moosetracker

CC.. you trust the parent who can not let their child contact with anyone adult or child, other then themselves until their 18th birthday (and beyond) to be raising their child right.. Hopefully you may have the chance to hire them someday and have them work for you. I will trust any child homeschooled by parents who allow their child to become enrolled in art classes, writing classes, sports and scouts and other community activities. Whether the parent, like sasha, enrolls them for the expirence, or you enroll them for the socialization, or you enroll them to enrich their lives.. Those are the home schooled children, I would be happy to hire.. They wont have to call mommy for advice on every little thing.. I wont have mommy calling me, because I gave their child a project to challenging for them.

I would work to get the parents in your troop in check.. Not having the SM or CC on your side may hurt.. Don't know if this is something the COR can get involved with, as it should be nipped in the butt before getting to them.. But, I would be really surprised if by next year, you do not find the camp rules beefed up.. The CD maybe wasn't strong enough to just say "NO, way".. "But, he really did not want it, and these parents found a technicality in the way their rules were written. I would thing it will be brought to the councils attention, and the camp fixes the wording.. Especially if 5year senses a battle lost due to the attitude of the SM, CC and parents and did a well formed letter to them, stating the future intent of parents in his troop if they do not beef up the rules.(This message has been edited by moosetracker)

OK, experience is good too.. Experience is still learning from different people, as the parent isn't the most knowledgeable or best qualified to teach all subject.. It means trusting other adults with that knowledge to offer the experience, or working as one of the adults with the help of other adults to bring about the best experience.. But, unless your fabulously wealthy it means signing them up for a community based program, rather than hiring a exclusive tutor.. Allowing them to interact with others rather then just their parents.

Sorry! Most likely they wont prep you for another interview.. People want you to be honest and yourself during an interview, not trying to put on a role.. It could be nothing to do with you anyway. Someone else just may have more job experience in areas they are looking for strengths in. Each interview improves your skills.. I know you felt you did alot better on this one, then the last one. chin up. If you are not stuck to a specific area and willing to travel, which it sounded like you were not.. DE's come and go, just keep your resumes out in circulation. Something else will come up.

twocubdad - what is "provisionally chartered" exactly?

Never said Religion was the source of all our troubles, just no better then any other grouping of humanity.. The belief of many religions that their faith is the only people who will go to heaven, while all others will parish in either pergatory or hell, is no better then, "My country's better then your country".

Good luck to you. I am unsure if you just overheard the other canidates talking privately, or if what he said was to a wide group. If privately, it just might be two guys talking about things they have in common to while away the time..

Like bathroom stalls, women are use to seperated showers, not gang showers.. Just a gender thing.. Most health clubs do the same thing, you may have gang showers for guys (or not) but the women will have seprate showers. HS was a gang shower though. Few girls took one.

If this is a one time occurance, that is all it might be. You have this year to watch him before he goes to BS, but then for a while the advice Turtle recomends is pretty good. My son did sleep walking only once when he was probably about 10.. He was at home, went from his upstairs bedroom, downstairs, opened the door outside.. And walked over to our neighbors house.. Luckily they were out in the garage and saw him wandering around. Never happened again.. I think I too once sleepwalked when I was young, the dream was vivid, I remember how hard it was to get to the side door of the house, I remember working hard to open the door, then something on the other side, bursted through throwing me back.. I really don't know what happen that night, but when I woke up the side door that I know was locked when I went to bed was standing wide open.. Some people are prone to sleepwalking alot.. Others have a once in a lifetime occurance.

Hey Suzy !! Did not know you were still around, figured you left us a while back to our internal scuffles.. So did provisional with a different council camp pan out for you? If you find you have to wait for a crossover if Feb.. It would not hurt to sign up with a good troop until then. If your other troop was poorly run, it would be benificial for both the adults and the scouts to take the intermediate time to learn from a well running troop the right way to do things.. Just let them know up front your intentions are short term. If your new troop is a distance from them, then they should be happy to help start up a new troop and help give you some terrific ideas.. The boys can learn what the patrol method is all about from some older scouts, so that when you start your troop, they will then be the older scouts to pass on the information.

