Basementdweller

Well it wasn't that bad after all. Simple fix. Pick him up on a saturday morning stop by for breakfast, coffee or bagel and go up to the scout shop......Wonder the shop while he does the advancement shopping.

There are two separate discussions going on here......Boy Scouting vs Cub Scouting. One annual District camporee is great by me. They have three a year and with other troop commitments that would suck up more than half of our programing year. Cubs do not lead themselves. One troop in our District has 29 ASM's and they have next to zero participation at the district level. I know one of the District folks approached the SM and CC for the troop and asked why they don't have better adult participation at the district level.....they are doing the same thing I am doing......district program is so horrible they do their own thing.

An excellent question OGE. I did a quick search and nothing banning gay coaches turned up. The problem with the question is most 10 or 11 year olds are not sent away for the weekend with their little league coach. Most of the interaction takes place on an open field. Most youth sports is that way, you haul your kid to the playing field drop them off or sit and watch them practice. The potential for sexual abuse is very very low. There is something very terrifying to the bible thumpers about their son spending some time around a campfire with a gay fellow. The best thing I can equate this too, is the violent video games.......Does every boy who plays Call of duty become a murder. No. will every boy who associated with a gay scouter become gay.....no. Personally I think the violent video games are more of a problem than a gay scouter.

this is how we loose the ability to sell at store fronts.

Well 5 years ago my son entered scouting as a tiger. It took a couple of years for me to find my feet. As a youth I just went along with the program, I had no clue about districts and such. Mercifully, well maybe not, middle of the wolf year I attended some training in a neighboring District on ADD/ADHD and autism. What an eye opener, They had Activities, a lot of cub activities. So I asked our GOBC at roundtable why we didn't have any cub activities. They replied there was no Cub activities chairman. Next month I told them I would do it.......Then began the series of road blocks......First well you can't run cub programs with out having taken wood badge......then the whole you can't run an unofficial/official district pinewood derby and the emails saying that it was not a sanction event. Well I took woodbadge, jumped thru the GOBC's extra hoops. The District commisioner fired everyone else in the district. Ending the GOBC's rein. I thought my original meeting was to join the activities committee for the cubs. I very quickly learned that old GOBC was replaced by a new one. This quest simply began as an attempt to put on programs for my son and I to participate in. Well my son has been in troop for 18 months so our opportunity was missed. My taking the Pack out of council and district is nothing more that seeking programing for my scouts. No political moves or statements involved, We have ZERO cub programing in our district so they cannot complain about that. Our pack has grown from less than 10 scouts to nearly 100 in three years. We now have 25 transfers from neighboring Packs. We have 100 scouts and familys going to a halloween camp this weekend. why do they come? The camping, the outings, the programing, the field trips.....Every year we get on our local network news during station visits or meteorologist visits. It is a shame that we need to drive hours, sometimes multiple hours to events because our district does not put on things more locally.

As I watch the world and ecomonys leaving "us" behind I read scoutmoms post. My world is not monoculture or monochromatic. Lots of those and thems in these posts. It is pretty easy to judge from the land of Lexus and 60" flat screens. did it ever occur to anyone that in the real world you isolated scouts will have to actually deal with these folks, maybe on a daily basis. If you have never been to a party hosted by a gay couple you are missing one fantastic event. they know how to put on a really great party. My cousin is gay, he and his life partner put on one heck of a christmas party. If you can drop your prejudice long enough to chat with them you will for get their sexual orientation. Bottom line is if a scouter is acting out his homosexuality in front of the boys he's gone, Just as if a heterosexual couple is acting out in front of the boys.

We were targeted, because in the announcement phase of round table, the event organizer had a leader ask if he could bring his son's friend with him and it was ok. I raised my hand immediately and was told to put it down as my question would not be answered. Moose webelos woods around our parts is a weekend program where the Troops host their Pack and introduce the Webs to boy scouting. But the core of the weekend is the advancement, they can do major portions of a couple hard to do activity pins.....Naturalist, outdoorsman, geologist and forester.

Sacrifice??????? I have never sacrificed my time for scouting. If you feel that way you should quit.

I don't think the DE cares.......We have 21 refugees from other Packs now. I spoke with him about them and his response was, Well at least they are not quitting.

The popcorn store front crap has nothing to do with the district committee. Just rude adult scouters. Our schools and surround homes are in an area of urban blight, All of the stores were forced out long ago because of theft, robbery and no profits. Our home school base is bounded by 8 lane highways on all sides. Rich folks to the north, South, more poor folks east and west. The poor folks get along pretty well, but if we cross the highway north or south. They get pretty up set with us.

Moose.... The District would not let our boys attend our districts webelos woods because each boy could not have a parent with them. I circumvented their rule by finding a district/council that would take us with out every boy having an adult in tow. I got a tour plan and we went The District webelos woods event we attended was in a neighboring council and was very affordable. The boys had a blast They said that I violated the Cub scout Family camping rules by taking the Webelos den camping with out an adult for every scout. It was irrelevant that it was to a Boy Scout Council event and I followed the events rules on adult to scout ratios. Big Sigh.

ya know BS...... Last FOS presentation they set a goal for us. it was $1k, this is what they said a pack our size needs to donate. We had no input on that $$$ amount. Well we didn't and he came to me and expected me to make up the difference out of my pocket. Heck I already donated half of what the Pack collected. Then the phone calls and emails started. We needed to meet our obligations. We only collected a couple of hundred dollars. So the threat is irrelevant.....

