Pack212Scouter

I don't believe that there is any offical statement for the odd arrow point, other than the vague statement "centered." It can be placed on one side, but typically the odd one is centered on the gold arrow point, usually displayed immediatly under it, alough it could also be on the bottom.

I don't mean to seem calous in this time of tragedy, but post-humous awards are designed to show something that the person has done, not as a sympathy "gift". My heart goes out to these boys and their families, but three were 13 and one was 14. None of them were close to getting Eagle, even if their path and dedication may indicate it. If they were about to earn it, that might be one thing, but this would be more akin to an honorary award than a post-humous one. That said, depending on circumstances, I am sure there are some appropriate honors available.

I have a question on the new uniform as it may or may not apply to Cub Scouts. I know that the current Cub Scout Blue uniform will not change, however, will the colors of the recruiter strip and unit numbers for Cubs transition to the Forest Green, or will they still be available in red?

I believe that only bb & archery shooting sports are to be conducted at Council events because of liability reasons. They want to have control of the range and they want to make sure that any it is being run by individuals with proper rangemaster training. There are many oppotunuties to earn these in our council. Day Camps in the summer, Resident Camps in the summer, Cub-O-Ree in the Fall, Scout-O-Rama in the Spring. Additionally, I believe that some councils will allow certified rangemasters to organize a shooting event if a council run or approved property is available and if it is open to everyone.(This message has been edited by pack212scouter)

Well, I've seen Cubs with 8or 9 arrow points that I know had dedicated parents and put genuine efforts into it. I've also seen Cubs with only one arrow point that I know didn't really put any effort at all into it. Cub Scouting is organized around family participation though, and as much as we can promote making earning something worthwhile, in the end we have to acept the parent's signiture. We aren't supposed to be the "Bling Police" in Cub Scouting, as much as we sometimes think it is deserved. It their parent says it was done, then we have to take their word for it.

Our Day Camps are for five days and cost $80-$90 depending on location with a $10 early bird discount and a $20 late fee (three weeks after deadline). The registration includes one youth and one adult and is for Scouts only. There is a Lil' Buddy program for siblings that costs $20 and is ONLY for children of the volunteers. At our Day Camps, they work on some Belt Loops, BB, Archery, and some achievements. I've never been to one, but understand that they are quite fun. This year we decided to promote Resident Camp more than Day Camp. We found that when attending for the summer parents chose one or the other and we wanted them to have the "camp experience." As a result we saw a significant rise in camping attendence for it.

CalicoPenn, I don't think you quite understand. We do give awards every meeting, and this takes about 20+ minutes every meeting. Also, our Pack size is 150+ boys, so your talking having an advancement cerimony for a significant number of boys at every meeting. We found that both the boys got very antsy and the parents got very annoyed at meeting lengths when we were trying to do this. It became "they go another 20 or 30 boys getting their rank" event and no one was happy with the pack meeting. Giving out the Ranks the way "it is supposed to be done" was doing nothing but making everyone frustrated and hating Pack meetings, it was not encouraging the boys at all. As a result, they get their ranks when earned, but there are only two big cerimonies of the year, and they take the whole meeting. Bobcat in October or November and Rank Advancement in May. We have even decided to move AOL to it's own cerimony on a seperate meeting night this year (with Bears and Webelos attending) because the significance of the achievement was being drowned out in the larger event.(This message has been edited by pack212scouter)

GW is quite right. We like to make a big deal out of awards at an annual banquet, but that does not mean they can't continue to work on their rank if hey are not done. They do not advance in rank until the end of the school year at earliest. It also does not mean that they don't "earn" their rank when they finish it, they just don't get a huge ceremony until then. Why you ask? The program isn't designed that way you say. Well, that is all very true. Unfortunatly with a Pack our size, if we did advancement cerimonies every Pack meeting there would be no Pack meetings from December until May, just advancements. We do awards and advancements, but the big fancy cerimony hold off until the end of the year. Also, due to the extreme drop off in weekly attendence from May on, we are looking at ending our official meeting year at the end of April. Not something that I like, but our attendence at meetings in May drops from an average of 120 boys to an average or 20-30. Most dens suddenly wind up with one or two boys attending. So this coming year we will be trying it a little different with an event or two in May and no meetings.(This message has been edited by pack212scouter)

