Basementdweller

It is one boy in the troop. I am an ASM and a part time one at that, The Pack didn't meet that night and I happened to be helping go thru the books in prep for the BOR and noticed things I knew happened and didn't happen first hand. The reason they were thrown out of the Patrol area was the kid was bragging and waving the steak under everyone noses and making the scene. My point on the requirement thing......everyone here beats the don't add requirements drum. IMHO everything that has been said is correct.....The boy needs to sleep, eat, travel and be with his patrol. Now to get the SM and CC to bring down the hammer.

Show me in the requirement, that he can't sleep with DAD, he helped set the tent up, I think he unrolled it, but that is still helping. Dad packed his backpack for him, He arrived dressed for the outing and his gear was in a big duffle. He helped the patrol make friday dinner, hot dogs and chips...... The family knows the requirements and they are doing exactly what he needs to advance. Spineless, fair enough. So what do we do just boot him out of the troop???? Yes he and dad camped with us....both memorable including the boy melting down when we threw him and his steak out of the patrol dining area.

Dad is not an eagle, Mom's family are all eagles. We have caught them doing an end around with the ASM's and PL's getting requirements signed off. Requiring us to institute a policy of only SM signing off, this was about two weeks ago, when we caught Dad coaching son thru the three R's and hoodwinking the PL.

He sleeps with dad if he stays at camp.....otherwise they will drive him in for saturday with the troop. He stayed at a nearby motel for summer camp last year because the tents had spiders. Yet he claims full participation in these outings. When he stays he brings his own food and cooks (well dad cooks for him) separate. One night he and dad ate steaks in front of us, we ran them out of the patrol areas. He refuses to participate in the patrol cooking, "Because I am not eating it, I am not going to cook it or clean it". Boys let him skate on this one. Last couple of outings he never told us he was coming because I am not eating the food I am not going to pay to camp. No declared food allergies. yes the SM is in agreement, the rank is second class.(This message has been edited by Basementdweller)

So What is scout spirit???? Setting up a tent in the rain with no complaint? Sleeping with your patrol instead of your dad? Complaintless service? Attending all the outings???? Or merely being active To me scout spirit is a lot of things that may seem pretty intangible..... First is attitude, is it raining????? Does the scout care and is he complaining???? Help around camp with out being asked? Does he attend work days as well as fun days??? Service to others.....does he participate, willingly?????? The reason I ask is we have psyco family with boy who comes from a family of eagles. Psyco son can't sleep with his patrol, eat meals provided at camp and attends service projects for minutes instead of hours. His BOR is coming up, In his book I noticed he documented the full work days and full campout despite not sleeping over or working the full day. I called the SM and Dad over to discuss the problem, it ended pretty heated with Dad not being real happy. The only thing I said was a scout is trustworthy and dad exploded. So would I be out of line in clueing the CC and committee as to what is going on?????

Good luck with showing people decent gear. You will still have familys showing up with the 39 dicks tent special and walmart sleeping bags. We tried to to gear education for years. people just don't care until they are soaking wet and cold. After that they will never camp again.

If a patrol comes to me and says Mr. B can we camp with out the rest of the troop........ I would never tell them no. And ya know that is all that really matters. Besides, Taking a troop of 20 backpacking is poor backcountry edict. Taking a Patrol Backpacking is much more appropriate. You forever read about entire troops taking over shelters and designated camping areas on the AT.

26 belt loops submitted.........as gate keeper of Pack funds, you bet your @#$ I am going to ask for proof, we are talking $60-70 bucks or so. That equates to $280 in popcorn sales... No it is not adding to the requirements, we are not talking about rank advancement. We had a parent do the exact same thing....We asked for proof, she backed down and the completed got cut in half.(This message has been edited by Basementdweller)

I am doing that currently. I am CM and ASM and Crew Advisor. of the three CM is the most difficult, dealing with all of the parents. As ASM you simply help as requested, and I am usually the second adult on outings. My first job as ASM was to act as troop guide to my freshly crossed over weebs. We had a work day where we went thru their patrol box and gear. We set it all up and cleaned it and then went for pizza. In a boy lead troop ASM isn't that bad or hard a job and I use it to recharge my batterys when Cubbing exhaust me and gets me down. I agree with your wife that you need to step back and let your son have his own scouting experience. Now make sure you schedule a get away weekend with her..I see your in Ohio...I am thinking a nice Bed and Breakfast, Amish country, The Inn at Honey Run is an outstanding choice. There are some others if your interested PM me. I make sure my wife is taken care of, we have monthly date night, Japanese steak house, a night of dancing, and 3 times a year we have Mom and Dad only weekend. I have seen scouting cause too many divorces.

What I did with my leaders that could not or would not get trained was bring a couple of laptops to the committee or leaders meeting and had them do it there. If he can't read. meet him at somewhere with a wifi hotspot and help him create an account and help read him the questions and answer them. It seems pretty easy to me. Of course my volunteers can't pass background checks.....this is easy compared to that.

