Oak Tree

Typically knot, but for the bad ones, yes. Seems like a reasonable step to take.

What constitutes a closed fire? Tongue-in-cheek, I'm assuming, but nevertheless... http://bit.ly/hZhIPA

Eagle92, that section of the G2SS has been revamped. It now says For activity afloat, those not classified as a swimmer are limited to multiperson craft during outings or float trips on calm water with little likelihood of capsizing or falling overboard. They may operate a fixed-seat rowboat or pedal boat accompanied by a buddy who is a swimmer. They may ride in a canoe or other paddle craft with an adult swimmer skilled in that craft as a buddy. They may ride as part of a group on a motorboat or sailboat operated by a skilled adult. [emphasis added]

Relatively speaking, I live in a rain forest. My Scouts are still required to actually start the fire. I figure that's just verifying that they've correctly demonstrated how to build the fire.

singlemom - kudos to you for responding. I wasn't sure we'd hear back from you. I posted here because I am at my wits end how to handle this. I don't want to embarrass my son any more he is already embarassed and discouraged enough. HE does not want to go back because of how bad the SM's have already made him feel. I'm not sure why you are at wits end - it seems fairly straightforward how to handle it - I wouldn't force him to go back. I think that almost nothing positive results from forcing a boy to attend Scouts if he doesn't want to. If your son has a friend in another troop who's having a better experience, you might see if your son wanted to join him, but I don't think I'd send your son back to this troop. He doesn't want to go. You don't want him to go. It doesn't sound like you have a good relationship with the troop leaders. Seems like an easy decision to me :-) perhaps SM should have to take a course in dealing with aggressive kids. I'd be happy to take a course like that - as long as it was on-line and I could quickly read through things that I might already know. But there are also Scouts who have autism/aspergers, Scouts with Downs Syndrome, Scouts with ADD, Scouts from divorced parents, Scouts with generalized anxiety disorder, etc. All of their parents want us to deal with them. Keep in mind that Scoutmasters are not paid as child development specialists - they are just volunteers who started out, for the most part, because they wanted to help run a program for their own son. There is a limit to the level of expertise that can reasonably be expected in this situation. you should consider that since BS was started there have been significant findings in child development. As in we don't let small children do everything we used to. In the depression era we can see that small children were often left alone at age no one would think to now. That sounds perfectly reasonably, but well, it comes across as a little bit naive - Boy Scouts has made dramatic changes to its safety rules over the years. Scoutmasters who watch the movie "Follow Me, Boys!" can't help but be struck by how much more awareness there is of safety issues nowadays, and how many more rules there are to follow than there were back when that movie was made. Seriously. Tons more rules. Much more training. I'm still not sure exactly what you're hoping for...I'm glad you've got some suggestions you can use, and your post certainly makes for a cautionary tale of what to watch out for. Thanks for sharing. Don't take the responses too hard - people here are used to some pretty blunt discussions, and we don't know enough from your posts to really know your situation and have a sense for all of the parties involved. And most of us have seen cases of bad behavior by leaders, as well as bad behavior by parents, and we know there are often some very different points of view out there. So there's a lot of general theorizing that goes on. Try not to take it personally (and yes, that's probably useless advice, I know.)

Yeah, I think most of us agree the info is unnecessary for the council to require. There has been much more mixed advice on the "two signatures per check" - many of us have stated that that creates a logistical hassle for little/no benefit. Everyone agrees the financial information should be available at the committee meetings, there should be transparency, the bank statements should be available, and that significant purchases should be agreed on by the committee.

perdidochas, I don't disagree with you that EDGE in its most general form, as you list, does take into account at least #1, 2, and 3. I don't see anything about #4, 5, 6, or 7 - but I agree that there's nothing stopping you from adding these. But here's the thing. If the EDGE method says that you can combine E and D, or D and G, and that you can move back a step if you need to, then there's not much left of EDGE - because EDGE, as listed, strongly implies a linear progression through the stages. But now it's more like - here are the ways you might teach it: EDGE - straightforward (ED)GE - with E and D together E(DG)E - with D and G together [EDG|(ED)G|E(DG)][E|D|G]*E - Get through the first EDG with possible combined steps, and then follow optionally with any number of repetitions of the first three steps as necessary, and end with enable. So the essence of EDGE at the end appears to be that you should have an Explain step, a Demo step, a Guide step, and an Enable step (and that you shouldn't do them backwards). Since pretty much any teaching at all has to have the Explain step and is intended to get to the Enable step, all EDGE is really saying is that you should include a Demo and a Guide step. That's true and useful, but pretty basic.

