I see the list of their name(s)? If any of us can be kicked out for any or no reason, who ultimately owns the organization? Who is the last kicker?

Welcome to the forum. There is a resource on the internet at the url: http://www.meritbadge.com/files/mb-docs/Weather.doc I view this resource as a great place to begin for the boys and the counselors. But the merit badge pamphlet is just as good. Plus you can carry it around camp with you. Plus it contains more information. And although the worksheet on the internet provides all the appropriate blanks, it is up to the counselor to make sure the boys understand and complete the requirements. One way to make this more interesting is to reproduce the water cycle for them. You can do this using a pot of boiling water and a cool condensing surface (bottom of another pot with cool water or ice in it) that allows the condensed steam to 'rain' onto a container of soil. Then they experiment on ways to 'pollute' the steam that you are condensing. Spray some seltzer (carbonic acid) or some vinegar (acetic acid) into the steam to create acid rain. Or blow some dust into it, believe me they'll think of some odd options. Making the vane, anemometer, etc., should be fun and fairly easy. If you have a powerful vacuum cleaner that has a 'blow' end, you can chisel an ice cube sort of spherical and show them formation of hail in reverse, suspending it in the blown air (the same way you've seen ping pong balls suspended above blowers) and watching it melt in mid-air. If you have access to shaved ice you can use this (packing it into various sized 'hail stones') to experiment on how big hail can get with that velocity of flow.

After reading the posts here, I realize that I was a lucky scout as a boy, to have the well-organized MB program that our district had. It is disheartening to learn that many decades later, so many areas of the country (including mine) are in such bad shape. The issue of MBs from camp are a perennial problem. When I catch my boys signing on to certain badges at camp because "we can get this one really easy here", I remind them to make sure their motives are in line with scout spirit. A few sneak through anyway. I do wish, though, that the camps would take the MB program more seriously.

"You can quibble over the details..." Well said, Mark!

Mark, this one tastes worse as time and details go by. Questions are forming with regard to intent by parents. The DAC does need to know that he approved the project post facto and the question of the disposition of the kits needs to be resolved...all before the BOR. It is my understanding that once the application is signed by all the appropriate authorities, national is unlikely to raise additional questions. This needs to be resolved by the DAC/council and addressed either prior to or during the BOR.

Leonus, welcome. Just a fine point but if it really is, "here goes nothing", wouldn't that be, you know, WITHOUT clothing? Intriguing suggestion though, I wonder if BSA has some prudish objection to nude camping? I can hear it now, "Please pass the bug spray, with lots of sunscreen on the side" (and front, and back, and top, and everexpanding bottom).

It is my understanding also, that this would be a matter for the DAC and the council. When one of our boys achieves Life, I give him the project workbook and with his parents present, I explicitly tell him that he must have prior approval before he begins. We've never had a problem.

Pocketknife, Hat. What's a nose flute?

10-4 and thanks, Ed, for the reminder. But believe me, my eye offers equal skepticism for ALL sources. One thing, though, as I examine the UUA, my sense is that they are not strictly anti-BSA. UUA promotes tolerance and they perceive BSA as discriminatory and intolerant. But it is BSA that has rejected UUA for the most part. littlebillie, I like that twist on the issue. You're right, it should cut in all directions. Come to think of it, of all the presidents in my lifetime, only Harry Truman, Gerald Ford, Jimmie Carter, and Ronald Reagan would likely stand the test - and I could be wrong about them. H'mm, Jimmie admitted lust for other women, and Ronnie was divorced (you never know about that extra-marital thing). Harry and Gerry might be the only ones. Yep, they're the Boy Scouts!

OGE, Your last post confused me because I honestly didn't know who Alecia Moore was. So I tried a google search....thanks, that should do it!

Merlyn, Those are eye-opening links! I had known about some of that history but I didn't know it was collected into one place. Thanks.

You guys can talk all you want about elephants and flamingos but I can't shake that thing about Bob White standing naked in the corner. No matter what color you paint him, it's just not the image I wanted to start my day. Thanks a whole lot, dsteele!

Bob White, I, for one, think it is good for you to champion tolerance. I never saw anything that stated or led me to believe that scouting is or should be intolerant. I wish tolerance was embraced, in practice, by all scouters.

evmori, "Keep in mind that the main purpose of the merit badge program is to introduce scouts to areas of interest that could become a career or life long hobby." Quote from BW, were you replying to him or to me? Anyway, I thought it sounded good. I think we get the spirit of this, I was trying to be inclusive. Am I wrong?

MarkNoel, questioning, welcome to the forum. Soon, if not already, you will have confirmed that this issue is one that polarizes people from all walks of life. The basics have been hashed and rehashed here and it is unlikely that, aside from venting spleens (and Im as guilty as the next guy), anyones opinion will be changed. I sympathize with your views and I see a weakness in BSAs approach to all this. While I doubt that anywhere is there an actual written POLICY (Bob White) advising gays to stay in the closet, it is clear that such a policy is implicit in BSA's actions. BSA seems to preach honesty on one hand, but on the other encourages secrecy lest good leaders be ejected. I view this to be an egregious breach of BSA values. The term I have used in the past is hypocrisy. I am not sure that when one person mentions the concept of a 'value' that I have an identical understanding of that concept. I am not sure that I (or anyone else) can articulate in words just what a 'value' is - as understood in each person's mind. Unless someone can measure values objectively (numerically, for example), those values will vary in their interpretation and in each persons view. And each of us knows that we have the superior view. So welcome, have fun, vent your spleen if needed, but dont let all this cause you to forget why youre in Scouting.(This message has been edited by packsaddle)

I sense that Cooking is not being threatened here so I will jump in. If we were to subject ALL the current MBs to the standards of which Bob reminds us, how many would rise to the occasion? Most of them would. But...for example, Bugling? Dog Care? Fly Fishing? OK, who wouldn't like to spend the rest of their life fly fishing (I'll take a pass on the dog care). I think dsteele and Mark make good points. It may not be the career goal of Bob's dreams but for some of us, sewing (or tailoring) is a pretty fair hobby (and life skill as well). The moms who ask who I engaged to do the neat job of sewing patches on my uniform are impressed with the answer (the dads, some of them, are a little nervous). Whether a particular badge meets the criteria as Bob interprets them, well, that's up to Bob. But the rest of us are able to make equally valid judgements.

le Voyageur, anyone, Maybe you can help me with a question that I've never been able to answer. How is it that brains (as an animal organ) are able to 'tan' a skin? What's the process and why wouldn't another organ (say, the liver) also work? I've always wondered how it was that one organ could have such effect on another. Also, how in the world did anyone discover this in the first place?