As I stated there are hostilities for several reasons in all conflict. Does not mean that the Catholic and the Protestants did not divide themselves along religious lines.. That is like saying Politics join people together in love and harmony.. Why Republicans don't dislike Democrats because they are Democrats.. There is just the pesky irritating things they keep doing.. Like trying to insist on equality for all, and then there is that matter of ObamaCare.. Blah.. Blah.. Blah.. But really politics is just a way that we can all come together peacefully.. Religion is used to make you feel you have something in common with the group you tie to.. It is a way to look at all others that are not within your group as different then you. You might call truces with some religions that are similar to yours, or in fighting something larger.. Like America fought along with England and France against Germany.. You may fight together against someone taking pray out of public meetings.. You may argue about petty things, like who gets to put up their holiday decorations in the town park.. Or you may have huge whooping fights (like in Ireland.).. Or someone who is not a religion may just see your religious group as a problem needing eradication, like with Hitler.. So you didn't discuss why if religion brings everyone together, there was as much taboo about interfaith marriage as there was about interracial marriage.. Both of those seem to be about the same with the walls crumbling on those beliefs.. Religion (or lack of Religion), is something that defines you to a group. We can choose to get along with other groups or we can choose not to. And who our friends are today, could become our enemies tomorrow. (Which is a reason we should not inter-marry.. You may wake up tomorrow next to your enemy!)

Ireland - Catholic / Protestant battle.. Yes it is about class as well as religion, but religion became a big part of telling the superior from the inferior, and was used to sow prejudice and mistrust.. Battle in Isreal because Jews were given land, and Arabs were uprooted.. Maybe a one-sided war on religion but still it was the Jews that were given the land. Hitlers genocide of Jews.. Yes it wasn't only Jews, Yes Hitler was a nutcase.. But Jews were a target for basically being Jewish. War is always about a mish mash of several reasons for war, but that doesn't mean that religion does not take a major role in alot of the battles.. If nothing else, then to say.. God is on our side, the other side is Godless.. At the very least, you can not state that is the religion is the only thing that has ever brought people together.. Let's not look at war.. Let's look at the fact it has only been in recent decades of when it was to marry people of different faiths, and some people who are serious about their faith will still frown on it. Faith pulls groups of people within the faith together, and seperates them from those of different faiths.. As does any ot the other things mentioned (racial/ethnic/tribal/political/economic). It is just another tool used to identify differences about each other, and label yourself as superior to someone else..

(to MikeAZ & NJ's discussion about dividing up the BSA assets into two different groups. seems you guys have been busy bickering about other things as I was authoring my masterpiece..) I prefer James Turleys method (the national board member) who stated that he "will work from within to seek a change" At least we should hold out until May 2013, when a committee will make a report, about making it the right of the CO to determine if for themselves about homosexuals in leadership roles. But, if AZMike (an others on his side of the arguement) want to not spend the time to work things out though we certainly are trying and trying to do so... Well, then NJCubScouter idea of a divorce may be necessary.. But, really NJ! 30% !!! You are selling all our years of sweat and tears and love and devotion too short.. After all we are the party trying to work things out.. And... SOB!!! They just wont try to work things out.. SOB !!! It isn't our fault.. It really isn't.. They are just hard hearted and uncaring.. SOB !!! sniffle, sniffle.. I think we have a case to take BSA to the cleaners! And if I dont get a fair share, I will just have to stay around and continue to harp on BSA until they change.. About public prayer.. I am fine with someone doing a sunrise service in the park, or a ceremony of Hope and prayer at a public playground where a child went missing.. You announce the reason for the meeting will be religious and people can attend or not.. But, public prayer at a graduation or a town meeting I can see as being different.. People were told the gathering was for something else, and you will have a mix of people coming for the overall purpose of gathering, some who are fine with the prayer, some who are religious but not comfortable with YOUR type of prayer, some who are uncomfortable with any type of prayer.. If I went to a course on photography, I would not like the teacher spending class time about her feeling on Obamacare.. If I went with my child to a book signing of my childs favorite author, I would not be happy that while promoting her new book BoBo the Clown they do a speech about animal cruelty and go into things that make my child squirm.. Free speech does not mean you get to talk about what you want to talk about with a group of people your gathered by promoting it is for a different event. (This message has been edited by moosetracker)

Ooooh.. One kid forgot his stinky sneakers in my trunk once.. I could smell them in the front seat of the car... I returned his missing sneakers pronto even though we don't live anywhere close to them.