What deep hard questions can you ask about tying a square knot? A little bit tangential, and I know it was rhetorical, but I'll take a shot. Questions about the square knot:If you grab the ends of this knot and pull, will it hold together? Even if you're using slippery rope?What might make it hold better?What might make it hold worse?Can you tell the difference by looking at a thieves knot, a granny knot, and a square knot?Will this knot work well for connecting ropes of different sizes?Would this knot be easier to teach if the ropes were different colors?What places might you use this knot?Can this knot be tied with one hand?If you used this knot to tie something down, could you get the rope tight?Can you tie this knot blindfolded?

SR540Beaver, I think the usual reason for not attracting wildlife is that we don't want to habituate them to coming to common camping areas to look for food. So assuming that you are hiking on a trail, or using a semi-regular campsite, you may find the advice reasonable. If you are out in the backcountry in the middle of nowhere I'd think there would be less concern about letting the animals eat the entrails.

singlemom, I'm curious. Have you been reading these forums all along? If so, you should realize that the leaders here would never accept that kind of behavior from either the adults nor the Scouts. What happened to your son is very unfortunate and the troop should address it. Did someone point you at this forum as a place to raise a complaint? If so, were you expecting any response? Or did you just want to lash out at Scouting and at men in general based on your frustration with both? I'm not sure what your son's experience has to do with your being a single mom - it sounds like a boy from a two-parent family could very well have had the same experience. In my troop, we do welcome women to come camping with us and one of my best assistant Scoutmasters is a woman. Does the troop know how serious your son and you perceive the incident to be? It seems like you'd be far better off directing your concerns at them, rather than sending out a broad-brush warning to the internet. Is there anything we can do to help?

Check out the detailed explanation here. http://leavenotracecommunity.blogspot.com/2009/07/fish-guts.htmlSpecial care needs to be taken when dealing with fish entrails. Many anglers follow the tradition of scattering entrails in the woods or out on rocks for wildlife, but this practice is no longer recommended. Today, the best disposal methods are determined by a number of factors including how long you will be out fishing, whether bears live in the area, if whirling disease is a concern, and what the local regulations dictate. When entrails are tossed into the woods, they attract wildlife. Animals and birds have been observed following both hunters and anglers in hopes of obtaining a free lunch of guts. These animals lose their natural wariness of people and can become a nuisance or worse. Entrails that are not eaten by wildlife will rot and smell and make the area undesirable for those who visit after you, so please do not leave fish guts dangling in the bushes or sitting out on a rock. The best possible way to dispose of fish entrailsas with any kind of wasteis to pack them outif you cant pack out your fish entrails, you have a number of other options such as burial, deep water deposition or moving water deposition.

Ok, so what is the endowment fund used for? If it just generates interest, and the interest is used to fund the council operations, then it's really just that my donation is providing money over a set of years. So maybe this year's donation won't get spent on the taxes, but the interest from the donation might be spent that way next year. Still, good information to know about the endowment fund. At least it can't all get wasted at once.

