Oak Tree

They actually said "December." I'm not sure where all the official statements can get traced back to, but Scouting magazine is definitely one source. Scouting magazine: "That's why Landon and other welding professionals served on the committee that helped write the pamphlet for the Welding merit badge, which debuts in December." http://digital.scouting.org/scoutingmagazine/novdec2011/resources/11.htm American Welding Society: "In 2011, the Boy Scouts of America approved an official welding merit badge which will available to Scouts in late December." (http://www.aws.org/w/a/weldingbadge/index.html) Gas and Welding Industry Wiki: "The Boy Scouts of America will introduce the first-ever welding merit badge in December 2011" http://www.gawdawiki.org/headlines/Boy-Scouts-Introduces-Welding-Badge-2055 boyscouttrail.com: "Welding merit badge coming December, 2011" Golden Spread Council: "The Welding Merit Badge will debut in December 2011!" http://goldenspread.wordpress.com/2011/12/ News from Central Florida Council: "Welding is planned for release in late 2011" http://archive.constantcontact.com/fs018/1107630230569/archive/1108916965757.html I picked up the requirements book, too. Trainerlady is right, the requirements are there.

In my mind, the difference is only in how the project is presented. You could do the exact same fundraiser as a job or as an organizational fundraiser. What is key is what you tell the people who are paying for your services or giving you money. If you say that the money is going to be used to benefit X organization, then the money has to go to that organization. People may pay you extra or just donate money because they believe in that organization. If you just do the work for hire, then the money is yours to do with as you see fit. If we were to take the guidelines literally, and suggest that people should only pay for a fundraiser exactly what they'd pay even if it weren't a fundraiser, then I'd think there would be no reason to do fundraiser and people could just work at their jobs. However, as we all know, fundraisers typically raise more money than they would if people were just to buy the items or services on the free market. People are willing to pay these prices, sometimes even happy to do so, because they realize that the extra money is going to a good cause. I don't think Boy Scout popcorn would sell very well on grocery shelves if it was just "Trails End" popcorn with no association with BSA. Who would pay those prices? So, if you want to say you're raising money for a charity, you have to follow the rules, file the permits, and give the money to the organization. If you don't want to have the benefit of using the charity's name, then just earn the money yourself. It might be easier and faster - either way.

Thanks for the info, trainerlady. I'll grab a copy. I'd still like to see the info out there on the web - it doesn't appear to be at scouting.org. I did find this link (http://yorkdistrictmbc.wordpress.com/2012/01/13/2012-york-district-mbc-site-of-welding-merit-badge-pre-launch/) which says that "BSA National has selected the 2012 York District Merit Badge College event to be the site of the prelaunch for the brand new Welding Merit Badge!" "This pre-launch is designed as a final check to be sure that all of the is are dotted and the ts crossed as everyone prepares for the actual release of the badge to all of Americas scouts." That would be February 4, 11, and/or 18. So is it not official until then? Officially embargoed? I guess if it's in the requirements book, we can go ahead and start working on it.

So BSA put out lots of news releases saying that the merit badge was coming in December 2011. It isn't out yet and I can't easily find any official data that says when it will be, although I appreciate the scuttlebutt that it will be out on January 30. So my question is, how hard is it to release a merit badge on the day that you say you'll release the merit badge? I actually have Scouts (well, at least one Scout) who wants to do this, but nope, no requirements available yet. Every now and then I wish I volunteered with an organization that was a little bit more organized. I'll get over it, I know. Not a big deal. But really, why not get some of these details right?

Eamonn, Watching things change can be sad. The DE could have done better. The SE could have done better. The district commissioners could have done better. The new volunteers could have done better. Or maybe they were all doing the best they could. I know you have been doing the best you could. It's hard to know from a distance whether things have really changed there. It could just be demographics. Rural areas' populations have been shrinking and their people have been aging in many states. Nationally numbers are down - there are many other things competing for our kids' time, and as we become more urban, it's not surprising that rural districts can struggle. Do the best you can for the youth you have.

We have an adult "equipment coordinator", which is the title given in the Scouting literature, I believe. His job is to be the coach for the youth quartermaster. He also actually has a credit card which can be useful for acquiring new equipment. In general I just let him work with the troop quartermaster and the patrol quartermasters in taking care of the equipment. There might be a few times where he jumps in and does more than he needs to, where the youth could do it, but that's the case with every adult in the unit. It's a constant balancing process. The key thing, though, is that we describe the job as the coach for the youth. Seems to work out well for us. We're trying to get to the position that TwoCub describes, for the same reasons.

I agree that summer camp is definitely a place that subtracts requirements. I'd add that this happens not just at summer camp, but in most places where large groups of Scouts take a merit badge together. When a counselor is working with one or two Scouts, the requirements almost always get covered, but in large groups there is a real tendency to add some hand-waving over some of the requirements.

He can definitely come to the meetings and go on the campouts. I don't know what will happen with the background checks that BSA runs on adult leader applications.

She is taking the training as an adult ASM. No issue.