And one very smelly kid!! Wheew.. open those car windows!

I had heard something of this yesterday, but they were not releasing the names as of yet.. The other article said that the car with the scouts was the one who crossed the lane into a mobile home.. One child from the mobile home also died, as well as the others in the mobile home were in critical condition. All in the car with the scouts died, the SM was the only one not deceased at the scene of the accident, but died shortly after.

Quick, someone please catch me!! I believe I just fainted over the fact BD just paid compliments to his councils camp!!! To anything about his council.. So is it under new management or what?

I would accept lowering the 5 count rule to get to get a new unit started.. It is above board, no one is doing creative accounting for it.. Troop membership is 2, and 5 count rule is waved in the first year to get the unit started.. I don't doubt your 2 scouts you sat for hours to recruit were not hard work, and valid work.. Nor that keeping the membership numbers at least equal to last year (forget increased by x percent over last years numbers) has become impossible.. I also feel for DE's who may suffer in their paycheck, or have their jobs threatened.. But, your DE is not in the majority to be down in membership count, and although National may not like the numbers as it not only does it affect their donation dollars, it points to the fact that their program is no longer working.. Now we can argue it is because of : The increase in the selection of children programs are giving scouts difficult competition. The weakening of the program to be less on scout craft, and more about passing out rewards. Has kids finding the program not challenging or worthy enough. Not allowing in the 3 G's gays, godless, girls is hurting the numbers (or limiting the pool of potential recruits). There are fewer adults willing to volunteer their time, which causes poor program. The adults are not trained enough, which causes poor program or 100 other reasons.. Fact is, National just has to look at reality, and bite the bullet, and stop blameing the DE's for not being able to do the impossible.. Also to stop analyzing and tinkering from up high in their ivory towers. They need to be scared enough to come down to earth to interact with the volunteers, and get a reality check. Padding numbers allows them to continue to stay up in their ivory towers patting themselves on the back about how marvelous they are.

Strange, both your article and mine come from the atheist viewpoint.. Yours tries to show that the muslims dislike non-muslims and so must learn to "get along", while I am sure there may be a few with this attitude, I have a feeling the attitude of one or two are being held up to promote the atheist's cause as right.. Mine shows the athiest disdain for anything religious, and that religion in their opinion is "child abuse", so they want to give anyone special consideration if it deals with their faith. http://furiouspurpose.me/should-school-children-brought-up-as-muslims-get-time-and-a-room-to-pray-in-public-schools/

OK. Merlin, I will retract that statement.. I read an article a while ago.. When I went in search of it, I found that is was comments about court cases in Germany and Toronto Canada.. As of yet, I don't see atheist protesting against Muslim children using an empty classroom at recess or lunch to quietly do their daily prayers. I will state that the atheist in the other countries are wrong, when the children are using their own free time, and doing their prayer in private.. I just hope that this battle does not reach the USA.. NJCubScouter - Yes the Spammer definitely used some search engine to seek out the words he was looking for.. Right words, but absolutely no comprehension that we do not individual do our own background check, so don't care what is used. They have probably left their spam messages on forums protesting the intrusiveness of background checks, riling the natives so to speak.

