Gone

What System do You Use? What System is Best? My crew is getting ready for Philmont next summer. Going the last week so water *should* be plenty being post-monsoon season. What our scouts asked me to post has to do was post a few questions for feedback: What water filtration systems have you used (brand, model, style)? Which filtration process is best (e.g., pump, gravity, other)? Do you use filtration only? Sterilization only? Combination of both? Any other considerations for buying a purification system you would recommend? Thanks in advance for your help.

@@Eagle94-A1 I've asked repeated for BSA's guidelines on recruiting from district and council; I have yet to see anything. In my area troops recruit from any pack they want. Some are "aligned" with a troop (e.g., troop and pack share the same CO) but we still send out invites to all packs for our open activities. Some troops treat a few packs as "feeder" packs, but when you go ask the packs how they fell all they say is, "We never see the troops until recruiting night." Our unit always supplies Den Chiefs, plans pack meetings, has open events for ALL Cubs (not just Webelos). We truly want to show we care about ALL packs. If you join us, great. If not, no problem. I just don't get the "this pack is ours" mentality that some troops have. I understand in some smaller areas there *is* more of an "aligned" relationship between packs and troops. It would help if BSA had some high-level guidelines on recruiting for troops. Of course, simply being friendly and open SHOULD be the key to solving any inter-troop issue. Sadly that is seldom the case.

@@Stosh I have seen a rise in such language in the professional environment, mostly from 20- and 30-somethings. During team calls (Fortune 100 company) they've dropped the f-bomb or worse, and frequently, to punctuate their point. Very sad. I can only imagine what it will be like in 15 years when these young scouts make it in to the work force.

This is exactly why I am so sour on district and council. They play favorites constantly, then they call our unit (since we are so strong and self-sufficient) to get us to plug holes in their program. Take, take, take and all they back room politics -- and dirty politics at that -- confirm why we stay away.

Well, then it's kinda tough to know what you mean when you say some language is considered appropriate depending on "who you are and where you grew up." Not buying this situational or culturally selective application of appropriate language. If you wouldn't say it in your house or worship, in front of your boss or in your kid's school then you know pretty much if it is appropriate or not, no matter who you are or where you grew up. That's just no excuse.

We were always taught to stay 200 feet or more away from the known high water mark of any stream bed. When that's not known, go 40 ft in gradient above the obvious high water mark of the stream bed. Edit: In case you're heading to Philmont any time soon, here's a good site that has the historic precip for the region by month. Helps to give you an idea regionally where the rain falls. That area has gotten a large amount or rain during monsoon season. Helps to understand how much rain we are talking about for flood potential. Figured this might help.

If they're swearing in front of the kids, you're darn tootin' parents should be limited/banned. Does not sound like they have the same problem you do. They have too many volunteers.

Such as? Exactly! Everyone knows what that's the substitute for. Had a Battlestar Gallactical fan use "frackin'" for a while. While I appreciate the geek in him the SPL told him even that was unacceptable.

Younger? Not necessarily. I know guys (in Scouting) in their 40s and 50s that build stuff like this professionally...and pretty slick stuff. Most of your creative guys in the gaming industry for the big games are over 35. BSA did not do everything they could have with this effort. In fact, many of the official suggestions sent to them about how to create such a product went unaddressed in this effort.

@@MattR in reading the various arguments I haven't seen anything that speaks specifically to Bears being attracted/not attracted to Deet or anything similar. At least nothing definitive. Sounds like something for Mythbustrrs.

Yes, but the federal government was not involved in this program.

BSA Censored. [super Soakers excluded as being too dangerous]

I have to shake my head when I hear about adults cursing. I get the hammer-on-the-toe occasional slip, but this sounds much more prevalent. That's an adult leadership issue. Our SM would have booted us to the curb had it happened more than once, period.

It appears to be teathered.

Sorry, but our council shooting sports lead confirms they can do archery at a professional facility. The matrix also says cubs cannot cook but we all know we let them.

For large bears we have our deterrent. Black bears its the spray. Since the boys wanted to "stay clean" and still stay eco-friendly they wanted to try this route. So far I am hearing baking soda for oral care, picaridin for insects, nothing for body odor. Anything for clean up (e.g. soap/suds)?

