Oldscout448

Guess not

Our little group has a 16" tall Buzz Lightyear that is carried about and is always the centerpiece on our table at meals, and salutes smartly at every flag ceremony I am not sure how the tradition started, he has been around for years. To infinity and beyond !

You were sent into a public competition with no training, no preparation, and no time to at least practice ? ! Your Scoutmaster sounds like a complete and total ,non-empathetic jackass. How in the world could that possibly be considered good for anyone? Scoutmasters like that we just don't need. Rant over, sorry you had to go thru that. Oldscout

From one old ceremonies advisor to another A scout salute, the handclasp of our Order, and a heartfelt Thank You ! Godspeed

" Too many chiefs and not enough braves? We can always use more chiefs,for ' He who serves is greatest!' the Chief, the Sakima. What is a Sakina? He is a man with feathers- the Inner Man in each if us: The feathered Spirit that, like an arrow, flies straight and true. What is the work of ceremonies? Fletching. Fletching every one!" Jay Dunbar ' The Drum'

There is an excellent unofficial ceremonies guide that assigns each of the principles a color, a wind, an element, a season, a time, a realm, a challenge, a tradition, and a few more I can't bring to mind. Other that one reference, I dont see how colored shirts have any symbolic meaning.

Actually I find it quite encouraging that they didn't know what it was. The faster the KKK and like minded groups fade into obscurity and disrepute the happier I will be.

Shhh !

So at the risk of being called a capitalist imperialist, anybody want to buy a big drum? Quickly?

I want a red lightsaber! And we could all get Darth Vader outfits. Impressive, most impressive

In the opening ceremony at NOAC today, all four principles wore black robes. No native american regalia at all. A nod to our beginnings on Treasure Island, or a harbinger of things to come?

As does the OA, I do not see why the Order is needed to act this out. Anyone with a uniform could do it. I suspect the scouts that have spent untold amounts of time and effort both scripting and performing in the past, will simply decline to attend another Cub ceremony, unless they can sit in the audience. I'll let you know what my boys deside.

One in the morning, a full moon,a small fire, and I am pretty sure I'll be leaving the OA come January first. Or rather the OA will have left me if the ceremonies are declared illegal and whateverthey try to replace it with is as corny as the new AoL Ah well, 44 years is a good long time. I'm grateful my sons got to go thru the ceremonies. It meant a lot to them. Just sad it looks like my grandsons won't have the chance. ButI still have two vigils to attend, two brotherhood, one pre and one last ordeal ceremony to help run. I'll try to make them the best ever. The scouts deserve at least that.

I'm not sure the exec committee is listening

If they announce at NOAC that regalia is soon to be banned, I hope that a large number of arrowmen have the guts to walk up up the podium and drop their sashes at the speakers feet before walking out in protest. Oh, and live stream it to youtube.

I have little contact with my lodge leadership, most of the adults seem to be lawers or business executives, it is Washington DC. after all, and a blue collar guy just doesn't fit in. But from what I have gleaned over the years, the advisers are the ones calling the shots. The votes the youth take are mostly formalities, the important decisions have already been made, and the youth are told in advance what the correct decision will be.

The OA executive committee may have indeed made it. As far as I am aware none of the plebeians at the lodge or chapter level were consulted in any way. Sound familiar?

It's the kind of thing even cubscouts will roll their eyes and laugh at. I'll bet a weeks pay that I could put five den chiefs in a room and they could write a script that is three times better in an hour.

YO! Matt, you still with us?

I'll try of course. It's just going to be a lot harder. And the" reason" for it just infuriates me.

Barry, yes the ceremonies were only one aspect of it. I did a lot of that heavy lifting. Camporee staff, counclfire building, Trail clearing, bridge building, raking leaves, if it needed to be done we went out and did it. We were the ones who did the hard work, the Dirty Work and we were damn proud of it. You never asked for money, or a patch, we didn't even care if we got a round of applause. It didn't really matter if anyone else knew, we knew. And that was enough for us. That is the attitude and mindset I have striven to instill in the current generation. It is admittedly a lot harder now. But there are some Scouts who seem to truly understand that it's not about us it's about serving, bearing the burdens of those who cannot carry the load alone, they inspire me and they keep me going. And it's not that I need the Traditions to continue to comfort me in my old age. I think they need the Traditions to continue so that they can feel a part of something ancient and continuing and that they are links in that chain. A tradition that they can be part of and then pass on to the next generation and I fear that all that will soon be lost and forgotten

We probably will, but don't think it will last more than 4-5 years. Probably national is counting on that.

Right now I'm just wondering how many ceremonies teams Nationwide are just going to quit in disgust.

In my eyes the biggest losers here are the Cubs. As a scout I did perhaps a hundred Arrow of Light, Cub colors,or crossover ceremonies, and as an advisor I have watched perhaps a thousand. The one thing that was constant was the look of awe and wonder in the Cubs eyes. They just loved it. It was often years later when they were inducted into the order and joined the ceremonies team they would tell me they had wanted to do this since they were 10 years old, since that magical night by the campfire when the chief gave them their Arrow of Light. We have been making jingle dresses so that the girls could join in the ceremonies so that the girl Cubs could be likewise impressed. We don't do this for money, heck we spend our own money to keep this going, we don't do it because it's easy, and we certainly don't do it because National tells us to. In keeping with that attitude and mind set I'm struggling to find a reason why we shouldn't just go Rogue take off our sashes and keep doing it anyway because that's what the Cubs want.

So crossover and AoL ceremonies are now written by National, And only class A uniforms are allowed. My team, about 20 of some of the most outstanding scouts in the district, is vacillating between Rebellion and just quitting. I suspect call outs are next, or perhaps Eagle courts of Honor. If they're trying to kill the OA this is a very good way to start.