Ya know trev...... I have leaders who I suspect are gay or lesbian.......They are some great people. Ya know what I am going to do about my suspicions, absolutely nothing. I am not going to ask them their sexual orientation, it really isn't any of my business. Sure the rule book and bible thumpers will beat me up. I simply don't care. The BSA is rich white and suburban for the most part, they don't want the rest of us to play.

Ya know moose if they want to revoke the packs charter for taking the boys camping out of council...... they can do it. But then I would take the entire story to the media. I can see the by line now....."Boy Scout group disbanded for going camping". I have not violated any rules, have all the training including some that was added by the district. Filed the right paper work. They don't like that I don't need their program.

Oh they can't do it. I know it, the only thing they can do is not approve my tour plans. they are mad, because they Blocked my Webelos den from attending our districts webelos woods by requiring a parent for each boy. I found another one out of council that would take my boys with a 4-1 ratio of scouts to adults. they are mad we go out of council to webelos resident camp. Mad because we are not posting our popcorn sales to the district website. So the repercussions of no tour plan is?????????????? I am guessing we have a case of the New good old boys club. I really don't care what they say, This is my last interaction with them. I tried a couple of years ago and the results were bad, I am done now. The meeting was supposed to be about putting on some district wide cub events. I had some thoughts, and it turned into the District inquisition. I just hope this does not impact my son, most of these guys are also on the district advancement committee. The FOS threat is pretty hollow, we generally only raise a couple of hundred dollars. But it is important to THEM to have 100% participation (This message has been edited by Basementdweller)

Ya I am crabby, Had my meeting with the district committee last night.......New bodies, same old powerless do nothing attitude. NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO you can't do that. I am not allowed to take the Pack out of District or out of council to events any more. Really???? so how ya gonna enforce that one?????? Start denying my tour plans?????? The program we provide as a district is more than adequate for what cubs are supposed to be doing. They got wind I asked the DE to be sent to camp school, I was going to pay so it wasn't like I was asking for money. Oh well. NO NO NO what do you think your going to do with that. I give up

As a scouter who has been stepped on by fellow scouters who believe they are superior to me for far too long it ends. Payback.....No. But the OP mentioned he was doing the right thing by leaving that for someone else to sell till a long time after. I would make sure that it was covered much sooner in the sale. BTW had it out with the District Committee last night. New people same old rhetoric. I mentioned no FOS presentation this year......

Victims, yes Cricket was a victim Its not my fault. We didn't know. They left us.....They didn't train us. They They They They Honestly all their boys crossed over and they couldn't see it coming??????? I am guessing that the newbies didn't react till the train wreck stopped moving. Far as not kind.....that is a crock as well.......Everyone in the situation is to Blame, just not the folks that left. Victory......what the heck does that mean????? They simply provided a program for their sons and the Pack simply didn't fold. It isn't like they won a war or battle or even a soccer game. To me a smile on a boys face after a fun day should be enough reward. Not another ribbon or patch. My Scouts will not be victims, they will stand on their own two feet. They will not blame anyone.

JTE is kinda like teaching to the the test in the Public schools now. On paper the schools look like they are doing a great job, but the reality is far different. This reminds me of the Paper Eagle thing too. Cricket, In your years of scouting before you were abandon you didn't pick anything up??????? While you feel betrayed by their departure, you are to blame as well.

Geez folks. I looked monday night and all of the gals at the den meetings had their shirts tucked in. We got some Fat ones, we got the football player build ones and a super petite one. They all managed to tuck their shirt in. Just sayin. my shirt was untucked but I was putting troop gear away......

Ya know 55k would probably fund my Pack for 30 years or more..... Hey if they don't want it I, my Pack, would love to have it and I promise we would put on a hum-dinger of a program.

15-25 bucks for a mess kit??????? I have a whole 4 bucks in mine with metal silverware.

Oh fundraising turf wars.......It is very competitive. Several years ago selling in front of a suburban, yea it was way out of our neighborhood, Krogers, we had a scouter told us to get back on the other side of the outer belt were we belonged. He proceeded to call krogers manager and complain, the DE and complain......so now NO one can pan handle out in front of Krogers. We sell flower bulbs, so we went to a rich suburban neighborhood and was told by a scouter who answered the door that this was his neighborhood and we should immediately leave. He did call Law enforcement, but I had applied for the door to door sale permit and we were complaint. The officer was polite and checked our paperwork and thanked me and left. Last time we ever did that. Just don't need the hassle. Again, Our Troop, Crew and Packs only way to fund raise is to leave our neighborhoods and go to the suburbs. There are NO stores in our area, None, everything closed and moved. There are a lot of adults who are jerks, idiots and tools in scouting. Seems I meet my fair share, but I attribute it to the fact that I am involved in scouting 5 day a week, so my immersion factor is easily twice that of the typical scouter. What that fellow did was wrong. What I would do is next year, I would bring the entire troop or Pack and hit that neighborhood day 1. The reason I say the entire Pack or troop is that the entire neighborhood would be covered before they could react. Far as calling the CM, it is a wasted call.

ME LIKES A GAL IN UNIFORM.

Well I will tell you that if we did away with scout accounts fund raising for our group would come to a complete stop. While in theory my parents understand the importance, it is the entire going door to door or wasting an entire fall Weekend in front of a store. There must be a solution of some sort.