SP - I don't doubt you work hard to get in new members the right way. I know you work hard, and have done great things in your district.. Does not mean that in the end if your DE is low on his expected percentages, that padding the numbers with boys who will never be scouts is the right thing to do.. You would not be doing it for the boy, you signed up, you would be doing it to get your DE his pay raise.. Likewise, a unit doing the same thing so that they can have a troop of 2 boys, are not doing it for the 3 out-of-state boys they sign up.. They aren't even doing it for the 2 boys in the program, as a troop of 2 is not a troop the 2 boys can benefit from.. They are doing it to cheat the system, and get registered. I am not a DE, so I am not privileged to all the rules & regs the DEs may have before them.. Perhaps you found a loophole to the definition of a paper scout.Perhaps you have the DE's rules of conduct, and it has a specific definition to what a paper scout is.. I don't have privie to the rule don't even know that one exists at all. Just know DE's will be fired over it. What I do know is the intent of the rules.. 5 scouts in a unit is because you do not have a healthy program with fewer.. Finding scouts (real or not) to sign up that will never be a member of the troop is skirting the intent of the rule for self-gain.. If a DE is padding his recruitment numbers with scouts (real or not) who will never be a scout, then again they are looking for loopholes around the intent of requirement, in order to get a pay raise or promotion. Sometimes National though is just as bad, sometimes they frown on it, and fire people. Other times they ignore it, because good head counts means more donation money.. Still even if National is willing to ignore it, for self gain.. Does not make it ethically right. There are such things as ethics, and ethics do not need to have every way of breaking ethics written down in a book, or it's against the law.. It just has to say that finding a loop hole and using it for self gain, is wrong.. Depending on how ethical your company is, you can be fired over it.. Whether the exact thing you do that is a lack of ethics is thought of and written specifically down or not. If not fired, you can seriously loose respect and trust among your colleague for a lack of ethics.. The bankers put this whole country in a recession due to loopholes they found in order to make money for themselves.. Doesnt mean that the public is patting them on the back and saying.. We support you, because there was no specific rule against what you did. You found a way to line your own pockets at the expense of others. It was not your fault you found a loophole and took it for self gain. (This message has been edited by moosetracker)

No, but signing up boys you will never see in your unit, never intend to see in your unit, are boys that are only on paper.. ie.. paper scouts.. Doesn't matter how you got them, they are falsly signed up, in order to bump the numbers.. So glad you are not the membership chair in my district.. That way these phantom scouts you sign up all over the country don't fall off the books in the thousands.. Don't know about a rule, but I know we had a DE fired over this issue. Good enough for me to say someone frowns upon these type of things when they come to the notice of someone who cares to do things the right way. The other example I gave were not paper scouts, they were boys who would be given the scouting program, only they would be signed up under the wrong council.. Still it was frowned upon, and both councils said "NO".

Well if you need rules rather then simply doing the honerable thing.. We just had a poster, who wanted to change councils.. Found a CO in the new council, but didn't plan on using them, instead she planned to hold the meetings in her old council and recruit the kids from her old council.. Both new and old councils said it was against the rules.. Some of these little known rules are not posted, but they are there..

While I will agree with Merlyn on removing a prayer in a public school assembly, Just understand Merlyn, this is the changes you are pulling that will keep you out of Scouting, and if ever a local option, will keep you out of many CO's units.. They will not let "general" public, hurt their missions. I will side with SP, that Athiest have been sticking their nose into silencing free religion of school children in another matter.. What difference does it make to an atheist child if a muslim child goes into a private room for whatever praying they feel the need to do at certain times of the day?.. If they are not doing it in the classroom, and not asking all people to follow tradition, and they are privately going off to do their thing, what buisness is it of the athiest?.. It's like trying to pass rules that no child can get permission to leave the classroom to pee.. Respecting everyones beliefs are not happening here.. The Athiest are instead trying to kill the religious rights of muslim children.

SP.. If the troop is in New York and the boys are in California, then real boy or not, that boy is not a member of that troop unless the parents are fabulously wealthy and fly them in every week. A real boy or not, if they sign up with the troop and the boy knowing they have no intention to be a member of the troop and it is just to boost the number count.. It is dishonest. Oh sure they may help out on one or two community projects as a scout.. But, most likely still work at those project in the shadows of their parents influence.. You can do home schooling to enhance your Childs experience in the world by getting them involved in various community activities, like scouting in a troop, Karate in a Karate school, Art at a local art school.. Or you can use home schooling to control your childrens every waking hour, read up on scouting and run your own program, learn something about Karate and teach your child yourself, try to teach your child your own limited knowledge of Art.. Holding your private Karate and art out in a park, with a parent hovering is not socialization. Nor is doing community service right next to your parents side. Why dont you look at all the other articles that came up with your suggested google search, rather then finding searching for one small article that has some notion that children should learn to be adults as soon as they learn to walk, and skip childhood all together. PS..SuzyBullett - if you are still looking in, sorry your thread has been hijacked so that we can argue over something else, not related.. Sorry, but if you want to hang around, get use to it. (This message has been edited by moosetracker)