packsaddle

My mother once confided to my soon-to-be wife that at times in the past I would disappear for whole summers with no contact, not even telling them where I was, only to send a postcard about the time I was coming back anyway. My wife was horrified/mortified, or some such. I just kept seeing something new in the distance. Now that my children are mostly fledged, I'm seeing those things again.

Check out this old thread topic: http://www.scouter.com/forums/viewThread.asp?threadID=169173#id_169173

I'm as guilty of poking fun using stuff like that as anyone and I never mean it to be hurtful, I'm sure Gold Winger doesn't either. That said, I also understand Vicki's take on this. My circle of friends is extremely varied. I know and enjoy the company of persons who are very sensitive about these things. They sometimes have to forgive me but they do know I mean no harm. I also have women friends (to connect this to Gold Winger) who are bikers and who refer to themselves as the biker chicks. They have embroidered jackets with images of baby chicks wearing helmets and leather jackets. We all think it is hilarious. But Vicki also erred in dismissing my (and GW's) quips as 'claptrap'. The label sort of cut off any likelihood of productive discussion. I did see the humor though. Assuming it was intended to be humorous. I can't speak for GW, but I would gladly engage in a discussion of this topic in a meaningful way. But probably some other time, I'm about to take an extended absence and time is short. Edited part: P.S. I'm married to one of the ultra-sensitive ones, go figure. What the heck was she thinking?(This message has been edited by packsaddle)

Opposite experiences in these parts. DUI/DWI convictions are extremely hard to get and then the punishment is a simple fine, even for multiple infractions. I admit I'm biased...a drunk nearly killed my entire family. BAC 0.35, also loaded with Xanax. Long history of drunkeness and drug abuse, even known to have had previous 'incidents' by the insurance company. My family was on their way to school at 0800. He crossed the centerline and hit them head on. We spent years with attorneys and surgeries and many thousands of dollars on medical stuff. My wife is permanently impaired in her ability to walk. He paid a $200 fine and went on to flight school. Have a nice day.

I try to start each of my lectures with some extraordinary event or fact having to do with the topic (water). This often is historical and sometimes it has to do with a disaster. But when Heston recently died, I showed them a clip of him parting the Red Sea. I tried to communicate how mind-blowing those meager special effects were way back when the movie was first released but I'm afraid that by today's standards, it was mostly a snoozer. Some things just don't stand the test of time. You can spot my home because of my prominent display of the only commandment that matters, "Whatever you say, dear." Your turn, Vicki.

What they said and by they way, Welcome to the Forums! It varies from state-to-state but I know that in some states it is illegal to transport minors in that manner. As a matter of fact in at least one it is potentially a felony - child endangerment. You might brush up on your traffic laws before having that conversation. I once did this while cubmaster years ago: I had a local police officer visit a committee meeting to go over the law enforcement take on transporting minors. It sobered some of the cowboy types and kept me from having to be the bad guy. I even learned a thing or two - you might give it a try.

It's natural and it's ok for him to feel nervous. Heck, everytime I get called to the principal's..oops, I mean Dean's office, I get nervous. And in my position the worst thing that can happen is that I get to do anything I want. But the boy deserves to have his very natural feelings and also to feel the warmth of success once he passes, as I am sure he will. This is one way he can build confidence in himself and in the good intentions of most strangers. And he will want more...advancement, that is. Hopefully, one day he'll be able to confront a wider world with that same confidence.

If I read the question correctly, I can paraphrase it as: what is best for the boy, tough love or some friendly help? You know the boy better than any of us. It's your decision. But from what I've read, you should sit on the BOR and make a positive contribution. Nothing wrong with that.

Oh, now I get it. True confession time....yeah, I am agnostic about just about everything...never absolutely certain about anything. I constantly worry that I am communicating an incorrect idea to students. I stop in my lectures to ask them if I have mispelled words...or to clarify concepts for me. They often seem annoyed. I am a terrible expert witness, qualifying every statement, usually disagreeing with anyone and everyone who think they know something absolutely - not merely to be a pain (ok, it's partly that) but because I really want to understand how they can be so confident. I am insecure about what I think I know, about what everyone else thinks they know, the present, the future...there is no such thing as security - only an illusion and even the illusion is uncertain for me. That's why I like the trail so much. In the human world there is a tantalizing possibility that we can fool ourselves into thinking we can control our lives. In nature such illusions are less available and we can become more as one with it.

Eamonn, It could be worse...you could be replaying some song like 'Waltzing Matilda' about a million times in your head. At least that's what's happening to me now that I mentioned it. But I adapted that line from Woody Allen in the movie Stardust Memories in which he announced that pigeons are rats with wings (he was right about that, too!). After the second season of deer completely destroying my 1) deer fence, 2) my electric fence, and 3) my garden (not to mention every Hosta and most blueberries for the entire community), I've grown kind of negative toward them. And if I ever spot a coyote with one of my eggplants in his mouth, I'll feel the same way toward them.

Oh I think Kudu's remark was more a kind of very wry humor that I appreciate so much. Besides, it could be worse. Why...my wife often confides to her friends that only occasionally is she willing to admit to strangers that we're married.

"Pack, is it time for an intervention?" If it involves a beautiful woman with stilleto heels, heck yeah!:)

What? Huh?

Is Pennsylvania over...is it safe to uncover my eyes and ears yet?