Beavah, that's a great website. (As a short cut, the report is at http://ies.ed.gov/ncee/wwc/pdf/practiceguides/20072004.pdf) They critique all the actual research done to say which studies show which methods to be effective. It's exactly the kind of thing you'd want to see - and they come right out and list a whole bunch of things that aren't shown to have a positive effect. As for the specifics of whether EDGE follows the guidelines, I agree, it does not. I think if you combine the Explain and Demo phases, then EDGE meets #4, and if you use pictures during that combined phase, EDGE meets #3. For the interleaving in #2, I think that's necessary for any complex tasks. EDGE appears to be suited to very simple, straightforward tasks where the interleaving isn't necessary. In practice, people using EDGE will interleave when necessary. I think that they will also often combine E and D. The interesting thing about 5a) Start with quizzes is that that's how the BSA usually does a lot of their education. From The Trainer's Edge presentation, Letfs say I wanted to get the water from this glass [the full one] to this glass [the empty one]. What would I need to do? [Wait in silence for one or more answers.]and then there's Run a Team Buzz Group Activity Have teams select a scribe and take two minutes to write down their ideas on the following question. What prevents the learner from receiving the information? So we see that BSA isn't using EDGE even when it's teaching EDGE. This course doesn't appear to be structured like EDGE at all, actually. On point 6, evaluating themselves, The Trainer's Edge does that too, even while not teaching that it should be a part of the EDGE method:Distribute the Communication Self]Assessment handout (see Handout page 52). Ask learners to take a few minutes to evaluate themselves using this list.I think that where BSA advancement really fails is on item 1, Space Learning over Time. Unless you artificially introduce a delay between having the student learn it and getting it checked, you get the typical "Learn it, check it off, forget it" advancement.

So, for all you moral relativists out there, do you have any sort of moral compass? I thought that is what the Boy Scout insignia stood for--a moral compass pointing true north. I'd be curious to know what sort of behavior you deem "good" or "exemplary" My experience is that most people have some sort of fundamental principle(s) that they use as the basis for deciding whether something is good. They tend to be something like:Truth is good. The more people who believe the truth, the better.Suffering is bad. You should take the action that causes fewer people to suffer. No one should ever intentionally increase another's suffering (barring some overwhelming societal goal of long-term reduction in suffering).Freedom is good. People should be able to make their own choices and live with the consequences.God is good by definition. He has provided us with holy texts. Anything that God has told us to do we should do.Peace and harmony are good. We should look to reduce conflict.I should do what's best for me, so long as it doesn't interfere with other fundamental principles I hold. (and some people may not have any other such principles.)But just to say that because someone doesn't believe that the word of God is an absolute good, that doesn't mean that they have no principles whatsoever.

Their first example of EDGE in that presentation link, starting on page 11, uses a completely worthless first Explain step. In fact, the point there appears to be that explaining is not an effective step and you have to follow it up with a demo. I say, why even use the explain step here? You should just start with the demo. There are certainly times when I've seen some ineffective ASMs not be able to get a concept across. Some of them seem to think that Explain/Enable covers it. "I told you how to build a fire. You should be able to get yours going now. You must not be doing it right, the way I explained." Those people could certainly use a reminder that demonstrating and guiding are useful steps.

I always viewed the references as being part of the "explain". For many skills, I think that using "explain" as a step by itself, before the first demo, seems pretty useless. Trying to explain three-dimensional movements to someone without using a demo...that cannot possibly be the most effective way. Check out this glossary of instructional strategies to see a huge number of ways of approaching instruction: http://www.beesburg.com/edtools/glossary.html Here's a book used by a graduate school: Title: Designing Effective Instruction Author: Morrison, G. R., Ross, S. M. & Kemp, J. E. ISBN: 0-471-21651-8 Edition: 4th, 2004 Publisher: John Wiley & Sons Another: Effective Instructional Strategies: From Theory to Practice By Kenneth D. Moore Some psychomotor skills need to be built up as a sequence of more fundamental movements. In those cases, you'd want to spend time working on each of the fundamental items before working to combine them (think swimming, for example). I don't think there are going to be any meaningful studies of EDGE as an instructional strategy. Your mileage may vary. I do agree it's a reasonable way to teach some basic skills, but I'm not sure I'd drill on it. It's not like this method is a fundamental method of teaching.

I guess if I made a James West donation, I'd assume the money was going to the council to fund their standard operations. Even if they keep "my donation" in a separate fund, it would just mean that they'd have to put less of their own money into that fund. If the council is terrible at managing money, then maybe I don't want to make the donation. But I do assume that some money is being used to pay taxes.

I'm really glad my son's merit badge counselor didn't require it as part of a troop activity. Our troop has never done a 20 mile hike in one day, and I can't imagine that there's going to be a plan for one any time soon. The counselor wanted the written trip report. And he talked with my son about it. You could also ask for photos, or a GPS track, or something else. Or maybe you say you need independent verification and you need a second adult on the trip, worst case. I can't see any justification for saying that it has to be part of a troop activity.