I'm willing to bet that every troop has a parent exactly like me in it. Probably not exactly Guess I'm not worth the time of day if I don't know the proverbial secret handshake. Some troops are more cliquish than others, for sure. Same as sports leagues and PTAs and everything else I've seen. Probably true for "Occupy Wall Street" groups, too. "Eng61, what percent of the scout abuse cases occurred on Scout campouts or outings?" Dunno ... but I'll bet BSA national can tell you. The ones we've seen reported certainly suggest that most of them happen outside the Scout environment, and National may indeed have some idea, but I don't think they're going to tell me...

I'm not sure what we're arguing about. There are clearly some references to the concept in various official BSA publications, but your own experience will vary based on what the people in your council do. I think the biggest place it's currently listed is in the new advancement guide. And no, they don't use the term "First Class First Year" nor do they use the abbreviation FCFY, but they do say "Establish practices that will bring each new Boy Scout to First Class rank within a year". All of the references I gave are from scouting.org. I don't think National really needs to set the expectations for how long it takes to get First Class. It will vary a lot.

SR540Beaver writes: The only place I ever hear FCFY mentioned is here in this forum. You certainly can't find any mention on scouting.org. What?? Shortridge points out two places:First Class - First Year tracking sheet: http://www.scouting.org/filestore/boyscouts/pdf/34118.pdf new Guide to Advancement: "Establish practices that will bring each new BoyScout to First Class rank within a year of joining,and then to Star rank the following year." http://www.scouting.org/filestore/pdf/33088.pdf But there are lots morehttp://olc.scouting.org/resources/TLT.ppt - Troop Guide duties: Helps new Scouts earn First Class rank in their first yearResources for Patrol Leaders - First Class First Year Tracking Sheet - http://www.scouting.org/scoutsource/BoyScouts/PatrolLeader.aspxThe forms index document again lists the FCFY tracking sheet - http://scouting.org/filestore/pdf/Forms.pdfIntroduction to Leadership Skills for Troops - "Help new Scouts earn the First Class rank in their first year" http://scouting.org/filestore/training/pdf/ILST%20FINALS%202011%20-%20Item%20Number%20511-016.pdfUniversity of Scouting 2011 Course list - "Scouts who attain First Class rank in the first year are well on their way to Eagle. Learn how and why this is important for the boys and your troop." http://councilspd.scouting.org/sitecore/content/Council449/Our%2520Council/Local%2520Training/~/media/Councils/Council449/Training/University%2520of%2520Scouting/2011%2520U%2520of%2520S%2520Class%2520list.ashx

Why on earth would someone discourage you from attending a training program? I just don't know what goes on in some people's minds. I'd like to hear a real reason from them. That response just seems ridiculous. Good luck.

1. Zero percent, as far as I can tell. We do lose Scouts, but it tends to be either to sports or because the boy just doesn't enjoy Scouting. Why is this? Hard to say for sure, but we spend a lot of time with the parents describing how the program works. I often view my role on camping trips to be coaching of the adult leaders and parents - we laugh and joke about how I'm always whispering in their ears about where they might back off. We do have a camping trip each year with the Webelos II dens and this is a perfect chance to spend some real time with the incoming parents. 2. We haven't faced this. Ironically, we've received a few transfers from our local super-troop because the boys seem to prefer our more laid back approach. 3. Yes, we have troubled Scouts. If you include boys with autism-spectrum disorder or ADHD, it seems like we've got more than the typical percentage of the population.

correlation does not imply causation Well, here on the forum we all recognize this. I see little or no benefit in the FCFY program. Of course, it's not really a "program"; it's just a thought that gets mentioned here and there. My vote is to stop mentioning it. Every time I see it I'm reminded of how ridiculously statistics can be used.

a badge recognizes what a young man is able to do and how he has grown. It is not so much a reward for what he has done Right, I knew that was coming. Yes, that general philosophy is written out. However, that philosophy does not carry over into the actual wording of the requirements. The swimming requirement is one that I think of as the only real exception. You do have to know how to swim. For the rest of the requirements, I think you have to add to the requirements in order to make it reflect something that "a young man is able to do" as opposed to "a reward for what he has done." I've decided I'm not really worried about it - I'm going to do as Eamonn suggests and focus on putting on a good program, and the advancement stuff will get signed off along the way. We'll try to do it by the letter of the requirements because that's what seems fair to the boys. Some skills they'll pick up and use over and over, and others they'll do once and be done with it. The PL looks at the bandage, and explains that he needs some more practicing before he will sign off on the requirement. Yes, I'm fine with this. It's reasonable for the person signing off to have some standard for what an acceptable bandage is. But what if the bandage was perfect? The Scout learned it two minutes ago, did it perfectly. Will he remember it in a week? Probably not if he doesn't practice it again. But if he's done it correctly, would you then not sign off? Or is it once and done?

I'd like to have a Troop Encourager. Some people fill that role just by their very nature. I'd also like to have a Troop Bottle-washer - the person who looks around to see what tasks aren't being done because they aren't assigned to anyone, and who then steps in and does them. And sometimes, I'd really like a Troop Massage Therapist.

