Basementdweller

Let me see May 23rd is a Thursday night...... Wife is home, No music lessons.....Thursday night is 1/2 price appetizers and margaritas at the local mexican joint before 6........ So looks like Shrimp Fajitas for 2 a couple of margarita and home to the patio for some bourbon and cigars.....Hopefully the neighbors are home I enjoy their company on the patio. Sounds like a great evening. Is there something else happening that is important that day???? I don't think so.

Maybe I am missing something here...... Other than having the gear and physicals what do they need to accomplish before going to Philmont??????/

dedkad..... When I started more than a few years ago.....Every webelo crossed the bridge, they got a troop hat, tshirt, scout book and new epaulets....No small investment from the troop. Many of the boys left the blue and gold never to be seen again. Then they tried the book and epalets....well we still were out $10 if they didn't show up at the troop meeting. Before the Blue and gold, we have a brief parent meeting and discuss their intent......The parents fill out their scouts application for the troop, and transfer papers for any money in their scout account to the troop.....So we are back to.....all the bling...... Everyone who has earned their AOL is called up and participates in that ceremony.....The boys and parents who are not joining the troop are asked to return to their seat after the presentation. The boy and parents who are joining the troop stay on stage.....The parents participate in the ceremony and it is as much for them to realize that their scout is on a different adventure.....Not one where mom dad and the sibs tag along. The boy crosses the bridge alone to his brothers in the troop.......

KDD you are incorrect...... My COR has a document signed by every institutional head since 1978 that state the Troop gear is solely owned and property of the troop.....The church youth group borrowed it without permission and did significant damage, from hundreds to thousands of dollars depending on the version you wish to believe. Our gear is stored were the church and church members do not have access to it.

More youth sport parent types like the ceremony where everyone crosses the bridge.....Ya know everyone get the trophy..... Only the webelos that join boy scouts cross the bridge......that means a completed application in the den leaders hand........So if your scout isn't sure about it he doesn't cross the bridge. Hard feelings a couple of times......but it just isn't proper for a boy who isn't going to join the troop cross it.......Explain to me exactly what they are crossing too.

Ozark trail tents are complete garbage......The fiberglass poles on the ones we tried splintered in a couple of uses....The flys are not full length flys resulting in some pretty significant water issues......I am sure there are different models the 4 man we had was complete garbage..... While REI has a 100% lifetime guarantee, I don't know that I could ask them to honor that warranty for troop owned tents........Just doesn't feel very scout like....

Not in our council.....

Well you need to resign as soon as possible.....The troop committee needs to begin a search for someone the Troop Parent trust and believe in. If the parents don't believe in your leadership that means the boys probably don't either. Far as that goes why does your troop even need a SM if your going to be intimidated by a parent, lawyer or not. You can't run an effective program if your going to worry about Parents sueing you because little Jimmy Crappycamper didn't get nominated to the OA because Mr Evil Krampus with held his recommendation because in his opinion he isn't ready, whether it is skill or maturity, it is your opinion and your recommendation... .Far as that goes how can the SMC and BOR be even remotely impartial or fair...... Your story is sad, bordering on tragic.... I can't wait to hear the story of this young mans crappy eagle project and your troop committee is stuck with what to do... So it ain't so bad bein poor after all...

Fred is full of it....or his council just isn't running it right....... Like MB I have filled out a dozen or so apps over the years. First the cub pack and troop are separate organizations..... You would have to make application to join......If they do it at recharter time we are required include a new application with the charter as well as a youth protection certificate.