I would refuse to pay for 26 belt loops.....that simple. I would send the parent to the scout shop to buy them......I bet he gets every single one if they make the trip. The parent is flat out lying about it. I would pick a couple out that have requirements that say make a poster and present to the den or pack meeting and say ok.....when did they do this.....or make a scrap book or make and have them present this. I would no simply award them without proof and remind them a scout is trust worth. Then remind them that as a Scout leader you are thrifty and before you spend money will need evidence that the work was completed. I have had a couple of parents do the same thing, Some have presented work, others have not..... Belt loops are not something to be presented at a Blue and Gold banquet or pack meeting anyways, the boys should get them as soon as possible after earning them. Just my 2 cents. No way........

As a scouter the best gift you could give me is spending that money on your son, so when he is on his first troop outing he is properly equipt. That way I can quit hauling around all that extra gear of unprepared scouts. Your gift is out of line.

the biggest problem with backpacking troops is it transfers cost to the families. The boys I serve simply don't have $100 to sink into a Backpack and a a better sleeping bag. Plus all of those little cans of iso butane are pretty expensive especially if you take 10 boys out 2 per stove that means 5 cans.......at 6 bucks a piece. I have taken the boys backpacking, we slept under plastic sheeting we used for tarps, used wally world backpacks, we only went 4 miles in and set up camp. I see this as what Venturing is for......

the problem with homemade stoves is the G2SS now forbids them and limits the fuels that can be used...... the verbage for the fuel is not recommended for acholol stoves. Approved chemical-fueled equipmentCommercially manufactured equipment, including stoves, grills, burners, heaters, and lanterns that are designed to be used with chemical fuels. Prohibited chemical-fueled equipmentEquipment that is handcrafted, homemade, modified, or installed beyond the manufacturers stated design limitations or use. Examples include alcohol-burning can stoves, smudge pots, improperly installed heaters, and propane burners with their regulators removed.

qwazse First off I am not naive enough to believe my boy scouts are abstaining from sex.....So them bringing their girl friends along is irrelevant......and what makes it an official patrol outing anyhow????? Why couldn't they just go camping on their own.....we have patrols participate in paintball outside of scouting???? Second I am involved in scouting nearly every weekend. The troop, crew, pack or den usually has something going on.......So to add the Patrol camp out or two wouldn't be that big a deal. The entire family is involved....... I would bring the wife along and we would camp on the other side campground. No big deal. As far as 4 patrols goes, The SM takes his wife or parent, the other asm takes his wife or parent.......Again, communication and planning on OMG the adults part. Our job is to help them navigate the rules, and help provide means to the program they want.. You guys are so dramatic, it just simply isn't the end of the world. If one of our patrols want to camp on their own, this won't stop it.

At one point our Pack had 50% of the youth ADD/ADHD and all sorts of developmental problems. I took some classes at the local childrens hospital to help me understand how they work and think. To be real honest everything I would have done with them would have been not the best solution.

I just don't see it as a big deal. Sorry the adults go and simply don't associate with the boys and let them do there thing.

So what, The SM and assistant camp on the other side of the campground and hang out around the camp fire, go fishing or what ever they like. And honestly, I do not know a single troop that does Patrol camping. Not a single one in our entire district. So it is just over blown.....

Lone scout is not what this young man needs or craves......He needs socialization... He wants to be with boys who love scouting as he does. Lone scout is a horrible idea. Talk to the SM, I bet he will allow it.

I find it entertaining that a post about a new adult reward gets 129 posts, much more than the normal amount. Who says scouting is for the boys? Sad really sad

How about lower prices and Quality Up to date gear

Trainer lady I would talk to the SM of the troop he would be crossing over too and see if they would let him be a guest until he is old enough to join. I would ask the CM and advancement chair to award him his AOL early and then bid them farewell. At this late date you are not going to change them and no sense wasting the energy trying, far as training goes, I have found it is perception, Trained leaders can run a pack just as poorly as untrained leaders. Just because you know the rules and guidelines doesn't mean your going to follow them. far as the den leaders scheduling maliciously, it is a matter of opinion. I know that I cannot make everyone happy when I schedule an event. I hope his parents did not sign off on his requirement completion.......With 3 summer camps they really didn't need to.... The logic I am following is, since his den or pack does not do summer camp, no loss since they are not treating him like another of the boys, no loss Name calling, no loss Unmotivated unscout like leaders, no loss Ask for them to award it early then bid them farewell. We have a boy who is guest of the troop, of course he doesn't understand or even care, he is in scouting and having a blast. I would sign him up for Cub camp this summer and take him just like prior years and in the fall I would have him attend the troop meetings and outings.

We have built cars day of the derby....they are not pretty but the boy raced.

lisa is correct with the background check. I have lost many a volunteer because either the will not submit to it or fear they can't pass. in most cases I have also lost the scout because of it. I lost my potential ACM because he failed the background check......I was just told unsuitable by the DE.....not sure why....he admittedly raised some cane as a young man. It is the only thing I can figure.

Please...... If you have to ask then you should already know your wrong. Have them write three letters, it will take a whooping 10 minutes more. Remember these are 10 year olds, it doesn't need to be all that fancy. In BS it sometimes is a tougher pill to swallow. The problem with double dipping at the webelos level it sets the expectation up for double dipping later on.