I think I'm with Fred on this one. A boy feels like if he meets the letter of the requirement, he should get it signed off. Now, the problem is, the letter of the requirement doesn't generally match the spirit of the requirement. The spirit is that a boy really knows how to tie a bowline and will remember how to do it in a week or a month - that is, he's committed it to long-term memory. But that is not how it is written. As far as requirement sign-off goes, I think yes, it is, "once and done". If the requirement is an important one to the everyday operation of the troop, then the boy will keep getting practice at the skill and will retain it. If it's not important, then he won't. This is primarily an issue for those people who have their own expectation of what a "First Class Scout" is, or what it means to be an "Eagle Scout". I'd be fine with tougher standards, but I'd want them to be written out.

I think that most of the changes described are good ones. Smaller footprint This is a very good thing. AP Hill was ridiculously spread out. Bus lines with over-full buses. Long, long walks. Scouts late back to camp because they couldn't get a bus. Programs that were very hard to make use of because they were so far away. No regional subcamps This seems like a good thing. I didn't really know what all went on in the subcamps, but I would have much preferred to be camping with troops from all over the country rather than just with the ones from my own state. No buses, cars This is a plus, too, although this wasn't a big deal for us. Better shower houses A good thing. I'll add that they need to have either standard restrooms where everyone can go in, or else they need to be single stall. Having a large facility that only the youth can go in is not a recipe for a contained situation. No visitors Mixed feelings on this one. Clearly visitors were problems in some places, but it was nice to see folks from home. J-phone with pre-selected itinerary Mixed on this one too. Some of the fun was in discovering things and going back and doing more of what they enjoyed. But elimination of lines is also a good thing. Everything you need Much more like summer camp. All tents, cots, dining flies, tables, chairs, cooking equipment. etc. This is a great thing - dealing with the council equipment was a giant waste of effort for all involved. The only thing I'll say is that it was nice that the adults could bring along some backup items - a few extras here and there. Limited patch trading I don't really care about this - didn't have a problem with it. Eliminating merit badge midway None of our Scouts used it. I did walk through it to tour it, and it was cool, but it was sooooo far away. Seemed weird that the canoeing merit badge was taught there even though there was no way to canoe there. I do like having things spread out where they can be done better. Honestly, if I had listed my biggest hopes for improvement, they would have been: less walking, less boring (more HA), less council equipment. So far, so good with the new plan.

The normal thing in our unit is for leaders to buy the stuff and turn in the receipts. It generally hasn't been a problem. If you pay with a credit card, you don't have to pay right away anyway. The treasurer can generally write you a check on the spot. Then I can use my cell phone app, take a picture of the check and bam!, it's in my account. If someone doesn't want to pay ahead of time, which is generally only for large purchases, we can get a check from the unit treasurer. We've had unit leaders pay expenses up to $5000 on their credit card and just get reimbursed, but not everyone has (or wants to use) the necessary credit limit for that. I'll say that we've never required two-signature checks, and that just seems like a big hassle for no real benefit. We get the monthly bank report and treasurer's report, so we know where the money went. The one-signature system does make it faster for the treasurer to get reimbursement checks to the unit leaders.

I think that any group that regularly takes large groups of teenaged boys into the wild is going to end up with some issues regarding the public perception of the group. If nine out of ten troops behave well, people will still remember the encounter that they have with the one group that didn't behave so well. BSA does ask us all to follow Leave No Trace guidelines - these would seem to cover most of the situations that you might encounter. Not everyone does this, though.

I think this is a good question. I doubt that there is a lot of evidence-based effort going on here, although I might be persuaded otherwise if I saw enough data. I definitely think that rolling things out in pilot councils is a good way to get feedback. But I think you'd want to run pilot programs for a few years and see what the results look like in order to do a fair evaluation. A few quick pilots can help iron out any obvious kinks, but if you really want to know if the changes are effective, you'd want some way to measure the results.

I'm assuming that Engineer61 is asking whether we've ever had an open meeting on the topic of youth protection in our troop. We have not had such a meeting. We did have some meetings when we used to show the video "A Time To Tell" to let the parents preview it and bring up any concerns, and a few opted out of having their kids watch it. Thinking out loud, if we were to hold such a meeting, presumably the purpose would be to get those parents that aren't all that involved to be a bit more comfortable with the protective measures that we take. I really think, though, that the parents who are the most wary of things are the ones who either don't put their kids in Scouts, or else they come along on the camping trips until they are more comfortable. I don't think holding a meeting would be all that productive. Our leadership is pretty open - I'd hope that anyone that had concerns would come and talk to us.

coed overnight activities even those including parent and childrequire male and female adult leaders, both of whom must be 21 years of age or older, and one of whom must be a registered member of the BSA So I would have immediately agreed that women leaders were fine. There is one way to read the requirement, though, that says that a male leader is required. The activity is coed - you have males and females - therefore you need both genders of leaders. I wouldn't have read it that way - I would think that the "coed" part refers to youth, but I can see that it doesn't say that.

I like this change. Especially after they added the last Cub Scout knot, it felt like there were just way too many of them. I still don't think the criteria are now correct for the Varsity and Venturing leader's knots, but we're getting closer. I do think I'll miss the colors, though. I like the orange and black.