Novice_Cubmaster

Regarding the scout that said, "God's there, but we sure make it awfully confusing." - I'd go to church with that lad any day of the week. Duty to God in our pack is pretty simple (which is how it should be for Cubs...) - we say grace before meals on campouts & at various events. If nothing else, a child should learn that humans cannot take credit for 100% of what they have & that God deserves a thank you from all of us. BTW - "grace" is more than just "thanks for the food...". NC

You know, for a thread that I accidentally started - it's had more than its 15 seconds of fame. NC

Hi Pack, By clicking on "New Topic" instead of "Post Reply" - that's how you start a new thread by accident. Well, that & playing on the internet after a long day. NC

In response to a couple of posts in this thread, I accidentally started a new thread - Jewish Athiests. One thing I've noticed over the year or so that I've been posting is a general assumption that the Jewish half of Judeo-Christian isn't that different from the Christian half. While true in many areas, there are some significant theological differences (besides not believing in the divinity of Jesus). Long story short, while you can't have a Christian Athiest, you can have a Jewish Athiest. And, I would hold that someone who chooses to "follow the rules", without belief in G-d, or fear of eternal judgement, is a highly ethical person. That said, I would hope that a Jewish Athiest, Buddhist Athiest, UU Athiest, or even a just plain Athiest scout - would have enough character to not be a scout. Ahh, the fantasy world I live in... NC

I cannot vouch for the Orthodox viewpoint, but Reform Judaism acknowledges that someone can be Jewish and NOT believe in G-d. If you "follow the rules" and don't follow any other deity - you can be Jewish. Actions count, not belief. Again, this is a Reform point of view - if there are any Orthodox or Conservatives reading this, please don't stone me as a heretic. I have serious doubts about how someone can be both Jewish & an athiest, but it's not my call (that's above my pay grade...). NC

Mazel Tov! I'm thrilled to hear that a Cub has earned his Maccabee! I've seen an Aleph presented at our congregation about 5+ years ago & the rabbi did a short monologue on "Scouting & Judaism" that he put together. I looked around & all the Natl. Jewish Committee on Scouting has to say is... "It is recommended that the emblem presentation be made at a service at the synagogue, pack meeting, or another appropriate and timely event." Basically, bupkis. The BSA has a sample "Ner Tamid" presentation at this link: http://www.scouting.org/media/relationships/scoutsabbathservices/ntpresent.aspx I hope that helps. With a bit more effort, my youngest may get his Aleph this year - so maybe I'll be in the same position as you are 6-9 months from now. NC

2003 - Web2 Leader + all the other 1st time stuff 2004 - Cubmaster By the way, GW - doesn't matter how long they've been driving, folks in the Atlanta area could benefit from taking Drivers Ed ANNUALLY. And just to clarify, that goes for both native Atlantans and transplanted Yankees. NC

Hi All, BobWhite - have to take a different spin on one of your statements: "Since the unit does not belong to the commmittee but to the Charter organization which is represented by the IH, CR, and CC, what path the Co follows is their choice. Their responsibility ois not to do what the committee wants but to follow the Scouting program, its ppoliciies, procedures and methods. " The CO, IH & COR's primary responsibility is to the Charter Organization, not to the scouting program or the scout unit(s) they charter. From my own experience & that of other unit leaders in our area - the less the CO is called upon to settle disputes with their units (of any nature), the happier they are to continue chartering their units. NC

Hi Ami, Don't know about any Native American foods, but our Pack's goal for a Blue & Gold called for feeding a lot of people inexpensively with a minumum of fuss. Hate to say it, but ham does work out really well. So do big premade trays of lasagna (Sam's Club & Costco). You can also try asking local restaurants for food donations - units in our area have in the past had fried chicken donated by Mrs Winners and pizza & salad from Papa Johns. One thing we noticed a while back was that kids in general aren't thrilled by banquets. So, in the last couple of years, we've dropped the banquet & shifted to a pot luck dessert buffet - instead of spending money on food, we used the funds to bring in a "special guest". This year, we're having a snake wrangler come in with a variety of critters to hold & pet. (Creeeps me out, but the kids love it.) And there's always the chance that a python will eat the Friends of Scouting presenter - I hear they taste like chicken. Good luck with what ever you go with. NC

