Gone

From what I understand it was a religious organization. The troop leaders and most of the scouts are not members of that organization but are the engine that have driven that unit for nearly 25 years. The CO, like most in that area, are CO's in name only. They do not really get involved in the unit. However, they are a bit more liberal in their view on gays than most other religious organizations in that area. As I understand it, the leaders are looking for another conservative organization in that town to charter a new unit but not necessarily in BSA. Am getting this from my cousin, so there may be some lost in translation.

I bring it back to membership because that is what drives the organization. There are two camps here. The first is the traditional BSA camp that believes that they can continue to prohibit gay leaders from joining and still maintain a decent membership size with roughly the same year on year drop in numbers (~3%) we have historically seen. Then there's the other camp that believe that gays should be allowed and that there's some pent up demand among those like-minded folks that will either a) offset those who will leave or b) will actually grow BSA because they feel there are more folks who support allowing gay leaders than there are folks who would leave for allowing gay leaders. BSA was not forced in to this decision. They could have stayed the course and they *may* have lost some sponsors and their membership *may* have dropped, but no more so than we have see pre-2013. Since 2013, we have seen that membership loss double and we have seen no stampede of sponsors back to BSA. And if BSA thinks sponsors are going to come back after going with the local option I think they are mistaken. Those sponsors who left because of the non-gay policy are NOT going to come back to BSA after they pass the local option. Why? Because BSA will be seen as still tacitly allowing non-gay units through the local option. Those sponsors that left want BSA to eliminate their non-gay policy. Going with the local option does not eliminate that issue, it merely moves it down to the local COs. Those sponsors that left cannot guarantee their money will not go to help those non-gay units, so they won't come back. Of course, this is all conjecture now. We will have to see how this plays out.

I have no doubt you see it that way. If you resigned to stand up for your convictions I suspect there might be a few narrow-minded people who saw you in the same light. I would at least respect you for standing up for what you believe in. I wish you thought enough of others to be equally as tolerant rather than demonstrating your disdain for those who oppose your viewpoint. Sad. I don't know, nor do I really care, how the press will handle this. I suspect the left will call them bigots, much like our poster above. I suspect the right will applaud them for leaving and sticking to their beliefs. What will be interesting is 1) how many leave and 2) how many join as a result of this decision.

@@jpc763 it does sound too good to be true. I would talk to the scouts and walk through what they did. If it sounds like they did not complete the requirements then follow the GTA and use the remedies they outline on how to address this situation. We had a similar experience with cooking at a "MB college". All was signed off without the MBC validating the work was done. We met with the scout and asked him to produce his documentation regarding all the menus and meals. He couldn't and agreed he just told the MBC he'd done the work, not bothering to realize that meals in question were also being applied to rank advancement and other badges.

No one is saying to summarily leave without confronting the situation and trying to resolve things. It seems that is exactly what the scout did and that the adult was pretty unreasonable. At some point you should look elsewhere when people of good faith cannot resolve their differences. Seems this MBC was being a pratt for no good reason. The life lesson of when to stop beating your head against the wall is ALSO a good lesson to learn; it avoids wasting time with people that have no intention of meeting you half way or being reasonable.

Just heard that the leadership of a unit in my cousin's district resigned en masse because of the BSA local option memo. Their CO held a pre-announcement vote and decided to allow gay adult leaders. The entire TC and scouter staff resigned, as did nearly all of the youth leaders. I assume this will hit the press at some point.

Re-read the OP. The kid only had a few months pass and seemed to do the work in question. The MBC did not seem to do the right thing and he was given the opportunity. On the face of it, the group advice seems sound....find a new MBC.

The desire to help comes from the parent. Often if the parent is a willing and helpful person the scout will be. All too often the correlation between parents who can't give a darn and scout that doesn't care is high. As we have seen a lot in scouting, it is the parents attitude that makes all the difference in the world.

Some municipalities will do mock drills for the younger kids if you ask. Some have even come to local troops who have asked for them. Worth asking.

This is great advice! Our town does them once a month and they do a great job. Have the troop get involved and it 1) helps your leaders and scouts understand how to put on such an event, and 2) it allows those scouts needing EPrep to get credit for attending said event.

There is no "time lapse" for MB requirements. He could have done it in 2009. As long as he's not yet 18 the prior work counts. Find another MBC.

We require all adults who camp with our unit to be registered with the unit, which means valid YPT. If we ever get "guests" (e.g., grandpa, uncle) they MUST complete the online YPT and provide a certificate. Never had anyone complain.

We had a few times when Scouts would not show up for service projects so we made them mandatory in order to attend certain events (e.g., shooting sports, go karts, etc.). After that we had much better turn out. Sadly, since the current rank advancement requirements only require 11 hours of service, many boys these days simply check the box and nothing more. We had this issue for about a year until we (the PLC) made service hours mandatory for certain events. That changed the mind set and lead to greater participation. Only had one adult bring up GTA. We (the PLC) noted that we were not adding to any rank or badge requirements, just putting a standard for participating in popular events.

I fail to see how ticking off a large percentage of the membership will stop the bleeding of membership. If anything, it will facilitate it. And I highly doubt there's some pent up demand from a group of folks who've been waiting for this change that will back fill those leaving. We all have "hardened positions". You have yours, I have mine. Let's not pretend one is better or more enlightened than the other. We all have ideals we "can't see past". That doesn't make any one group more right or wrong.

"Scouting is going to change very little"? Let's wait and see how many Scouts and Scouters we lose, shall we? We've been averaging 6+% losses since 2013. I am willing to bet that number doubles with this new change. The average person will not understand the BSA-speak of "local option". It is already being portrayed in the news that I have seen as "BSA allows gay leaders" and NOT as "Local units can elect to allow gay leaders or not".

You joined the grouping KNOWING of this policy!! I hope someone joins something you hold dear and totally changes it to something you can't abide by so you can walk a mile in our shoes.

How noble of you. Wish you felt the same about those who wanted to keep BSA the way it was. Funny how you won't impose your feelings on your children or grandchildren, but you have no issue doing it to strangers working in the same organization as you.

Did the AT over three seasons a while back. I highly recommend it.

The difference being now my CO takes the liability and not the cowards in Dallas. So what exactly does national, council,and district do for us besides make our lives more and more difficult. Thankfully my work in BSA is almost done. Sadly, my grandchildren won't be participating in this once noble organization. Pathetic.

Wary or not, if the person is declined membership there goes your lawsuit.

Odd, that describes the people that have been pushing BSA to make this change perfectly.

Seriously? One gay person wants to join my unit. Our CO says they don't allows gays. There's your standing.

Unless they go to summer camp. My CO is NOT going to change unless they get sued. How long until that happens. Our entire SM corps has said they will leave if that happens. If anyone thinks this will increase scouting membership they're deluded. I'll bet we see 15% losses year on year for a long while.

Anything. It's the thought. Means more if the boys make it. I have a few sides I wear done by scouts. Means more than anything the adults could give me.

Except that it does when you open scouts up like has been done. and this will continue to happen.