Mr. Boyce

Just some final thoughts here for Sven. (1) I served as a college student on the college curriculum committee, a senior college committee. I have to say that we two student representatives were unable to make much of a real contribution: we simply did not know much about higher education administration. Oh, we chipped in a few bits about students interests, but the people on the committee were teachers and we were pretty much just repeating what they already knew. The "youth participation" on the board was most likely prompted by the 60s student protests across the country. (2) In lower level organizations, one's simple desire to be on a board can count for a lot. The more important settings require more than just ambition for personal distinction. A good board not only has a purpose, but its membership provides different kinds of individual expertise to help reach this purpose. For this reason, many community boards will have attorneys, bankers, accountants, and so forth, so much of senior board work involves serving as counselor and providing generalized professional oversight to the management of the organization. (3) A person's desire for distinction can be very off-putting to the people around him. It can be perceived as an egotistical and shallow thing. I should know. . . at one time I thought being appointed a college trustee would be a great distinction, etc., but as I've gotten older, I realize that first and foremost, it's WORK. To really be a good college trustee would mean providing those things a college really needs. I have to say, the ancient Greeks and Romans are probably why I had a negative reaction to Hillary Clinton: one should be suspicious of someone who wants power so badly. (4) The older I get, the more I realize the importance of FOLLOWERSHIP. Everyone is raised to want to be a chief, which means a lot of nonsense when it comes to forming a team. I just joined a moderately prominent board: my first task for the next two years, really, will be to learn, not to yap, to get acquainted with the issues, and then see how I might best contribute. Good following and good listening traits mean a lot when working in a group. It's probably a mistake for someone to join an effective, working board with the intent to push one's individual agenda items. (5) Sven, your best bet is to put in six or eight years at the district level. Get to know informally everyone who means something to the work of the council. And then take it from there. In the "real world", the adult world, just wanting something matters for nothing. Everybody would like to be a senator, everybody would like to be a millionaire--so what?

Here's what I'm noticing. These boards are largely followed by grass-roots leaders, and the comments here mostly reflect this. I maintain that there IS a distinctive function that is largely being ignored here: executive councils connect the organization to the community, through generating good will throughout the community, by reaching opinion leaders with a positive message about scouting, and in the course of making the case for scouting, find financial support for scouting from non-scout sources across the community. Don't be too hasty about devaluing this role, even if the executive committee people have never camped a night out in a tent, or even been to the scout camp.

You know, really, the way to treat this thing is thusly: it's vastly better to be ASKED to be on the board, rather than strive to get yourself on it. Being asked to join gives you the right kind of credibility to other board members. It certainly shouldn't be considered like getting yourself elected patrol leader. .. or U.S. Senator. These things work better when you're WANTED, not when you push yourself into them. This means the board will have some respect for your skills and your suggestions and input.

I might be mistaken, but people correct me if I'm wrong. Would not the council executive already have a good grip on how council and district events are faring, in terms of popularity and appeal to scouts? I'm not sure that the board would benefit from hearing one young man's opinion on "what scouts think" as opposed to what council staff can report, what adult leaders say, etc., in other words, a broader spectrum of scout opinion. I would think the council executive already should have a more varied and deep communications pipeline. I'm also not sure whether the council executive board really should get into micromanaging events or even grassroots recruiting efforts. My sense is that in most cases, the executive board's contribution is not so much concern with ongoing program. . . as it is in generally making a positive case for boy scouting across the whole geography of the council.

Your long-term problem is planning. You need to get everybody together on an annual budget and include a plan for capital expenditure that all agree upon. This will get everyone on the right track toward spending down the money in a way that everyone agrees upon and that benefits the pack. My sense is that if you took some time, perhaps do a "retreat" on a Saturday to talk general direction, etc., you would find that there are some wise, strategic uses of your cash resource.

Svenzoid: You're sure determined to make the shoe fit! I saying that only partly humorously; it may be a sign of stubbornness. I've been on many community boards of directors. Contributing dollars and connections is often the chief thing that these organizations seriously need. There's absolutely nothing wrong with this: having a council executive board comprised of people with money and connections. Given your age (and perhaps your insistence here), I would suspect that you would not really be very happy if you actually were asked to serve on the board. Board work is group work; it requires an aptitude for following. . . not so much individual leadership. And yes, your age counts against you: most young people have yet to learn how organizations fit together; how budgets work; staff and management issues; general community considerations, etc. You would not really be able to much represent the community. I admire your energy and your dedication to scouting. This is valuable. You might turn over in your head a few ways to specifically volunteer at your council: why not undertake, for instance, a project to raise funds and build a new camp building?