Our Pack has ammended the B&G to an awards banquet. The biggest reason is that with PWD event in January/February, a Campout in March for Scout-O-Rama, and sports starting back up in April there is no way we can get families to a banquet twice in two months in there. At the end of the traditional B&G I am told that almost 80% of the families were blowing it off. Hardly worth it. We now forgo the traditional B&G and do a end of year awards Banquet called a "Blue & Gold" in mid April. Attendance at this event is now OVER 80% instead of under 80%. Is this the way that the Cub Scouting banquet was concieved in the 1943? Not really. Am I entirely happy about this change, not necessarily. But then very little in Cub Scouting is the same as 1943, and even less about our lives is the same. The key is that it works for us, where a traditional Blue & Gold did not. You must do what works best for your pack. If something doesn't work, and you've tried ways to make it work, maybe how it is done needs to be rethought. For our Pack it was turning it into a "graduation." For yours it may be returning it to it's origins.(This message has been edited by pack212scouter)

True Bob White, however since this was a Pack question, I was aiming it at the Cub Scout program. Boy Scouts and Venturing doesn't compare well, and Tigers have to have parents to be there at all.(This message has been edited by pack212scouter)(This message has been edited by pack212scouter)

Sorry that your so frustrated, but it can be quite common. Remember that in any organization, it is common that only about 10% volunteer. This is an issue for Scouting, especially Cub Scouting, which needs more like a 25-30% volunteer rate. It can be tough. As said before, the CC and COR need to help out here. Also the CM needs to help, as they are porobably more familiar with the abilities & personalities of the parents. As a side note, I have had more success going to someone and saying "We really need someone to help out and I think that you would be great. Would you pray on it?" (You can leave the last part out if you are uncomfortable). You will probably more than double the positive responses if a) you point out their gifts, b) you ask them directly to do it instead of asking them in a more vague manor. Finally, our pack has an unofficial policy. If the parent volunteers, they get priority on picking a meeting time (as available) and day (not an option in our Pack) and they also have priority of staying if we run out of leaders. Someone who volunteers or has volunteered gets priority over someone who sits. Sad for the boy...we've only had to exercise this a couple of times...but you must take care of the people willing to take time out of their lives to help these boys.

"The Girl Scout council here is addressing the issue by providing air conditioned cabins and computers at summer camp." ::shudder:: Wow...summer camp with A/C and computers. Why even bother having summer camp? They can just go to the Library every day and it won't be any different. We are Scouting organizations...and are supposed to have an outdoors outlook. Caring for the environment...teaching in it...etc. That's one of the things that makes Scouting special. Sadly, in today's environment it is very true that more than ever we have kid's with fitness being an issue. But should we be changing the square hole to round so that now the square kid no longer has their place? One of the great benefits of summer camp is for them to learn that a) they can actually go for more than six hours without modern conveniences and entertainment; b) that relationships with one another deepen when these modern devices are left behind. As for the heat issue, several things are key to reducing risk. a) enforce plenty of hydration with water (cool water is better than ice water, kids will drink more. Something with electrolites and minerals is a good idea for lunch) b) volunteers and especially staff should be trained in the signs of heat distress. (sweating is a good thing, not sweating is not, etc.). It's also a good idea to know who you have there with medical training. c) intersperse periods of physical activity (games) with periods of low activity (fishing) d) take advantage of any shaded areas.(This message has been edited by pack212scouter)

We have a very large Pack (150+ boys) and while it has many advantages, I sometimes find myself wishing we could do more things special on an individual basis. We use the baggie system, but to make it a little more special have added a section to the PowerPoint each Pack meeting which pages through each boy's name and the award's he's recieving as we call him up. We haven't gotten any complaints from boys or parents since we started putting their "name up in lights."