The economy is part of the problem, but not all of it. Cultural differences are another reason we're not reaching minorities. We don't live in a Norman Rockwell USA anymore. Case in point - my youngest son has a learning disability & goes to a school across town that's got the resources; the school's neighborhood population is mostly Hispanic and Bosnian (go figure) - his school has no PTA. Basically, the parents weren't raised in a culture with a PTA-like organization - or possibly even parent involvement; the concept is "foreign" to them. (It's not a language issue - the school newsletter comes out in English, Spanish & Serbo-Croation). I would venture that the concept of scouting is equally "foreign" to many neighborhoods where minorities are the majority. And assimiliation isn't what it was 100 years ago when my paternal grandparents immigrated to the US. Even though urban Black America is a different circumstance, there isn't a widespread tradition of scouting going back generations there either. How do we fix this? Ain't got a clue. NC

Gold Winger, "Panzerlied"??? (OK, I admit it - I sing along whenever the "Battle of the Bulge" is shown uncut, too). Does your unit sing "Lili Marlene" at camp, just before lights out? NC

Fundraising teaching thrift? Have you looked at the price of Trails End popcorn lately? Despite being for a good cause, the markup on Scout popcorn is high enough to discourage a lot of people from buying it. Why - perhaps because THEY'RE thrifty? Of course, if they mark it up high enough, all you've got to do is get 1 scout to sell 1 can every year. NC

Beavah - I gots to know... With 3% of the population being Atheists, would only 97% of Christmas be a federal holiday? NC

Looking at the not so big picture - you've got a Web 1 den that's going to have no leader. A) Make a list of any den parents that you think have the potential to be good leaders, then go down the list and ask them each privately if they'd be willing to be a den leader. Start at the best & keep going until you get at least two. B) If there aren't 2 den parents suitable and willing, then give all the den parents a list of other packs in the area. The important thing is to keep the boys in scouting - if your pack can't provide a den, then maybe another pack can. The one thing to avoid is signing up 2 desparation choices as leaders, then having them flake out partway through the year. Trying to replace them in November - after the den has most likely gotten off to a rocky start - won't be easy. NC

Hi SctDad, Instead of using the parent pin to temporarily attach the badge to the uniform, our awards person fastens a small safety pin to the badge as part of the ceremony setup. At the ceremony, the parent gets the parent pin + card & the scout gets the badge. PS - ask any awards person what's the greatest invention of all time - they'll tell you it's the ziplock bag. NC

Congratulations, Hotdesk! You've got a lot of work AND A LOT OF FUN ahead of you. Delegate is an excellent suggestion - make sure your infrastructure grows along with the number of boys in the pack. Right now, with 6 boys, a small number of leaders can handle just about everything - but add a few more and you'll be playing "catch up". Also, you & your Cubmaster should attend the monthly roundtable in your area - talk to leaders with successful packs & pick their brains. Roundtable is where you'll pick up the tricks of the trade. Again, congratulations & have fun. NC

Hi ManyHats, The one thing we build a campout schedule around is mealtimes. It's really hard to get a good sized group together for games, hikes, etc., if everybody's eating at different times. Plus, it's more fun to eat together. Once you've figured out mealtimes, you end up with breakfast, lunch & dinner splitting the day into two good-sized blocks of time. (Don't forget to include prep & cleanup time for meals too). The morning & afternoon chunks of time are big enough for two activities and a bit of "looking for bugs". It's also OK to have different activities for different age groups. Most packs cover quite a range of attention spans & physical abilities. You can also include "camping duties" for the scouts in the schedule. Pre-dinner time is a great time for the younger scouts to gather tinder & kindling for the night's campfire, older scouts to fill water jugs for cooking. (By the way, if a scout has a whittling chip, he can chop carrots just as easily as carve a stick...). Main thing is, keep'em busy & having fun. NC