So bottom line here is you want some sort of rule or measuring stick to justify to the parents that their little darling just ain't good enough to represent your troop in the OA. Sorry pal, there isn't one. The justification is in my View Tommy Crappycamper, while a member of the BSA and a first class rank scout meets two of the requirements....I, his SM, have spent countless hours camping, hiking and scouting with the young man and don't feel he is ready for the OA at this point. If mom and dad complain then read to them from the OA membership page [h=3]Purpose[/h] As Scouting’s National Honor Society, our purpose is to: Recognize those who best exemplify the Scout Oath and Law in their daily lives and through that recognition cause others to conduct themselves in a way that warrants similar recognition. Promote camping, responsible outdoor adventure, and environmental stewardship as essential components of every Scout’s experience, in the unit, year-round, and in summer camp. Develop leaders with the willingness, character, spirit and ability to advance the activities of their units, our Brotherhood, Scouting, and ultimately our nation. Crystallize the Scout habit of helpfulness into a life purpose of leadership in cheerful service to others. Keep complaining about the quality of the BSA and then act powerless to do anything about it....... The power is in our hands, but many SM's and Troop lack the backbone to use it......Scout spirit and SM recommendation.......I am guessing that the OA election and membership is an expectation in your troop???? So a boy gets his nights camping and rank he is a shu in?? It will never be that way in a troop I am SM of. You don't want to make Mr and Mrs Crappycamper upset....that is your right......But you have now lost the right to complain about the poor quality of the youth.

another post from either an Ipad or Iphone. Paragraphs are your friend...... Find another Pack is the easiest solution. Sounds like your CC/CM is finished with Cub scouting. He is looking for the door but just hasn't found it yet. Speak to the COR/wife and mention you would like to be CM....Being a stay at home mom you have plenty of time to run the pack. He can't just put your name on the charter as CM with out an application to go along with it.......It might just be our council, but everytime you change position you are required to submit a fresh application. No, is always a valid answer and response especially if you did not say yes to being a leader. Far as the cc/CM planning stuff, a pack isn't a one man show....so volunteer to plan the Fall Pack campout. Didn't like the pinewood derby, start planning now to improve it..... Failing to plan is planning to fail.

correction the additional discount was April 15th and I paid by the deadline so we got the extra 15% off. I am going to ask the jambo contingent to bring them back if they could....I am friends with one of the troops SM.

they offered an additional discount if you ordered before May 1st...... While all of he gear isn't a bargain. and I am flabbergasted by the $2k mountain bikes. The tents fit my budget. [url=https://summit.scouting.org/en/Jamboree2013/Documents/5741_Jam_Selloff-R8.pdf]https://summit.scouting.org/en/Jamboree2013/Documents/5741_Jam_Selloff-R8.pdf[/url=https://summit.scouting.org/en/Jamboree2013/Documents/5741_Jam_Selloff-R8.pdf]

Why require Field uniforms, Class A, for anything other than a pack meeting..... Use the activity shirt for everything else. Short of a parade or collecting food for scouting, then the boys wear the Pack tshirt.....Problem solved. No need to over analyse it. Just do it.

Make a huge effort to greet every parent that comes in the door to the meetings....Learn their first names, know their kids names, know where they work.....Make small talk with them. Know where their kids go to school and know what is happening at that school. At this point you are saying what the heck.... Your Pack is lacking a sense of community. To engage the parents you need to make them a member of the community.....I went from a one man show, like you are now, to working myself out of a job in about a three year period. The first year was spent learning the playing field, who was who, the wolves and the sheep and getting parents to step up for small jobs. The second year was building pack leadership, getting Assistant den leaders, Assistant Cubmasters and more committee members. Honestly the boys don't care and most will be just as happy sitting at home in front of the video game console. You need to get the parents to buy in at Cub age. If you do it right and become SM for the troop, all of those parents will follow to the troop and best of all, you have already set the stage and will continue to reap the rewards for building that community.

NO the UC should not be a member of the unit they serve. this removes them from the internal politics and gives the Unit an independent and unbiased feedback. A UC should not hold any other position in the BSA as well....that comes from the commisioners guide book.

You guys are ridiculous....I was a teenage boy, what did I know about the world????? The guy was different, his uniform was always ironed with creases, Patches perfect, perfectly shahved and he wore aftershave or something....He was very different from our dads. He was a youth member of the troop and everyone accepted him for who he was.......To my knowledge there was never an issue...... It was a different time in the 70'S as well......Outing someone took more effort.....you simply didn't shoot a txt or email to council to do it.....You had to either call and do it verbally, hand write a letter or type a letter on a manual type writer then put it in the mail box. To much of an effort for most parents. in the 70's chase out gays wasn't a big BSA priority.....Nor was chasing out all of the child molesters.......They were too busy merging councils and selling camps off.