Our Pack just started using PackMaster. Years ago we used to use the competitor's version by the company that is now out of business and have used speadsheets since. The biggest reason for the move to PackMaster was it's terrific Scout management, the compatablility with the Troop's TroopMaster, and it's ability to link with ScoutNet. While it strides to be an all-in-one it still lacks in some areas. Our den leaders will continue to use the Trax speadsheets both because of their ease of use, the fact that at a glance you can see where each Cub is in his progress and the fact that with 20+ dens we don't want the DotNet locked out all the time for Den leader updates. This would probably work well for a small Pack, but with ours they will submit their Trax spreadsheets to our Awards Chair who will enter them in PackMaster use it to update ScoutNet. Unfortunately one of the other areas that it currently falls short is integration with some of the awards this Summertime Pack. While it will track Scout attendance and alert to low attendance, etc., PackMaster has not integrated some of these awards such as this one fully into the software. This may change in the future because they seem very ameniable to updating the software into something that can handle most everything.

We were told that we did not have to have all dens participate. We were thinking of Tiger Dens (since most of those leaders are new) and any others that were interested.

LOL...that's hilarious Gonzo. Our Webelo 2's however are fully invided to our B&G even though it is after crossover. We consider it part of their last year.

You beat me to it BW The online guide is just that a "guide". "The BSA recognizes that youth in various parts of the country develop at different rates. These guidelines are designed to demonstrate the mainstream of youth capabilities. For instance, Cub Scouts may be involved in winter camping in Alaska, where cold-weather activities are part of the culture. On the West Coast and Gulf Coast, surfing may be appropriate for Boy Scouts. In the Northeast, youth begin playing street and ice hockey at an early age. Because of the varying development rates among youth, these activity guidelines are flexible and should not be perceived as requirements or rules. They address the mainstream of youth abilities while allowing for exceptions for Scouting units and groups based on the consideration and judgment of unit, district, and council committees and boards."

Our pack charges dues in August at the beginning of the school year. They are $10 more for new Scouts to cover BSA costs for the four months until recharter. BSA fees are waved if they are a transfer. Anyone joining through the end of the year pays full dues because of the recharter. After January, we prorate the dues. As said before any time there is a transfer from another Pack, BSA costs are waved since they are already paid.

Our Pack has also been asked to try this program. It is my understanding that it is not so much a program to speed things up as much as it is a program to help Den Leaders plan their year out better. It is based on a 9 month 16 meeting year. It is also supposed to help gain requirements for advancement in den meetings. I'm interested in seeing just how it works.

Actually, you don't offer a lifetime guarantee unless it is expected to last a reasonable lifetime of use. For most Scouters, I would anticipate that to be in the 10-20 year range. Lifetime guarantees are usually offered on premium products to justify their premium price and quality. It is not the end user's fault that a product may not stand-up long term to what is promised.

Different dens do it different ways. Sometimes each boy is asked for a suggestion, sometimes they are given a list to pick from. Secret ballot is often used, although discussion sometimes works depending on the boys. Something funny this year. We always announce the new Webelo Den names at our Blue & Gold. This year one of the new Webelo dens used secret ballot and had a tie vote. They revoted and the winner was one that hadn't even tied! But best was they didn't find out until the banquet when they were told that one of their sisters cast the tie breaking vote and they were now the Hello Kitty den! There were some funny faces...but they are now the American Eagle den.

Not sure what our district average is. Our pack is 45 out of 46 leaders, or nearly 98%. Our goal is always 100%.

I've very glad that you stepped up and are helping out on what needs to be done. People like you are what makes Scouts Go! Just remember, full time job doesn't equal free ride. People make time for what they believe in and enjoy doing. I'll bet many of those full time dads somehow find time for that Sunday football game or beer & poker with the boys. We have a pack of nearly 150 boys here and our Committee Chair, Cubmaster, four Assistant Cubmasters and our Activities Chair all have full time jobs. Several of us amounting to about 50+ hours a week. Sorry, you just hit a sore spot...it just really burns me when I hear "I can't, I have a full time job." I guess the rest of us are just independently wealthy Anyway...sorry to dampen any spirits, I'm very glad that your doing what your doing!

jblake, I'm not firing rounds across your bow or anything, but I've never been involved in Ventures and you totally lost me with your statement "This approach is totally inappropriate in the Scouting program, but as a totally adult directed unit, there's no room for discussion." I thought Venturing *was* part of the Scouting program. I also thought that crews were directed by youth leaders under the guidance of adult advisors. Is this not the way that your crew runs?

We do a wear your uniform to school day the day of that roundup. We also do a Scout weekend at our COR church where the boys wear their uniforms and hand out information for the second roundup that Monday nightl.