Basementdweller

Yep, your questions are to a very specific point.... Here is how your post reads Despite my troops poor program how can I make sure MY son can earn this award????? I discussed it with my son and the PLC a year or two a go......they were interested but did not pursue it. sure I am disappointed. but this isn't my scouting journey.

DAD this is not cub scouting...Back off.....Your boy is what 10. Let him enjoy his patrol mates and get to first class. Let him learn his knots, how to pitch a tent, plan and cook a meal on his own. Learn first aid, swim........Let him be a boy..........

Under the auspices......Means during a scouting function or event....as mentioned earlier.... your out of line again. You should discuss it with your son. Maybe coach him how to approach the PLC about it and maybe help him promote it. But the bottom line is the boys need to decide to do it. If they say no.....then shelve it for a year and then bring it back up......... In my opinion it is a far superior award to Eagle. the award means a lad has took his BSA experience and got every last drop of adventure. I would like for my son or a member of my troop to earn it....But they simply are not interested in it. Being short sighted as young men are.

KDD since your going to be a knucklehead. I hope you still don't share a tent with your scout.....Seriously. The boy should be sleeping with his patrol....We do not permit parents to sleep with their scouts......Generally the boys don't want to sleep with dad..... When my troop started backpacking we used plastic sheeting.....we used treking poles or rope suspended between two trees......10x10 or 20x10, gives you a floor worked really well 3mil or better if you can find it..... so you want the cheapest solution......Plastic sheeting and a couple pieces of rope....Not bug proof, no floor Condensation can be an issue depending on how you pitch it........But it is lightweight, water proof and cheap. We experimented with tyvek to make our tents....but it was too fragile for the boys. So KDD tell me exactly how many nights you have Backpacking????? How many miles a year????? I bet is going to be zero or less than 10... So while you have an opinion.....It is not based on first hand experience..... But what you have read or may have heard...... The older guys backpack 3 times a year......plus the intro trip with the new guys.....We average about 100 miles or so a year..... I am hoping that I can talk the PLC into going to the Dolly Sods in WV instead or the trips we have already completed. I ordered Jamboree tents for general troop use....They are 3 or 4 man....they weigh 18 pounds a piece... There are many hammock hangers here......I will say it isn't for everyone. I will spend three weeks in it this summer, Troop resident camp, webelos camp and troop backpacking trip. So the extra comfort and expense is warranted in my opinion.......

Ya it will get reported then activities and gear will get banned....and more steps moving us from the outdoors to the indoors....

So what are your thoughts regarding your tent purchase??? Solely for backpacking???? Troop car camping as well?????? A car camping tent will not backpack well and a backpacking tent is'nt all that comfortable. It is about weight.....The more crap you put in your pack the heavier it will be and typically the less fun you will have.... I like a full fly tent regardless of the weather, You can pitch it with out the fly or put the fly on and leave it rolled up high on the tent... Then when that late afternoon thunderstorm rolls thru your good..... We got stuck in our tents one evening for 12 hours it was november and just about dark so it was all good.....Poured buckets for way to many of those hours.... My guys were all dry...It was a good thing it was a 4-6 hour walk back to the cars in the morning..... I like vestibule......Keeps muddy boots and gear out of the interior...... I like Two doors....So your not crawling over each other I like the door to secure to the top of the opening....Marmot secures to the bottom and the screens get buggered up. I like free standing.....Less likely to have to get out of the tent in the rain to reposition a stake.... I like full fly I like lower profile....less wind issues and the smaller guys can manage them...... I shop a lot on steep and cheap.....I picked up enough backpacking tents to equip the troop.....We use Sierra Design Zolo2 and Marmot limelight 2's.....The zolo is 8 feet long too..... Looking at your cabelas tent.....It doesn't have a vestibule.....A two man tent without a vestibule is a one man tent.....for the price you could buy two......but the tent weighs 5 pounds which is a bit much for a solo shelter.....Depending on where you go the might not allow solo tents.... I hammock when I can......but that is another thread.Warbonnett blackbird, hammock gear quilts, Super fly......Not as light as a tent but much more comfortable.

More bad advice

Spoken like a true blooded Cubical dweller

I think Q wrote in some past post..... "As an SM my job is to take the boys to see the face of god, Just not leave them there." I really like it..... whether it is a misty dewy sunrise with turkeys gobblin,, a sunset off the tooth of time or rappelling off a 200 foot cliff...... Shame it is getting buried in the paperwork.

So is Woodbadge responsible for the Prissy Troops????? I think it is at least partly responsible.... I am an advocate for Advance Outdoor skills course AOS...... To be an SM you are required to take this course....To be an ASM you must take IOLS..... Because in this day and age.....More and More gals and inexperience men are stepping up to be SM and simply don't have a clue.