I haven't heard of this either but I'll sure look for it on campus now. If the idea is to stop the negative stuff, and I think I read it the same way Trevorum does, I support it. Coincidentally, my students were having a discussion about me today and they mentioned that they didn't expect me to have any fashion sense. I asked why, feigning indignance. They noted that they would have thought I was gay if I paid much attention to fashion and style. To which I asked if anything was wrong with that. The women didn't have a problem at all. The guys were mixed in their opinions. Interesting. Friday, I may put on some eye shadow to see their reactions. Heh, heh, I am liking this idea more and more now that I think about it. Man, it is so good to be in a position of complete freedom to do stuff and not worry about getting fired or anything!

Alas Kudu, I only have this to respond....thank you, thank you, thank you, thank you.

Is there a difference between etiquette and decorum? I mean, besides the difference between French ("Morticia, you spoke French") and Latin? I wasn't involved in the Margaret thing but I did read the thread...and I just went back and read it again. And I agree with Gold Winger. Her question was asked and answered. I'm not sure who said anything that was abusive or impolite...there were very few responses before she announced her departure. It's possible that she was merely bored or disappointed by our equivocation. Anyone know if Rooster7 is ever going to return?

Congratulations, now the work begins. There's a similar program at Brevard College (one of my favorite places in the world). It's called Wilderness Leadership and Experiential Education (WLEE). And the students are referred to as Willies. From my observations the only thing you need to be careful of is testosterone poisoning in the males. I once noticed a gathering of Willies on a cold January day and went over to see what the excitement was. One of them had been walking a tight rope barefoot (most of them go barefoot most of the time) and he had slipped wrenching one his toes badly. I say badly and I mean it...the toe had been turned back so violently that it had burst the joint capsule and the interior of the joint was completely exposed and easily visible. The others were admiring it saying things like, "Awesome!" I took photos. It was, well, awesome. I think he recovered though and probably had ample opportunity to continue to do stupid things. Ahhh, the arrogance of youth...completely wasted on young people.

I see scads of them dead on highways on Staten Island, sometimes in Booklyn and Queens...and along, for example, the NJ Turnpike. In our area they have chronic wasting disease fairly frequently. But John-in-KC, your mention of the turkey reminded me of an incident in which we surprised a gaggle (herd?) of wild turkeys on a remote county road lined by a thick growth of trees...in order to avoid our vehicle they had to fly right ahead of us. One of the guys reached out and actually caught one by the legs. Then the bonehead actually brought it into the cab with the rest of us. As my son would say back in middle school, "Way to go, Beavis!". (it was impolite to call someone 'Butthead') But it was a mess and we had to stop and clean up a bit. But no real damage except to Beavis's pride.

John-in-KC, that's the way I feel too. I do fine with the scout-aged boys but I really enjoy the cubs more. And I did stay for several years after my son moved up in order to maintain continuity...the guy who was supposed to take over as CM took a job elsewhere and moved away at the last minute. I stayed long enough to recruit the next CM. If they needed this old cubmaster back again, I'd jump ship in a heartbeat. But as it is, I guess they need me to help with the older boys. Sigh.

Deer are rats with antlers. I take some satisfaction that the rapid expansion of the coyote population in this area is partly at the expense of the deer herd. The auto insurance company will do whatever they are legally required to do, perhaps only if you discover that legal requirement for yourself. But if you do hit a deer, I hope it is a pregnant doe. Every little bit helps.

Folks, I think we've all made our points. Normally, if I was having this discussion in person with Ed, I'd try to figure out the detailed logic that he's using to support his view. But in this forum I think it is unlikely that any of us can communicate in that level of detail even if we want to. It should be clear by now what Ed's view is and that those of us who disagree..well, disagree. But I'm getting the impression that Ed is feeling like Katie at the bridge, and set to resist no matter what. Trevorum made a compelling example. The idea has been put out there for consideration. I think we're beating a dead herring at this time. I think I'll spend the rest of the evening listening to the coyotes eating my neighbors' outside pets.(This message has been edited by packsaddle)

Ed, I think in the original scenario the scout was going to turn 18 after the EBOR but before November, therefore able to vote then.

Welcome to the forums! So would your location be near Somers or Mahopac or farther up the valley?

Trev, the tremor you feel next might be someone rolling over in his grave. With one exceptional case which transcends anything I've ever seen discussed in these threads, we've never had unresolvable problems at our BORs. And I think this is because the adults respected each other as well as the boys. And we all knew the boys fairly well. AND...the SM has done a fairly good job of making sure they were ready for the review. But that one case was something to behold. The entire leadership (with one exception, me) had made up their minds NOT to allow the boy to advance to Eagle even though he had completed all the requirements. It went to our familiar discussion of "adding to the requirements" and 'scout spirit' and he had not met their standards (they were unable to articulate what those standards were, only that he hadn't met them). A meeting with him was called in order to have a kangaroo court (my description) and the boy stood alone in front of a room full of adult antagonists. I had lobbied every one of them NOT to have that meeting and tried to explain how it violated so many things I hardly knew where to begin. I was the only adult that was an advocate for the boy and the very idea that the meeting was being forced on the boy nearly popped my cork. But by the end of the meeting, employing some of the tools mentioned by Beavah, the room only had one antagonist remaining...I had persuaded the rest away from the 'dark side'. The boy went on to Eagle. Not, I think, our best day but at least the boy made it through. That was long ago and in retrospect, training (Bob White's great admonition) could have gone a long way toward avoiding that situation. Trained adults would have had greater understanding of the program and its methods. But that was long ago and the group is much more mature...and trained.