Interesting to see the perspective taken by the 1929 Handbook for Scoutmasters: The question of government subsidy of the Boy Scout Movement has frequently arisen, and has found hearty advocates among some of the strongest supporters of the Boy Scout Movement. The attitude of the Executive Board is that any appropriation or subsidy made by the government for the benefit of the Boy Scout Movement would necessarily impose restrictions and limitations, and involve the organization in obligations to follow the dictates of the federal government even to the extent, possibly, of conflicting with the fundamental policies on which the Boy Scout Movement is organized. (p.539, Handbook for Scoutmasters)

GernBlansten: I agree with you wholeheartedly. For years, people in the auto industry have neglected to put together the right technologies; people in the energy industry have moved tepidly. The problems have always been foreseeable. Believe it or not, I'm optimistic that we can locate new and better energy sources. We may even, believe it or not, find some better alternative to the gasoline engine. And even better would be if we finally looked at the cards we are holding and said, "hey, just building roads for cars isn't going to solve our basic transportation needs." I am not a socialist or a liberal, but I am someone who believes large companies can be death to innovation, new technologies and new and better products.

I do not know if employees of the national organization read this forum. But I have read of the new shoulder pocket, for iPods, and when all is said and done, these detract from the scouting program. I'm in league with Richard Louv, of the Last Child in the Woods book fame, the efforts now being taken to expose children to the outdoors. Electronics take you away from the experience. In town, I'm not sure a leader would want the boys to be playing their iPods during a Court of Honor or meeting. Any thoughts why this shoulder pocket is so important?

If I were to design the boy scout uniform, it would pretty much be minimal. Take a pair of Dickies work pants, a Dickies work shirt, add some rank/insignia knots, a few identifying patches on the sleeves and be done with it. My inspiration? I remember being about 13 or 14, being in the woods with the 70's style uniform, and realizing that it's meant to be worn outdoors, not as a fancy billboard but as a practical shirt.

Based on the comments in this forum on the new uniform, apparently the national organization runs focus groups on the uniform. Perhaps the boys actually like the epaulets! Not disrespecting pest control technicians (God knows everybody needs them), but the Orkin man (and car valets) is about the only guy I run into who wears epaulets. Shows they're "official."

You know, I'm hardly anti-military, but I think the military look can be a real turn-off for many boys, as well as a lot of different kinds of people. My unit, when I was a boy, was more into being outdoors than doing inspections or parades and fussing over uniforms. That's just my take on it, though; I've seen troops very influenced by military style.

You know, at the scout level, this is a good opportunity to talk to the boys about hazing, why it's a bad thing. I don't think the tap-outs we had in 1977 or 78 were hazing. At least the guys administering it just did it firmly, no intent to harm or demean, etc. But for the ceremonies team, certainly it would let their advisor tell them what hazing is, and why it's a bad thing. An opportunity in life to do some teaching.

This can be a fun kind of thing. (Bear with me a bit if you live in the suburbs.) I tried one or two of the Official Scout Kits for these things. . . but realized really it's just a block of white pine with a hole bored down the middle. So I took a 2x4, cut it lengthwise, and began making my own little blocks of white pine with a 1/2 hole down the middle. You trace the outlines of what you want to carve, and get to carving! I had a really excellent scout carving knife set (they don't sell these anymore: looked like a utility knife but with a variety of blades you could place in it), and would sit on the back porch steps whittling one of these out every now and then. It was fun.

You know, I don't really have a problem with change. But usually you try to change things for the good. Here, the epaulets just seem to serve no purpose. People say they indicate if you're a scout. .. well, that's why scouts have green uniforms, not blue or forest green ones. (Not to sound too nutty, but I'm assuming cub scouts still wear blue, not scout green).

They just look overly fussy, and like something a non-scout teen would point and laugh at. I guess at the root of it, to me they look more "military" and "down market" than "outdoor conservation". They make the uniform stick out more, when in the general public. I'm glad to hear the etymology here (I think that's the word!). I once saw a couple of steel engraved portraits of Mexican Army and U.S. Army soldiers from the Mexican-American War era, and from what I remember, actual epaulets offered some protection against sword blows. Vestigial armor.

Not a fan at all of epaulettes. Or the titty-pocket look (the front pockets look like bellow pockets). I much like the color of the pants, and the cap's really good. One reason (among many: my scoutmaster resigning, other changes in the troop, high school and girl interests) I left scouting when I was 16 was because the uniform looked too militaristic. . . and also because the uniform looked like a great big billboard, with all the patches and stuff piled on. I guess this is where I'm coming from. Simple is good, in my book. I don't like a fussy, overbadged, badged up look.

I'm returning to scouting, having left as an Eagle scout in 1979. I deeply admire and respect the program, and I know, like many others here, that it's had a major formative impact on me. But looking at today's scout uniform, I just abhor the epaulets! They look like what the guy who parks your car wears, or the guy spraying for termites in your house, they look militaristic and uselessly so. Just no purpose. Pointless and goofy-looking. By the way, I also think the collar + neckerchief arrangement is a confusion of styles. It should be one or the other, not both at the same time. If there are genuine benefits to epaulets, kindly advise me. I've been out of the loop for a couple of decades or so.