Hi Anonymous, A word of warning - make sure you know how your CO feels about scouting before dragging them into the fracas. If the CO isn't committed to scouting, they may decide that chartering your unit isn't worth the effort of settling your problems. NC

Actually, Judaism identifies 613 separate commandments in the Torah (Genesis, Exodus, Leviticus, Numbers & Deuteronomy). These aren't extrapolations on the "big 10" from Mt Sinai; many have to do with temple rituals, some are dietary, others are more civil/legal. I believe the 1st injunction in the Torah that's regarded as a commandment is "Be fruitful and multiply". But I doubt you'll see a monument put up that says, "Put down that pork chop & go be fruitful". NC

Hi 391DenMom, Glad to have you join us. Only got one word of advice, don't try to do too much (because lots of people will sit back and let you do it all). Oh - and make sure you get to spend some time just being your Scout's mom - not just a Den Leader. NC

Packsaddle, You give me too much credit for both botanical knowledge & subtlety. OK - instead of broccoli and cauliflower, let's go with carrots and zucchini. Both tasty, and less likely than broccoli & cauliflower to produce gas. NC

Hi all, NeilLup makes a good point, "Given a completely free choice, would a boy ever eat vegetables or would it be candy every meal?" - yep, my money would be on the candy. But in Scouting, I think the analogy isn't vegetables vs. candy - it's more like broccoli vs. cauliflower. I'm going on the assumption that all units that embrace the goals of scouting and put on a good program - regardless of religious affiliation - are going to help boys grow into good young men. Faith & reverence should be part of scouting; we're not just a bunch of campers. That said, I think some adults (be they parents, scouters or CharterOrgs) are overly fixated on this one aspect of scouting. Hold onto your hats - I'm returning to the topic... A CO is well within its rights to limit unit membership to scouts of its faith (and it is definitely not discrimination). But is this really of any benefit to the scouts themselves? Or is it just important to some percentage of adults? Our kids are growing up in a secular world. I appreciate a mixed unit where my son can see scouters of many religions working together in an environment that hasn't had God & faith "sanitized" out of it. NC

Lets look at this from a boy's point of view for a moment. If given complete freedom of choice, would a boy pick a troop based on his church membership and/or faith? Or would his choice most likely be based on where his friends are, or the appeal of the unit's program? NC

ScoutNut, I have to disagree with you: "BTW - BALOO training is a National training. You will get the same training where ever you take it. You do not have to take it in District, or even in Council." In our council, BALOO training consisted of how to fill out a trip permit, making a hobo meal and listening to a guest speaker talk about camping with Boy Scouts in a primitive site where you had to pack out your own poop. I hope that this isn't the National standard syllabus. Nothing I've seen in BALOO material I received covered the logistics of planning a campout, the advantages/disadvantages of communal meals, etc.. Best bet - go to roundtable & ask around. Call your Roundtable Commissioner a week or two in advance of the next meeting & see if he can hook you up with some pack leaders who put on a good campout. Roundtable's also a good place to get advice on scouts/families that only show up for events, but otherwise don't participate. NC

KISMIF, Recruiting more help sounds like the plan. One suggestion - DON'T make a cattle call request for help at a Pack Meeting. I can almost guarantee, the only parents who'll volunteer are the ones you hoped wouldn't. Instead, get with all the DLs and compare notes - which parents have you seen pitching in at campouts & other events? Who has some necessary skills (for example, if your pack needs a webpage - look for a techno-geek; need a treasurer - look for a CPA). Get a list together of the people that you would want on the committee, and privately approach each one. Good Luck! NC