Ya know I watched a philmont documentary where two female leaders took a crew out.....The cameraman was a man so I am not sure if that made a difference..... I wonder if they will be allowed out when they get there????? I found this under coed overnight night activities policy http://www.scouting.org/scoutsource/HealthandSafety/GSS/gss01.aspx#f

Once the merit badge is signed as complete there is nothing you can do about it.......Partials on the other hand..... I have rejected partials....One mom and scout showed up with a camp partial....I sat down at the table to speak to scout and mom kept interrupting......sent mom away so I could speak with scout.....Scout could not answer one question about the merit badge..... I told mom that I was willing to work with the lad to complete it but I would not be signing today...... Well I never saw them again.

So your going to hand the PLC the JTE sheet and tell them you want gold.. I think your way off base......The don't care about it......It is an adult thing.... Let the boys plan their outings, let them recruit their friends....Let them have fun and adventure......Don't burden them with paper work that is complete BS. So would you have them fill out the tour permit too???? Like I said earlier.....The absolute worst Troop in our District is Gold level.. When I say worst, I mean wood craft and first aid........

I don't think much of JTE or it's predecessors....It is a guide for the clueless. I would never burden them with that document......Heck my DE fills mine out for me so it is all good. I was poking fun at a unit who is jte gold and I feel is a parlor unit and will give us scouts that can't start fires, tie knots or know how to way find.

Isn't that exactly what they did to him???? Your going down the wall son....Cause nobody walks down the stairs.

remember the books aren't revised all that often.....I would count kickball.....I believe it met the intent of the requirement.

Isn't the point to go find a cliff to rappel down....Hike/backpack into it.......Spend the day rappeling.....hike out or spend the night.....A thing called adventure I appreciate the rappeling tower is easier and that most camps don't have cliffs. While a tower is great for webelos to go up look over the edge, cry, whimper and then climb the stairs back down...Not much adventure to it...... Several of my scouts are in the process of becoming rappel masters.

I am entertained by the Eagle with palms thing...... To me it says I like summer camp.....So instead of having some adventure I chose to sit in a merit badge class........ Yep ran into a number of Eagles that couldn't build a fire....... I have super outdoorsman dad who used an entire butane lighter to get his campfire started.....

I am entertained by Rappel down a tower...... what happened to a cliff????

Ya my first summer camp was $22 and I went a second week and it was $15.... I had to borrow money from mom and she made a huge deal about it and my poor planning......Heck I didn't even know I could go for a second week.... Fred.....It was a different time, growing up my parents had one car, one TV and we didn't have cable TV, cell phones or internet, Now everyone has two cars, motorcycles, boats, a TV in every room in the house and honestly more disposable income than probably ever.... Camping was probably pretty comparable in cost....The big difference I see is the access to property to camp on free or cheap and local donations. Our troop camped on a one of about 8 farms for free.....Cost for a campout was $3-5 for the weekend and the canoe guy let us go free. Now we have $100 for a campsite then we have to pay for canoes or rappelling.....or what ever the program is.....Our camporees are $15 a head just to register....then another $15 for food.....

Did I ever tell you about the 19 year old Eagle scout that couldn't tie a square knot at IOLS when I was on staff?????? His dad was his SM imagine that

you forgot the metrosexual scouter Metrosexual is a neologism, derived from metropolitan and heterosexual, coined in 1994 describing a man (especially one living in an urban, post-industrial, capitalist culture) who is especially meticulous about his grooming and appearance, typically spending a significant amount of time and money on shopping as part of this. These gentlemen.....have the $200 campaign hat that is perfect....The uniform that is absolutely perfect. they have the latest LL Bean or REI gear...They show up driving a Suburban that looks like it is equipt for the outback........Yet their scouts lack the basic advertised skills.....They like the idea of camping and hiking but cannot stand the physical discomfort to actually do it. My favorite metrosexual scouter is SM of the parlor troop I make reference too in some of my posts......They score JTE Gold...They camp Three times a year including a summer resident camp....their boys make first class in a year......How is that possible??? Every boy who is eligble to join the OA is a member but they never show to the chapter meetings, OA meets at the same location as RT. To be fair........the BSA isn't any more or less prissy than it was 50 years ago.....It depends on the Adults who manage the program........Regardless of what Kudu says......The adults control the program.....Old Metro guy who doesn't like to camp, isn't going to take the guys backpacking for a week or two in the Daniel Boone national forest. he is more comfortable with renting an air conditioned cabin at mammoth cave. Is either right or wrong??? No. But with that said, Every Eagle scout should have the advertised skills.

I wouldn't cave to a single parent or grandparent........2cd said....let him finish it over the summer. The threat that he won't attend the B&G if he doesn't receive the award, what kind of threat is that??? So they are cheating their scout out of the experience..... Now I am king of chasing boys in scouting.......I can't tell you how much time I wasted chasing boys because they need scouting........Well it only took oh 5 or 6 years to figure it out.... Focus on the boys and families who want to be in scouting.

So CA did you just assign the position and the lad did as best as he could or did he actually go and get the training http://www.scouting.org/scoutsource/OutdoorProgram/OutdoorEthics/LeaveNoTraceTrainer.aspx

Simple fix...hold a booking night....everyone go show up at your house or CO with their credit card and book everybodys flight at the same time on the same flight. I wouldn't pay another couple of hundred bucks each for a group reservation. While I like Packs solution, I don't know if I could do that to a 14 year old.