These hikes do not have to be at a Scout function, so G2SS rules would not have to apply. Even if the rules do apply, I don't think that a hike would necessarily be a "backcountry expedition". In fact, when my son earned the badge, we did most of our hikes at state parks, and those were certainly not what I would call backcountry. Most of the time we had four people, but one time it was just me and him.

In our unit, and I would guess in the typical unit, there aren't enough interested adults to fill the slots. We offer a nomination to everyone who is eligible. So there's no discussion of whether the adult will really be helpful or not.

John-in-KC, you're right. The selection of adult leaders isn't supposed to be for honor, so the comment may fit better on the other thread. However, the comment was most immediately in response to Eagle92's post, which was talking about electing Scouts, not adults.

Check out http://www.snopes.com/horrors/freakish/darwin05.asp for the scoop on the truth here. Note that only the first one on this list would literally qualify as a "Darwin Award" - which is named for removing yourself from the gene pool. You can also check out http://www.darwinawards.com/ for some more entertaining examples of simply astonishing stupidity. Let's just say that none of the above stories seem beyond the realm of possibility.

Webelos would be in the Latin third declension, like flos (flower). Assuming that it is indeed a noun (which is the way it is commonly used), it would decline something like this: Case Singular English example nominative Webelos A Webelos can earn many awards. genitive Webeloris The winning car was that of a Webelos. dative Webelori The den leader gave the denner cords to a Webelos. accusative Webelorem The troop lifted a Webelos. ablative Webelore The den leaders hiked through the poison ivy with a Webelos. vocative Webelos Yo, Webelos! Come over here by yourself. Case Plural English example nominative Webelores The Webelos bought their den leader a lovely golden sumac bush. genitive Webelorum The uniform sizes of the Webelos ranged from S to XL. dative Webeloribus The troop gave the Webelos new neckerchiefs after they crossed the flaming bridge. accusative Webelores They shot all the Webelos ith Nerf guns. ablative Webeloribus They played Laser Tag with many Webelos. vocative Webelores Yo, Webelos! Do you all want to learn Latin?

The problem with saying that Arrowmen need to be involved is that the election is presented partly as an honor. Otherwise, why vote? If it's just a service group, let anyone sign up. But because it is an honor society, people want to be recognized. I don't think there's anything wrong with that. When I joined, I think my chapter adviser estimated that 90% of the people were "sash and dash" members. I didn't really like the term, but I did recognize that it was a shorthand for people who never show up again, and as with most groups, there are ways of distinguishing between "us" and "them", and I can understand why the people who do show up for service projects would make a mental distinction between those who run for OA to participate in it, and those who just want the sash. Still, I do agree with SeattlePioneer that the term is disparaging. Most honor societies do not have a lot of "active" members. They serve primarily to provide honor - a little bit of recognition. If you offer people recognition, why would you then disparage those who take it? The system is perfectly constructed to get exactly the results it is getting.

The participant may have heard someone discussing the advice for river canyons, but that is not generally applicable. From the Leave No Trace website (http://www.lnt.org/programs/principles_3.php)UrineUrine has little direct effect on vegetation or soil. In some instances urine may draw wildlife which are attracted to the salts. They can defoliate plants and dig up soil. Urinating on rocks, pine needles, and gravel is less likely to attract wildlife. Diluting urine with water from a water bottle can help minimize negative effects. Special Considerations for River Canyons: River canyons often present unique Leave No Trace problems. The most common practice is to urinate directly in the river and pack out feces in sealed boxes for later disposal. Check with your land manager for details about specific areas. The general rule appears to be 200 feet, per http://www.lnt.org/programs/principles.phpDispose of Waste Properly+ Pack it in, pack it out. Inspect your campsite and rest areas for trash or spilled foods. + Pack out all trash, leftover food, and litter. + Deposit solid human waste in catholes dug 6 to 8 inches deep at least 200 feet from water, camp, and trails. Cover and disguise the cathole when finished. + Pack out toilet paper and hygiene products. + To wash yourself or your dishes, carry water 200 feet away from streams or lakes and use small amounts of biodegradable soap. Scatter strained dishwater.