@@Waterplant my suggestions would be as follows: Suggest to the PLC that your troop adopt a policy that only registered scoutmasters can go on trips/camp outs. This way only those parents who truly want to be involved in scouting the way it is supposed to be (boys leading boys with adults around for safety) will show up. Suggest the PLC adopt a policy where boys are the leaders. Any communication to the troop comes through the youth leaders using the Patrol Method. SM has an issue (not dealing with health or safety) and he gives that issue to the SPL to deal with. The SPL meets with the PLs and they (the PLs) address the issue. For the cursing, the ONLY way for this to change is for the youth AND adult leaders to set the example. I would do the following: Sit down with the PLC. If they agree that this is a big issue then as a group you need to address it. PLs meet with their patrols and tell them cursing will no longer be tolerated. If someone curses they do KP or something. If it is persistent they miss a camp out. In our unit if you get brought in for disciplinary reasons you run the risk of missing our shooting sports camp out....no one wants to miss that. The SPL and PLs should sit down with the SM (and only the SM, no ASMs) and the Troop Committee Chair. Let them know you guys are handling the scout cursing issue, but THEY need to corral the adults. Any adult caught cursing should be excused from attending ANY event. If it is habitual then the SM and TC Chair need to address that parent's involvement in scouting. I hope this issue is not so bad you are losing scouts. If it is your valiant efforts to change things may not work if the problem is more institutional; meaning that it is so prevalent that no one really cares. To get this change to take place you need the "buy in" from the youth AND adult leaders. If they don't agree or don't help enforce things (be setting a good example AND enforcing the punishments) then you won't get anywhere.

Found this circular from NY on the uses of Deet and non-Deet products. Interesting the effect of Picaridin versus Deet. Also found this too. We use the Picaridin products (Sawyer for us) as it tends to not smell and we've found to be just as effective against insects.

We go there all the time climbing at Seneca. Never had a bear problem, but that was back in the 80s when bears were too busy doing other things; mostly chasing the frat boys out of the camp sites.

So this brings up an interesting point: How did you get the repellent smell of your skin to avoid being bear-bait at night? This is where I think the non-scented soap topic might come up.

Good question. There are a few categories to cover from the OP. Am looking for the Holy Grail products that might meet all of these. Looking for products that are: Biodegradable (Breaks down easily in natural environment using LNT guidelines) Eco-friendly (Think sun screen that won't kill coral reefs, soap that won't harm environment, etc.) Non-scented (In that it won't attract animals, if tested to confirm all the better) Effective (Must actually work for the purpose for which they are intended. No good if sunscreen does not work) For Example: The old Tom's Toothpaste was nature-friendly but leaves you tasting like a thin mint to bears. Ideally we'd want to identify an product that cleans teeth and does not attract Smokey the Bear. A second example would be soap that is biodegradable but does not clean well. (Note: Do NOT want to get in to the sanitize versus clean debate again. )

Our boys are making a list of no-smell items for a list they want to make available and keep current for other high adventure crews in our district. They have a good list of products we use regularly (e.g. soap, toothpaste, sunscreen, insect repellant, deodorant, etc). Items must be eco friendly, effective for the purpose designed and non-smellable. Please post the items you've used. Please try to post the brand name and, if you can, where you bought it. I suspect such a list may help others searching for such items. If you have a recommendation for other items not listed please feel free to add them.

Day 1 of fun in Europe (Kandersteg).

That was Jerry's fault for not taking care of his Saab, otherwise it would have worked.

@@Stosh is right. My dad was our TCC back in the day. We did newspapers in our area. Got the trailer (18 wheeler) and usually filled that thing to the end every month. Took it to the center and got our cash. According to my father we cleared $350/month when we filled the thing (after expenses). The trailer was donated and the driver was one of the dads who had a commercial license. Made enough to buy our own troop bus (Think Partridge Family but BSA green). With the cost of gas, prevalence/convenience of local recycling programs and limitations by recycling companies (only taking 1's and 2's instead of all plastics sorted) I suspect the net on such a program would be very, very small.