Well Krampus if your not going to improve the quality of scouting with local quality control then you simply don't have a right to complain about it. I would hold him back because he is marginal in his abilities. Just a national honor society doesn't admit students with c averages, I don't think the OA should either. It is a SM discretionary thing......you think he is marginal....Don't put him on the ballot.....If he is interested as to why, he can come ask you....It just might be the kick in the pants he needs to get going. Or he just might not be that interested in scouting. Bottom line Marginal skills Marginal motivation Marginal interest Marginal Maturity All add up to no go in my book...I withhold my recommendation as is my right to do so..... If your worried about being a bad guy or the boy hating you for it????? So a friend asked for an honest opinion, do you lie to him....NO, but depending on your relationship you could give him the blunt truth or you could candy coat it.....But you are honest with him. Why do we feel the need to send 12 and 13 year olds to the ordeal anyway????? I was 15 when I attended mine and a life scout...... So are you going to be part of the problem or a start of the solution???

the camp our troop traditionally attends does not have a fantastic first year program two years ago 28 to 1 ratio, the boys didn't learn a thing and lost a year of summer camp in my opinion...... This is the summer camp the past SM and many of the committee members attended as youth and they are resisting change. There are many things about the camp I do not like....from the many troops racing around camp on gators and golf carts picking up and delivering boys to merit badges. they generate an amazing amount of dust, nothing better than have one of them dust you just while you are walking back from the shower house....To the dining hall situation.....then the racist comments over the last two summers from other campers and adults. The merit badge instruction wasn't all that great as well. Time for a change. The PLC is looking at different Summer camps for 2014....Frielander, Frontier and Ramsburg.....we will be visiting all three. While the first year program might not be high on their list of things to look into.....I will recommend we go take a look at it.

Most of my February Cross overs have already completed tenderfoot and are working on second class currently.

So Tam....You just take the Camp Staffs word they completed the requirements????? so how do you know if they acquired the skill to the level your comfortable with. I would never delegate my scouts rank advancement to something as Cub Scouty as a first year program at resident camp, which in many cases is day care for your new scouts. While my boys attend one, They do not just get an auto pass on the requirements when we leave camp..... We cover the tenderfoot/Second Class material on the weeks following camp at the troop meetings and the SPL and PL's sign off when the boys have demonstrated the skill to their satisfaction. In my opinion these programs are in part responsible to the Low quality of the current Youth Scouts, and their lazy SM's are also to blame..

I get all that. My questions was what criteria other than "I don't think he's ready because xxx" can be used? I ask because if there are no standard critera, such as are outlined in the GTA around what being "active" requires, then any scoutmaster recommendation (or denial) becomes arbitrary. Krampus.....I can't find the reply but you said your SM as a youth only put the best scouts up for election to the OA.......You didn't know why? You blame this day and age.... So what is so different now from back then???? Why do current leaders not hold their scouts to the same standards as back then???? I would never feel pressured to put a scout up for election if he didn't meet the standard........ As SM it is my right and I will do my part to improve the quality of Scouting.....

Bottom line......The trek leader is not your decision. The boys have spoken, have confidence in there decision. Get over it. Far as the team building nonsense goes......I think it is over blown for philmont......You share experiences, meals and carrying gear.....The boys will figure it out very quickly once you arrive. Why the 100 mile hike commitment since last august???? if it is conditioning it is a complete waste of time.....You need 3-5 miles a day for any results. 139 miles in 10 months is not any sort of an accomplishment.......that is 14 miles a month or 3.5 miles per week......For a young man that is less than an hour a week of walking, my scout runs 3-5 most every evening. Runner guy probably surpassed that total in a month or two. Park your personal feelings......... Remember this is the boys trip not yours. Suggestion......go and have fun.......Let the boys run the trek and don't worry about it......They will figure it out or will miss some activities.....

Search on trailers on the forum..... From video game systems to showers.....One troop mounted flat panels so the adults can watch the big game in theirs.......

inner city boys are wigged out by the bugs........ It just boggles my mind as well......many live in coach roach infested homes......We have had several with bed bug issues.... But see a daddy long leg or mosquito you thought the world ended.... Tents really helped me get the boys more interested in a more active outdoor program. We put our order in for some 2013 Jambo tents......a bargain at $38 bucks.......I can outfit for the new patrol for about $200 plus shipping